Why I feel like playing remastered D3?

General Discussion PC
21

How anyone thinks this game plays like D3 I have no idea. I liked D3 a lot, of all the games I played in my life D3 is top 3 among hours played, behind WoW and D2. Having played D4 for an unreasonable amount of time in the last 2 weeks, enough that I understand the game down to the finer mechanics, it has very little in common with Diablo 3.

I wish it was more like Diablo 3.

Diablo 3 has

  1. Better social features and group finding, (better achievement tracking/clans).
  2. D3 Rifts are much better than D4 dungeons, so much it’s embarassing.
  3. Far more quality of life built into it
  4. More freedom of choice among skills
  5. More build diversity through sets and legendary gems
  6. Better balance
  7. Much more visible and predictable monster abilities and affixes
  8. Much better balanced monster abilities/crowd control
  9. Much better user interface, because not designed originally for console
  10. Slightly faster combat, for now.
  11. Much less complex gearing/stats

D3 is a single player game in a single player world with set pieces and procedurally generated maps. D4 is a single player game in a multiplayer open world, with a variety of activities going on, like a theme park MMO in a single player game but with other players around in some weird blend of a pseudo multiplayer game.

Aside from both having the name Diablo and both being ARPG’s the games are entirely different. D4 takes more from Path of Exile and Lost Ark than it does from D3.

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22

the gameplay is literally the same. the skillt ree is the same, generator / spender is the same. same fight (cc enemy or be immune and instagib enemies or u get cc and oneshot by them), same generic items, same generic dungeons, same ridicoulus progression, like u start with normal numbers and all, all of a sudden we are back to 100001010 dmg and 109101001 gold and so on. but ye its strange that they took all of d3 systems and even made them worse, e.g.: rifts → NM dungeons, crafting → nearly no crafting besides less gems, sigils, legendaries. even the legendarys are the same (with the craziest been → no longer flies but rotates around you lol). i dont understand this, really.

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D3 gameplay is not the same as D4. D3 is lighter, less weighty, there is more animation time before for abilities in D4 and to top it off many of the abilities play completely differently. Hota in D3 and D4 even feel different and they are the same ability, Whirlwind in D3 and D4 also feel different.

Rend in D3 and D4 feel completely different. Just using Barbarian like for like comparisons they are nothing alike. God I wish D4 Frenzy felt like it did in D3 because then it would be good, they are so different.

Diablo 3 doesn’t have a skill tree, it literally has a bunch of skills in a book that you choose any 6 abilities to put on your bars. It has that and a paragon board which is a simple stat boost, while D4 has complex varying paragon boards with glyphs and bonuses for different stats which you have to build yourself.

It couldn’t be any more different.

There is a builder/spender - There is nothing wrong with this system, nor is it in any way at all unique to or taken from Diablo 3.

Diablo 4 is nothing like D3 in this respect. D4 is full of unavoidable CC, it’s bad. D3 almost everything is avoidable, almost every situation where you got yourself killed or stuck in CC is because you made an obvious mistake.

This is where D4 really is bad.
D3 was absolutely fantastic at this, the best in the ARPG genre.

The items and itemisation system are completely different, almost nothing is shared between D3 and D4. D3 was much more simplistic and had a simple formula, where as D4 has a lot of complexity because of the massive list of different damage modifiers that can be used situationally or for different builds.

D4 itemisation is overcomplex and convoluted, but it has massive potential where D3 originally took too much from the World of Warcraft formula, where items were extremely simple and it took them until ROS to add some diversity.

They are worlds apart.

D4 dungeons are nothing like D3, D3 rifts were far better. D4 dungeons are a chore and would be better if they were more like D3 or D2.

Well thats a point of preference, I have friends messaging me playing the game who liked Diablo 3 saying they are bored of D4 because it’s too slow paced and I have to tell them “hey it gets better at high level”.

What you think is a bad thing (that is strong power progression, fast gameplay) is generally an indicator of what people who play a ARPG’s a lot want. The slow paced gameplay that some people praised in the early game is precisely what a lot of people disliked coming from Path of Exile or D3.

