Class Tuning Incoming -- 18 March

Community General Discussion
41

Just why? All you had to do was nerf Army of the death and dark transformation so Unholy can focus on sustain damage and a more flat dmg profile rather than be a cooldown hero, we already have frost which is dependent on a cooldown to do dmg, why do u force two specs to have the same gameplay loop?? This literally makes it impossible to balance, when 2 specs have the same damage profiles and gameplay loop the one that stands out will be played and the other will be in the gutter, just make them have different dmg profiles, frost can be the cooldown burst oriented spec, unholy can be the sustained dmg spec.

So let me get this right, you are nerfing one of the few specs which don’t have this disgusting cooldown based playstyle, where you have to do your dmg in a short window and then wait another X amount of time for the cooldown to do damage again? Yes lets nerf every flat dmg profile and make everything do dmg in a single burst cooldown. I’m convinced you really need to change your hiring policy for such positions, and definitely require from the candidate a meaningful amount of time spent in the game, you can’t have clueless people make decisions for a game they have never touched.

2 Likes
43

Single-target damage from DK Frost? That’s a joke.

44

https://mythicstats.com/dps?dungeon=&period=1046

He’s exactly 20% behind other top DPS classes.
Were you screaming for a nerf to the top 3 DPS? Or is anyone else asking for a -20% nerf to the top 3 DPS?

And this is a picture of Unholy, which adds nothing to Raid or M+.
Unholy is:
NO Abomination Limb (no AoE grips)
NO Raid buff
NO Prio damage
NO Overall damage
ONLY Survival

In every scenario except one, he was worse than other classes. He had some of the best survival in the game, but who cares when you’re not doing damage as a damage-dealing class?

Now, if you want to be even more honest, check out Season 1 and the advantage Enh or Ele shamans had over other DPS. Without them, finishing high lanes was impossible.
It was terrible; everyone was addicted to them.

I keep referring to the situation in M+.

Stop lying about listening to player feedback.
I’ll ask - which players? Who? Where? Any evidence that you’re actually listening?
You’re only listening to Excel charts instead of players.

With the -20% nerf to Unholy, there should have been at least a developer note explaining why you took so much damage away from him.
You didn’t even do that.

Instead of focusing first on improving his damage profile, which you ruined by offering a game where, regardless of talents chosen and combat scenario, ST or AOE attacks always result in the same outcome.
When I play Rider or San, choosing to play with pets, pets are the top 5 damage dealers.
When I play Rider or San, choosing to play with diseases, pets are the top 5 damage dealers.
Instead of buffing Epidemic, you should immediately buff Dread Plague, which is the priority disease and somewhat the most important, but deals the lowest damage of all our Plagues. Dread Plague should be top 1 damage in a single scenario and at least top 5 for AoE.
But the damage profile for different builds isn’t the worst.
The worst part is that it doesn’t matter at all whether I play ST or AoE, whether I play Rider or San, whether I choose diseases or pets.
I get the same gameplay every time.
This is SICK.

What you should really do when rebuilding Unholy is focus on separating pets and diseases.
I don’t need an army of pets in a disease build.
I need interesting interactions with diseases, buffing them, and dealing massive damage at will, but instead you offered disease REMOVAL as something interesting – well, that’s not interesting at all.
You didn’t even consider having Unholy use pets that interact with Plagues and expand on that concept in a Plague build.
This final boss in Pit of Saron has more class fantasy than Unholy, as he summons Scourge Plaguespreaders, which attack with Festering Pulse (poison), so he can summon two different types of pets, while Unholy DK summons the same type of pet every time, regardless of what he wants to do. GREAT JOB!

2 Likes
45

I don’t understand why they always nerf so extreme and give huge buffs to other specs, there’s no way it will be balanced like that, just do 1, nerf top specs, see how it is, or buff underperforming specs and then wait, see how it is, do small adjustments after.

Also, Arcane mage buffed? how does that even make sense.

2 Likes
46

https://www.simulationcraft.org/reports/MID1_Raid.html
After the nerf. Yes, unholy was ungodly overtuned. Stop feelycrafting and read the numbers.

1 Like
47

Why are you posting useless data from TWW s3?

You are so wrong, it hurts. Unholy was the undisputed ST king, simming at 142k dps.
Your raid utility is grip.
Overall dmg? Mate, did you check the beta? Unholy was a meta spec. Still is. Unholy is doing really good prio dmg.

