Baine Rescue Cinematic


#265

This is probably an appeal to motive, but it seems to me that the main proponents for the story beat to be “Sylvanas’s master plan in bringing everyone together against N’zoth” want to be vindicated in believing in her character


#266

Seems pretty desperate at this point.

Like, we even got some of the characters actual thoughts in the novels. And there’s some major 404 error when it comes to that sort of motive.

The way I see it, believing in a character is an extension of believing in the writing and that I find inadvisable.


(Zarao) #267

I feel that the ones currently supporting Sylvanas are either spiteful regarding having to tag along MoP 2.0 and Musical Warchief Chairs, or because at least her current portrayal gets going the kind of faction conflict and “vow to noone” attitude that was marketed so thoroughly in those catchy TV spots…and in Blizzcon.
Faction pride and warring againts the ones that say otherwise, where both concepts Blizzard dumped in the pre-patch for the Horde.
Even if they marketed both as the driving points of the expansion.

In my case, i admit i’m in a “bit of both” grounds atm.


#268

Supporting Sylvanas out of spite does not necessarily imply they want her to be this 4D chessmaster who had a master plan all along.


(Zarao) #269

Well…it kinda does if they wan’t to go with the most unsatisfactory ending possible and see the whole community up in flames and screaming for Blizzard to dump or fix its writers.

Not my case, personally speaking, but as far as i know there are quite a few that rather have a Kerrigan than a Garrosh 2.0 (and by Garrosh i mean another dead Warchief that gets the axe after being randomly villainised).

My route, for example, would be halfway: Sylvanas sacrificing herself to save the Horde after realising her mistakes. Redeeming herself in the eyes of those that oppose her in the Horde, while also ending her ruleship with an elegant “Grom-like” exit.
Its kind of sour seeing the last iconic WC3 Horde leader go, but at this point, i think its the only way to salvage this. Horde-side speaking.


#270

Thrall is dead?! :scream_cat:


#271

Well, the problem is that there’s no strong indications that she believes that any of her actions were a mistake, yet.

Her character has been written inconsistently, and any indications of her ‘caring’ for the Horde are cast into doubt about whether they are her true intentions, or just a front, not only due to the nature of her character, but also the inconsistent writing.

Not only that, any ending will ruffle the feathers of some part of the fan base. There’s no ending that’ll satisfy everyone.


#272

If by"believing in Sylvanas’ character " you mean believing she isn’t just stupid/ crazy, then yes, because she has never been presented as that. Shady, self-serving, Machiavellian in her choice of means- certainly. She is Forsaken. She is meant to be that way.
And the Horde was cool with that as long as her strategy proved successful.
But now they are losing and all of a sudden honor is a thing again and the Alliance is our only hope. Totally believable.
And I’m not even talking about treason- I gladly joined Vol’jin in his rebellion against Garrosh but that was Vol’jin…now it’s…Baina.
Can you really blame any Horde player for wishing for a different outcome, no matter how unrealistic?


#273

She has always had moments of poor decision making and failures. Trusting a dreadlord was pretty foolish.
And honour was always a thing, not for all of the members of the Horde but it always was a part of trolls, tauren and the orcs.

It’s fine to wish for unrealistic outcomes, but so can others. Why are the nelves not deserving of their vengeance and a resurgent nelf empire, if the Horde is worthy of a redemption?


(Leíá) #274

Sweetheart, we have a resurgent in the old Empire.
Join the Horde and bask in Suramar’s glory :blush::blush:


#275

Well, empire does raise a misconception
My point, more accurately was that why shouldn’t the nelves drive the Horde out from their former territories and from Kalimdor?
That is an unrealistic outcome, but aren’t they allowed to wish for it?


#276

Ill change up for this,

Don’t forget to bubble up when next big threat comes by.


#277

They absolutely should. They deserve their vengeance. Honestly, I would love to see them unleash their full Nightwarrior power wrath upon us. As long as it isn’t Jaina saving the day it’s fine with me.


(Leíá) #278

Certainly, but old Highborne towns and ruins truly need a Nightborne touch. The nelves let them go to waste. [quote=“Coupedegrace-ravencrest, post:276, topic:58123, full:true”]
Ill change up for this,

Don’t forget to bubble up when next big threat comes by.
[/quote]

Noted. We need our Highborne Empire City in tact after all.


#279

Such an ending would probably involve Sylvanas dying an ignominious, gory death, which goes against what the Sylvanas loyalists would probably want.

At the end of the day, someone has to lose and not have their ideal ending


#280

The cinematic is pretty neat.

Though i am curious who we get to loot next time


#281

Yes you do, to keep bein useful for the Horde!


#282

Gory, probably. Deserved too. Ignominious I don’t know- not as ignominious as being stabbed in the back by her own people, with Anduin and Jaina standing next to me patting my back for it. But it won’t come to this any way- her endgame is yet to be revealed :wink:


#283

Sylvanas was never a machiavellian villain. It’s difficult to write one, see Petyr Baelish and Tywin Lannister from GoT if you want examples of well-written machiavellian villains. Sylvanas was never like them. Having some manipulative skills and common sense does not turn you into an extremely calculating machiavellian villain.

She was always crazy, remember when she saw the humans as an infestation that had to be removed and gleefully watched two people slowly melt before the Blight? This was way before Cataclysm.

I mean, let’s be real. Blizzard villains are not intelligent. They are all stupid characters who make 20 IQ decisions. Sylvanas is no different. Blizzard doesn’t know how to write smart and calculating geniuses for villains.


#284

and then with whoever is next warchief they will do it in 2expansions.