Blizzards credibility. Chinajoy interview

(Leíá) #41

Axe them for the next expansion.

Axe them all.

Give other, smaller characters the story and see what happens. I guarantee you, that the story would improve 1000 fold. Ly’leth, Lorna, Leryessa (in fact, all the major characters’ in the next expansion must have names that start with L /jokes) and others would actually tell a story.

(Kaisena) #42

I’m all for giving less important characters a more meaningful role in the story ,allowing them to grow.It’s something i wanted to see for quite some time because it allows the story to evolve in hopefully different and better direction.

However, killing most important characters is not the way to go.Warcraft lore has already suffered from this for quite some time with the deaths of big names such as Lich King,Kael’thas , Archimonde , Kil’jaeden and so on.

Bench big names ? Sure. Kill them off to make room for others ? I don’t think it’s the proper way to handle things.

(Leíá) #43

Side line them is what I mean by “axe them.” Just remove them from the next story and give it to the characters that we can actually get excited about.

Anduin, Sylvanas, Tyrande, Jaina, Baine, Saurfang, Nathanos - none of these are exciting as it stands, because their stories aren’t being told at a pace where the average player can keep up.
They need to go on the back-bench for the next expansion.

I’d highly recommend the above three as well as Mordent Evenshade, Gryan Stoutmantle, Rommath, Victorie and others.
The minor characters need more attention and given the appalling story the main characters have got this expansion, the next expansion is the perfect opportunity to bring these guys and gals to life.

(Kaisena) #44

Even though not a minor character, they are kinda trying what you suggest with Thrall.

He was in the spotlight for “too long” according to others, then he dissapeared from the story, even in very important events and now it seems they are trying to squeeze him in.

The flaw in this type of character development is the fact that it pretty much allows the story creators to wipe their hands clean like nothing happened.

In my opinion it’s a poor way to handle the story if you can just remove the character from the story for long periods of time and pretend nothing happened,

I suggested to bench big names, but close off their story in some form,don’t leave yet another plot hole.Warcraft is already full of those.

(Leíá) #45

Temporary closure at the end of BFA.

That’s what we truly need. Especially a break from Anduin and Baine.
The others aren’t so bad, but we need a break from them.


While I would welcome such an approach, I have my doubts it will happen. Blizzard’s policy has been for a while now to pile up increasingly dramatic events just for the shock value and to cram as many storylines into one expansion as possible without intending to finish them, let alone in a satisfactory manner.

If Sylvanas is not going to die at the end of bfa ( as it seems she won’t ) it would indeed be better for her to lie low for a while as well. People tend to have a short memory, and those who condemn her today will probably welcome her with open arms when she returns at a later date to spice up a story revolving around less polarising characters.


If you ask me it doesn’t need to be temporary… And they really shouldn’t just be exchanged with some B-list characters… instead I would rather like the story to revolve around the player character and what he experiences. I really don’t want to have to care about Anduin and co.

Just leave them in their pretty castles, while I get to know a team of NPC-companions (like I started to in Legion), and get to know villains most of the world never really hears about. I would much prefer if the WORLD of Warcraft could stop rapidly changing for some time, so I get to explore it again, without feeling like everything I see now will be totally different again in a year or two…

(Leíá) #48

That would work as well.

And it did work, we can’t deny it. Barring the Warrior Order Hall, where it was all a bit, brand new, the other classes all had a force of B-characters that we grew to like, for the most part, had already known about and appreciate.

And this is the problem.

We’re getting quantity over quality and it should be the other way round.
At this stage, they are attempting to tell a Tauren vs Forsaken story with some Human involvement, no doubt. Then we’ve got Tyrande’s thing. Then we’re also looking at Vulpera allied race. Then we’ve got the whole N’zoth being released.

It is too much for one expansion.

(Kaisena) #49

It’s a fair point Leia makes. They are trying too many things in this expansion story wise and it all mixes up into one big cocktail or crappiness.

Horde vs Alliance
Inner Horde issues
Forsaken vs Tauren
Azshara’s “revenge”
N’zoth’s secret plan

I mean, a single one of those themes could easily be enough for a proper story for one expansion granted it had consistency and proper development.


True. But hey, they’re bringing classic back for those people who want to experience the story at a slower pace.

(Leíá) #51

These two didn’t need to happen though and you know why…because Blizzard should have made the Alliance strike first.

But you see, with Classic, we had characters like Raene Wolfrunner in Astrannar, Gryan Stoutmantle in Westfall and Sergra Drakethorn at the Crossroads.

These characters were what drove the story in these respective areas in WoW and, it did work.
Also, the class quest system was something that also worked out well because it developed your story with the class that you were playing.