D3 and D4 are completely different games, the things they do have in common are somehow a criticism when we are playing the same genre. At some point it’s like complaining that 2 call of duty games both have guns.

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bro gameplay is the same, ok d4 has more weight but it feels the same for me. if i ww in d3 or d4 same man, if i frost nova, same, ok d4 looks more darker but thats it.
and the skilltree is the same, yes d3 has no skilltree, but d4 does not have one really, its just an illusion, its the d3 skillsystem but in a linear progression
you cant be real if you think paragonboard is COMPLEX ?? you have random lame stats as 5 dex 5 int until one RARE node. And given that alle the boards are designed with an idea in their head, you most of the time do not have real freedom to choose which route + what glyph u are insterting, because there most likely is a OBVIOUS optimal way.
ye generator spender not unique ? then tell me one other arpg besides d3 with this design :slight_smile: go man gl.
Nah man, when d3 came out, there also where unavoidable dmg or cc, not to the extend as in d4 where the mobs even dont have an animation and oneshot u in NM 60 dungeons, but ye, still the same meta, e.g.: as sorc in d3 u jump in an perma stun/cc/perma invul and kill enemies (high rift), in d4 same, you jump in cc and be immune or you get oneshot. the meta feels the same for me. its not like lost ark for example. and not like poe because poe has way way less cc.
And again with items, it just looks like you have more stats, but in reality you dont, could just be flat dmg increase than this pseudo complex thing with to frozen, to slowed, to distant, to close, like wtf, but ye, if i dont want to give players real freedom and dont want to test numbers, i would create this system as well. be like: Ok guys, this item gives 150% more dmg, but that would just be boring, so how can we make it pseudocomplex? well, just divide those 150% (max power) through random affixes ? so we got 43% dmg to slowed, 67% to close enemy, 25% to vulnerable, 15% frost dmg. WOW GENIOUS, NOW YOU THINK YOU HAVE A CHOICE BUT I STILL CAN BALANCE WITH EASY 150% more dmg, yay, eaaaasyyyyy and “Bigbazz” will call it complex, deep and situational, when in reality its just super lazy.
Last point to slowness, yes it is indeed a prefereance. I like it more like lost ark, with attacks to evade, this d2 poe, d3, d4 combat is outdated in my opinion. people want to accomplish things, and you cant accomplish things if powerspike is too far off. For example, no PLAYERSKILL will carry your lvl 75 char trough uber lillith. Because there difference in powerspike is TOO much and the combat is not COMPLEX enough to be able to avoid every attack (besides elias capstone, this fight on lvl 53 was like a good experience). And if speed is ur assumption, then you are wrong in d4. it takes you the same time as lvl 10 for a bear then as lvl 40, and now even after 80 its the same. you dont see and feel that you deal the same PERCENTAGE OF DAMAGE ? for me as a iceshard sorc, its the same (outside of nova, burning enemy, stunned enemys…) it takes me two shots of ice shards vs bear on lvl 15, 30, 50, 70, 85. so where is my progression of faster gameplay ? but as stated above, i think this kind of combat is so outdated anyways and does not live to todays standard. lost ark showed how to put the ACTION into an argp again when it came to bosses. well same genre does not mean REALLY SAME FEEL. or you think cod, cs, battlefield, quake, unreal tournament are the same because all are shooters? They differ VERY MUCH from each other, otherwise they would not be popular (or do you remember one of the 10 cod clones?). But each game did something to FEEL different. This feel is nonexistant in d4, as its too much d3.

edit: sorry for writing like a teenager, adhs+small typing window killing my thoughts lol

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It is complex, different glyphs work differently in different glyph nodes so you prioritise which boards to choose and which glyphs you want stronger based on your build. You also choose boards based on what you want to specialise in.

For example I might take disembowel for a bleed build or for any build to lower CD’s in nightmare dungeons. But I might be running a perma berserking uptime setup and go for Ire, which increases berserk damage and that might be better for bosses.