2 Likes
48

You could at least have compensated for these nerfs in some way to make Hellcaller still viable in PvP.

49

I dont understand what blizzard was doing in alpha, beta and prepatch?

50

Why didn’t you write anything last season?
Something’s bothering you now, but nothing bothered you before.
It’s baffling…
This is hypocrisy.

I KNOW THIS

BUT I never wrote about nerfing the top 3 DPS in TWW in Season 3, even though they were over 20% above everyone else.

I only expected to buff weaker DPS classes, like Unholy and other DPS classes.

Furthermore, the sim doesn’t play Raid or M+.
If you want a realistic sim score, the sim must simulate a fight with each boss separately for each dungeon and for each boss in the raid, taking into account the duration of the fight, which will be different for each raid group and the composition of the team, and must also take into account all boss mechanics.

Then you’ll get an approximate sim score.
You’re currently relying on the results from the dummy in the city.
Stop being a sim bot.

PS.
You missed the Raid Buff content, but I forgive you.

1 Like
51

Wtf is your problem? Did I ever say that BM hunter, havoc, ele and dk were balanced last season?

Nobody is talking about past seasons.

52

Exactly xD
No one was talking about it back then, but now that Unholy was top, suddenly everyone needs balance.
Hypocrisy.

1 Like
53

Everyone was talking how OP BM and dk was. Everyone was disgusted by udk in s2.
Why are you lying?

54

And he’s been nerfed multiple times. Unlike the top DPS in Season 3.
That’s the truth. Look at the Blood Beast’s damage, which has been nerfed significantly.
To the point that the Beast doesn’t show up in damage meters.

So, yes.
When Unholy is strong, it’s immediately weakened, unlike many other classes and specializations.
That’s the story, that’s the reality.

1 Like
55

Yeah…after s2…

Strong? It was 50% ahead of other specs (enhancement for example).
Unholy was way too OP.

Straight up lying, but okay.

1 Like
56

The US players are far more whiny than EU. Wowhead comments are also full of whiny Americans.

2 Likes
57

This talent always get changes whenever there’s shadow tunning :dotted_line_face:, I wonder how big is going to translate, though I like the ST buffs

58

Does Fire really need that big cut in AOE ?

59

I’m not interested in playing melee but I keep one pally just for fun so that I can drop down on a mining node, massacre everything in half a second and fly off. My current one in Midnight is so OP I can’t believe these buffs! It’s crazy and I don’t think it should happen. I’m far from an expert pally and I can pull half the map and kill them in my sleep. Am I the only pally player to think this is nuts?

1 Like
60

Elemental Shaman has broken AoE and gets buffs, while Subtlety has okay AoE and gets nerfs. WTF??? Blizzard what are you doing?

61 
https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/news/huge-class-tuning-coming-on-march-4/
https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/news/big-war-within-season-2-class-tuning-pass-april-15th/
https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/news/big-upcoming-season-2-class-tuning-may-6th/
https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/news/tww-season-2-mythic-dps-tank-healer-logs-w13-tuning/

The difference is that he received significant nerfs.
I didn’t see significant nerfs in S3 or S1.
I also didn’t see significant nerfs to Arcane Mage and Balance Druid. What’s more, they clearly received buffs / S2.

Therefore, I think I’m right in saying that ONLY Unholy receives nerfs when he’s high.

Did Enh and Ele Shaman or Frost DK receive significant nerfs in S1? I don’t think so.

Look at the Unholy nerf. It killed one hero specialization. San’layn was, and still is, unplayable because they nerfed all the diseases when he was in Beta for a while.
Now, those diseases are slowly starting to get buffed again because they’re so weak that basic attacks and pets are better than them – in a disease build!

And you mention Raid, you’re probably referring to the ST results.
Well, all it took was improving ST performance, and now the -20% on everything also affects everything, including M+ and PvP.

This isn’t balance, it’s daylight robbery.

AND
I agree with you that, for example, +20% is too large a difference and should be adjusted to perhaps a smaller advantage, but if you mean one scenario e.g. ST then why does it affect everything?

However, I have no objections to you. Maybe I was too harsh on you. It’s not you who is responsible for this, but this incompetent balance team. The balance team is generally to blame here. They are the ones who cannot balance the classes properly in time, but even if they mess something up, they are unable to behave fairly towards other disadvantaged classes.

They’re simply pathetic.

1 Like