I couldn’t agree more. Leave Anduin & co in their pretty castles and let the player experience new content at our own pace. But there’s the problem- we aren’t just “adventurers” any more, we are the “heroes” who have to be consulted on all important matters. But this rings hollow because in the end, we have no power of decision whatsoever. The choices we can make in bfa are no choices at all. I’d rather I was unaware like the common foot soldier than this all-knowing champion who can still do nothing to change things when it comes down to it.

(Kaisena) #53

Tbh i would not mind at all if the playable character had nothing to do with the story.

(Leíá) #54

To be fair, this is one reason why I look forward to Classic.

We are all nobody’s - just adventurers. My Night Elf Priestess will not be the best hero ever, she will just be a travelling Kaldorei Priestess, seeing Azeroth and mainly, exploring the Eastern Kingdoms.

My Human Warlock, the same, but travelling Kalimdor, but also returning to Lordaeron.


That’s really not much of a problem, I think. For example, I’m dabbling with the first addon of FFXIV right now…

FFXIV spoilers from years ago, I guess

…and at the end of the base game they thoroughly depower your character and besmirch his reputation, forcing him to go underground for a while.
They take your godly protection that was an important plot point, make the army you built up stab you in the back, and make you and your allies out to be a murderer, after you shared the table with most of the world’s rulers.

They mostly reverse this after a while, but it is an example of how the mighty can fall.

Any power gained can be lost. That goes for social credit as well as for legendary weapons. We are revered now. We don’t have to be revered after we bring in the next big threat through understandable mistakes, or after the void made us do bad things publicly, or after we go undercover, etc. etc.
Even better, addons could just play far from home without much of a way to call for reinforcements. Remember how the scenario in WoD was at the start? The heroes going on a suicide mission, destroying the portal behind them, trapped in a world that is out to kill them? Yeah, if they had stuck to that instead of opening a portal home 2 quests further on it could have been really interesting.

So… I don’t think removing our status or making it irrelevant would be that hard to do, really. We can become adventurers, or “Heroes in the Shadows” again, if they want us to be.

(Zarao) #56

The amount of work they would need to put into said characters would make said route almost impossible to accomplish.

Create solid backgrounds, with relevant roles and stories to cement a new cast of characters, isn’t something feasible for a widespread “culling” of major ones that need to be replaced ASAP.

Blizzard is already failing at filling the gaps of the few they are removing now.
That’s the reason why the most prominent orc atm is a Meme Character that came to be almost because of a fan joke, and was given his position on Twitter.
Or why the Darkspears were left leaderless for almost 3 years now…to have their most “notable” character, surpassed by another Meme Character when it comes to even have something resembling a unique model.

Blizzard has had enough time to develop plenty characters. And decided simply not to. How many Tauren characters can you name by memory? How many Draenei? Gnomes? Darkspear?.

Yes, elves of both factions have it easy. Curiously, almost every faction they have currently counts on a wide range of supportive characters.
But for the rest…they actually come rather lacking in that regard.

And asking Blizzard to simultaneously work on replacements for all of them? That’s asking for a miracle.

At this point, checking the collision course of the ones they have butchered seems more feasible. And still, we are in for a lot of sh!t writing for that to happen.

(Leíá) #57

It’s not really all that much work.

I mean, the meme characters we’ve got now, literally as far as WoW is concerned, came up out of nowhere.

Just set ourselves up for absolute disappointment? Can do.

Who said all of them? Many of these characters already have well established backgrounds that people already know about.

It is simply slotting them in. The only one who might require attention, but she could still work is Leryessa. Most of them, don’t require a full setup story. They’ve been granted story and this is just their progression.

Hamuul Runetotem, Aponi Brightmane, Rimblat Earthshatter, Magatha Grimtotem, then we’ve got those of Highmountain who we’ve yet to see be truly established.
Mayla has received NO lore since joining the Horde, barring her disgust at Baine’s arrest.

They have made attempts at these and failed miserably. Perhaps these races need to be sidelined as well, until we get back to the big characters. I personally wouldn’t veto that decision.

Again though, this sounds like you DON’T want the big ones temporary sidelined for one expansion

The majority of them were quite easily replaced last expansion, when the players were interacting with other characters like Naralex, Modera, Jubeka, Maxwell and others.
So this lark your spewing simply isn’t true and the major characters can and need to be, benched. As Wimbert stated, keep them in their castles for an expansion.


There are 10 human characters for each single one of any other race. Which is the biggest problem here.

(Zarao) #59

It’s not a matter of what I want, or do not want.

Point is, that experience tells me that after Blizzard removed Thrall, Garrosh, Voljin,…big characters, and important ones, they didn’t develop new ones.
After Kaelthas died, people called his substitute Bob for all the years that went between BC and MoP.
It took them almost 6 years to start working on the substitute face for the Blood elf faction.

Blizzard simply doesn’t do well with backups.

Arguing that they would be capable of doing such, is simply not realistic.

Ps: And yes, at this point I’ve lost all faith on something resembling a logic ending. Let alone an interesting one.

(Leíá) #60

They did it in Legion.