I might dodge the elite damage nodes to go for better overall clear speed, but I could instead take them if I was focusing on a build to kill Uber Lilith for example. And those simple dex/willpower/str/int nodes all influence the power of the build like aiming for more dex to enable the dex based bonuses on rare nodes, or for example pumping glyph bonuses within radius.

There is a tonne of complexity in this system, there is a tonne of room to optimise around a more tailored character. How you can compare this to D3 is mind boggling, in D3 you just fill out the bonuses to 800 and then add 5 stat every level forever, there is no customisation or tailoring at all in D3.

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as i said before, its not complex, it just gives you the illusion of complex and freedom.
what you mean with different glyphs work different in nodes? all my glyphs are the same, does not matter in which board i put them in. they just need different stats to activate / give more bonus but one glyph NEVER change in functionality? its just like a puzzle where you figure out where to spend the least amount of points to get the most of the bonuses. i seen puzzles for 12 years old that are more complex.
and i think your theory there is nice in theory, but in praxis its more black and white, you often DO NOT have a choice, because there is optimal choices, boards dont complement each other ENOUGH to really have a choice. for example as a wizard, no matter which spec i use, i always have to take the dmg to burning, otherwise i gimp myself, because talent tree + paragon dont offer a substitute for it because of the limited amount of passives. so it does not matter if i play frost, fire or lightning sorc, i always take the burning passive ( gives huge crit dmg multiplyer) this forces me to use 1 firespell (which is firebolt as enchantment, because rest sucks and we are LIMITED to a certain amount of spells so you take this passive). which then forces me to the fire paragon. this is just an illusion of choice, same goes for a majority of spells and even itemisation.
if i apply your logic to d3, then you had COUNTLESS of choices. Like you level up and u had (at least in the beginning) 5 choices to make, do i get 0.1 crit first ? or 0.1 crit dmg ? or do i get 0.5 AOE dmg ? or 0.1 attackspeed first. this times 4. so you had BAZILLION choices to make (in theory). as we both know, this was not a choice the player made, it was more dictated by your build. and its the very very same for paragons, just hidden more cleverly…

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Each node has different surrounded stats that support certain glyphs, so you might have for example 7 dexterity nodes in range, that means you can tailor boards and glyph placement to strengthen some glyphs over others.

And like I said, the boards I’d choose would be different for killing lillith vs clearing a nightmare dungeon. For speed clearing lower nightmare dungeons I could run a different setup again.

There is capability to tailor your approach. You’re talking about puzzles as if this is meant to be a chess game, it’s not, it’s meant to give you some freedom which is a universe apart from what D3 offered. Sitting there raising the bar for your expectations just so you can remain negative is a bit silly, if it was as complex as you’re seemingly wanting it would be outright bad.

It’s already far too complex for the average gamer, it’s excessive already. Nobody is saying it’s perfect, the game literally came out and is 18 months away from being good.

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but the build dictates your paragonboards. so you have no choice and no freedom ? Some things work some not, so there is a fixed determinition and a best solution or you dont think so ? And because of they glyphs working like you said, you have less freedom than you think. i dont know man, for me its not really complex or deep. Just illusion. If you think its complex and deep then well, kinda good for you i guess. gl with the illusion of choice ?

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There is always a best solution for a task, there is no getting around this. Are you asking the impossible of these paragon boards? The intention isn’t what you think it is, the intention is to tailor to a playstyle.

If you want to kill Lilith, the Paragon board choice is not the same as if you want to clear high Nightmare dungeons, which is not the same as if you want to clear low Nightmare dungeons, but if you want to do all 3 you’d take a different path all of the above to balance it.

This is great, what you seem to be expecting is a puzzle without an answer, which is honestly just dumb given the purpose of these boards, it’s not meant to be a riddle.

