Burning Crusade introduced different raid sizes
WOTLK introduced LFD
Cata has LFR
MoP had New talents & precursor to titanforging
WoD started the death of professions
etc etc, no ONE thing is the culprit for why WoW in it’s current state is as bad as it is.
‘‘Why did one straw break the camels back?’’, The million straws underneath it.
But again, what does retail have to do with what i said in any way shape or form? i never mentioned retail, i thought we were having a discussion on cataclysm
You said: ''ANY mention of ANYTHING about classic that just isn’t bad game design but is bad MMO design and you yell ‘‘BACKTORETAIL BACKTORETAIL BACKTORETAIL’’
Yeah, we were talking about CATACLYSM, and you said ‘‘the revamp was bad.’’
I then interjected and said ‘‘The revamp wasn’t all bad, the way they remade quests so that zones felt coherent and had stories to tell that made the zones feel better was a good thing even though the aesthetic part of ripping apart every zone and adding fire wasnt so nice’’
Your response to this OPINION, was ‘‘go back to retail’’ like a 7 year old
I just pointed out that you just default to telling anyone that doesn’t 100% agree with you to ‘‘GO BACK TO RETAIIIIIIIIIIIIILLLLL’’, and it’s just dumb, you’re dumb.
Classic has a lot of good game design but OBJECTIVELY BAD STORYTELLING isn’t a good game design, IN ANY GAME, EVER, AT ALL.
safe to say the game was slowly progressing to sht since xpac no.1 . Not saying it was sht by tbc, but tbc started it, and it only got worse each time.
TBC - flying mounts, multiple difficulties
WotLK - More difficulties, overall less rpg game ideology, LFD
Cata - LFR, (plus what tbc and wotlk brought), revamp of old world, making it stream line
Mop, LFR first time for a whole xpac, ANOTHER difficulty, thunderforging (which would lead on to what comes next)
WoD - besides jack sh*t content, systems it carried into the future were mission tables, not so rare rares (mount rares aside), warforging (and it would evolve again)
Legion - this is when wow became a true casino, rng legendaries, titanforging, random sockets (sockets might have been wod, not sure), and then ontop of that this is when crappy emmisary reputations came in with rng mounts and leggo boxes, and when AP grind was created
BFA - Basically legion + WoD, terrible systems of legion with the lack of content of WoD, didn’t really add anything new that was specifically bad except azerite gear, which safe to say will probs be gone
Every expansion introduced things some players hated, but they also introduced things people liked - and sometimes removed things from Vanilla that some people didn’t like. Such as world buffs, Honor ranking, excessively long dungeons, weird itemization, bad class balance, etc.
Again, stop pretending Classic is perfect while every expansion made it worse. Classic is flawed like every other expansion that came after it, it all comes down to what a person prefers from the game.
That’s another discussion. I just want to point out that #NoChanges was invoked here to protest the sentiment of legacy servers for other expansions, not any actual changes per se.
I disagree with the idea of separate servers for expansions. Instead I think specifics of what everyone wants should be voted on via ingame poll boards in cities such as Stormwind.
E.G TBC without flying
Seperate servers means dividing the community even more, let’s meet in the middle somewhere, keep the game updating.
TBC was peak, imo. Better all around.
Flying didn’t ruin world pvp in any way (unless your idea of WPvP is hoping someone will pass you on the way to an instance), it just changed some parts of it. And it didn’t stop players from experiencing the world. If anything it made it easier to experience the world.
Dungeons were still challenging, and an extra difficulty might have been a cheap way to drag out the content, but it did add.
Arguably, everything that lead to the current state started as early as Vanilla, with nerfs, buffs, and QoL changes. More flightpaths for easier travel lead to flying mounts, BG’s lead to arenas, etc…
BG’s didn’t exist at the start -> people asked for organised PvP -> instanced PvP became the way to earn honor and PvP gear -> people wanted dueling to follow the same route.
Not at all. Few flightpaths meant people had to spend a lot more time travelling from on spot to another. More flightpaths reduced travel time, but people still had to travel large distances, with indirect routes and mobs slowing things down. Flying was a natural extension of that. Simple convenience and time saving.
Then give the subjective explanation of exactly how flying ruined WPvP.
That statement is entirely subjective.
Seriously, though, that’s how you view experiencing the world, and indeed not necessarily a good thing. But flying was only available at max level (if you could afford it), and by that point you’d already been through the danger, and being able to see just how big the world was from above doesn’t necessarily reduce feeling of massiveness.
I’d prefer new dungeons over buffed up dungeons myself too.
people always want convenience, that’s human nature, but that doesn’t necessarily result in fulfilment, and fulfilment is exactly what the modern game lacks, and what each xpac aided towards eradicating. This really is a case of ‘you think you do, but you don’t’. And ultimately, they get their convenience, then they get bored due to lack of investment through the lack of fulfilment, and thus quit, thus not being objectively better for the game.
I didn’t say your point was subjective to say mine wasn’t, I’m simply stating your statement didn’t counter mine, I made the original point, you attempted to ‘prove it wrong’ without doing such
and you should continue to be, if I live in the ghetto for one year, I then shouldn’t be able to go through the ghetto in guchi clothes the next year because I bought a ‘shank free’ pass.
cool
I don’t entirely agree with this, however this is a pointless argument as I personally don’t mind arenas, thus why I didn’t put it on my negatives added by xpacs, however I’d rather lose arena then have LFD and LFR
