TF is bad, yesterday I was watching Preach (Twitch streamer) . He was on a 270ish alt Priest killing the WB in warfront area. He died and whilst doing his corpse run he dropped a 385 trinket. Yes 385.
His guild has killed Mythic Gh’uun , he has guild members who are famed slayer with a worse trinket. In what world is this a good thing?
cant post links
h**ps://clips.twitch.tv/PlumpTrustworthyTriangleTBTacoRight
Yes, TF isn’t nice, but not the problem here.
The “real” problem here is that welfare gear is BiS for some characters.
I have a 385 Dooms Call and will probably never replace that till the next raid comes out, it’s roughly 200 dps better than my 395 + socket uldir trinket.
I somehow doubt that Blizzard would ever make a content which would require warforged/titanforged items to down it, that would be silly.
And my guess is currently that titanforging system exist to give the sense of a progression to the raiders when they reach certain gear cap or to decrease the gear gap between various groups of players.
Their initial reasoning for WF/TF was, that if a guild can’t down a boss, even if they have every item from the bosses before, they still have a motivation to reclear and have a possibility to improve their gear so they will, eventually, be able to kill him.
For that matter i prefer the system they introduced with BFA, the reorigination array that will constantly improve your dps for each week you progress in that dungeon. Sadly they didn’t remove WF/TF when they implemented said system.
It exists with the sole purpose to prolong the lifespan that the content has. That’s obvious as day, honestly.
Consider the difference between Classic gearing and MoP and beyond: in Classic, let’s say during the BWL patch, there were 8 bosses that dropped two items each, to which the head of Nefarian would add up, that awarded another item. That’s 17 items per week to be distributed by a raid of 40 characters, and that was it. The average expected number of gains would have been 0.425 items to be gained per week. MoP, let’s say SoO, had 14 bosses, each dropping 2 items for a raid of 10 or 5 items for a raid of 25 (same ratio). The average number of gains would have been 2.8 items per week.
This means that the philosophy was that they would rather drop more items, but before BiS could be acquired, you would have had to go through the warforge filter, which happened only to about 25% of the items dropped in a 25 playersraid and 10% of those dropped in a 10 players raid (this discrepancy was a mistake, imo, but this is a different subject so I will not touch upon it). Thus, while the probability to get an item was significantly high compared to the Classic system, the average probability to get a top itemlevel item was actually 2.8/4=0.7.
0.7 is still higher than the Classic 0.425, but then again TBC reduced the number of players from 40 to 25 without dropping less loot for the raid, so if we were to recompute for it, it would likely be roughly the same expected amount (between 0.7 and 1 top ilvl items per week for TBC, WOTLK and Cata).
The advantage this system provides over the old one with no warforging whatsoever is that it allows the devs to be more liberal with drops without having to necessarily drop more top itemlevel gear than before, which enables players to form competitive sets with more ease but does not reduce the amount of time invested for gaining BiS. That would explain the MoP system and the reasoning for it to be there. It does not, however, explain the Legion and BfA system of infinitely scaling titanforges… This is why I say that the MoP system is more or less OK, but the Legion + BfA system really is not.
they already did.
Uldir - clearing uldir was mathematically impossible due to numbers and people had to wait for more and more gear and pray for titanforged.
I don’t think it was. As I recall the first kills of each Mythic Uldir boss happened before any hotfixes were applied. There have only been a handful of mathematically impossible bosses in the history of WoW and these all happened before Titanforging was introduced. The funny thing is that even though we have titanforging which should solve the problem of mathematically impossible bosses, Blizzard still nerf them periodically.
I’m not sure I fully understand what you are talking about here, sorry.
Yes, fetid was impossible to kill untill they nerfed him like 3 times. Fetid has probably been nerfed over 10 times by now.
They have their internal mythic test team and they add like 10-15% on top of what they were able to kill. But fetid was a pretty big dps/hps check that you can’t overcome with pure skill. It was, in fact, mathematically impossible to kill with the gear they had at the time when the first few nerfs hit.
I thought the Limit guild killed Fetid before the first nerfs came in.
They downed him on september 14th and there was a hotfix on september 13th.
Ah, fair enough. I must have missed that one.
Yep and IIRC. that was already the second nerf to fetid.
Just goes to show how bad some bosses are balanced as it just got another 10-20% nerf today.
When it comes to me I wouldn’t mind to have the gearing system closer to how it was in MoP and Wotlk , and have a sense of a progression which would be more linear but as much as some people like mythic + system its also true for it that it devaluates the raiding and its also making gear inflation in the game much more than the titanforging system does, when people can spamm it and gear in it much faster than they can with the raiding. Also its pretty ridiculous atm that current warfronts give heroic level of gear.
I did it WITH a guide and I felt good about myself.
Couldn’t disagree more. Mythic is a niche difficulty. You CANNOT make it the standard. LFR is the most played difficulty. You are free to ignore it all you want, but it has a place, a very important place, in the raiding scene. Without it raiding could very well be dead, or at the very least on life support.
And this just strikes me as funny, because you clearly have no clue what its like to play in another way than you do. It’s fine you like what you like, but the game cannot be catered to you and you alone. That’s not how it works.
I am completely indifferent. Could not care less if someone get a titanforged. Probably it’d be a positive thing if it happened in my raid group, as the group as a whole got stronger from it.
And who am I to decide what other people deserve? some people who wouldn’t touch a game, probably think some of us doesn’t deserve air, useless eaters, but are happy that we’re bogged down with #@%¤ discussions like this to not know whats going on in the real world.
This is simply untrue. How do people come up with this kind of nonsense?
Yes balancing happened, just like they ALWAYS did. Long, long before TF was even a thing.
I think this is the best explanation I’ve ever seen.
Take into consideration that chance in vanilla that you got raid drops that nobody could use at all (like tiers for classes that were not even in the raid) - and it will get even slower. Then take into consideration the far more sources for gear you have nowadays.
All in all, it basically means that fully TF geared players nowadays are as likely to happen as fully raid geared people back then.
Probably because the gamedirector himself said that it was mathematically impossible due to errors in the calculation, overestimating the skill/gear of the top mythic raiders? Probably because it got nerfed twice before the first guild was able to down it? But you’re probably right, mister 3/8 normal.
it is simply true tho - refer to mojomanes post.