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ok then tell me, how does the paragon board CHANGE my playstyle. Because it basically DOES NOTHING besides stat increase? And your example is tied to builds NOT paragon. Because paragon are static sheet that does nothing besides adding values. Are you that blind ? Paid actor at its best, trying to convince people that paragonboard is somehow playstyle altering… same lie you said before when you said glyphs are changing which they are not, just basic boring stat increase. I remember interview with “ah you dont want trees like in poe, just random +10 int until a good node, thats boring”. now we got +5 and 7 stats to even LESS exciting nodes (+10% non-physical dmg, +10% burning, yada yada yada)

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Blizz really should really pay more smarter people to defend their game in the forums. You and NIDCLXVI both are just pathetic…

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Paragon isn’t meant to change your playstyle, the skill tree is. The paragon is a power tailoring, it’s like tuning a car for a circuit, you’re changing engine maps, roll bars and suspension setup.

The skill tree and your legendaries change your playstyle. Paragon has a minimal effect like for example Exploit or Disembowel glyphs or the Warbringer Legendary node, but the purpose isn’t to change how you play, it’s to optimise your build around a specific goal.

When it gets to this point you’ve really lost it, you can’t win the argument so you resort to insulting me. Who is really pathetic here?

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Didnt you just said “Diablo 3 doesn’t have a skill tree, it literally has a bunch of skills in a book that you choose any 6 abilities to put on your bars. It has that and a paragon board which is a simple stat boost, while D4 has complex varying paragon boards with glyphs and bonuses for different stats which you have to build yourself.”
COMPLEX VARYING Paragon boards? And
“It is complex, different glyphs work differently in different glyph nodes so you prioritise which boards to choose and which glyphs you want stronger based on your build. You also choose boards based on what you want to specialise in.” And “There is a tonne of complexity in this system, there is a tonne of room to optimise around a more tailored character.” ?
And i said no, its just illusion because the build DICTATES your paragon. you have nearly no other choice (bsides gimping urself) + glyphs are static sheet that doe nothing but stat increase. Its just D3 but with better package to fool the avg person (like you). Nothing more. I hope you get paid enough to work there. Do something usefull and open a changerequest, Paragonboard reset button + if you want to break a chain from paragonpoints give visuell error with highlights the node that blocks removing + give ability to remove nodes until point x. THANKS AND BYE

1 Like
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dont reply, just work in silent bro thanks man

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Everything you just said shows you did not have the reading comprehension to understand what I was saying, or you’re too red misted to even have the ability to comprehend.

There is only so far I am willing to rewrite the same thing before I get bored of you misunderstanding and then replying with a big block of text and misspelled words.

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i just quote you, you said stoopid things. and yes sorry for my grammar, the most interesting thing about my post. Vielleicht schreib ich es auf deutsch damit ich weniger Fehler mache? Ou préférez-vous le français? Español también funcionaría. Ali pa vam ponujam svoj materni jezik. Brez težav. Paid actor

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You quoted me and showed you don’t understand English reading comprehension, yes that is true. If you can’t communicate in the language, don’t sit there with confidence talking about a topic, you literally did not understand what was written in the post.

I don’t care if you’re French, Indian or Japanese, go argue with French people if you can’t communicate in English.

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all you said is just wrong. Its just D3 Paragon levels with illusion of freedom + some milestone nodes. End of story, you cant see it and u think glyphs changing on different boards, maybe go read again what they do. YOUR QUOTE: “It is complex, different glyphs work differently in different glyph nodes so you prioritise which boards to choose and which glyphs you want stronger based on your build.” They work the same in every boards bro. they always do the same and need the same stats, only the board varys in available stats. and as the slots are fixed, the glyphs are most likely fixed too. So for the avg player there is the illusion of choice. gl with that mr. paid actor

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There’s no similarity, it’s more like D2 and broken WOW. D3 was better in many aspects.

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did u even looked at the paragon board? every glyph has the same icon. HOW MAN ? HOW CAN THIS GO LIVE? Is this the cooperate design for glyphs or what is this shit. since when would a normal thinking designer or dev use the SAME ICON FOR DIFFERENT THINGS. BEYOND APE INTELLIGENCE!

1 Like