FEEDBACK: Torghast Empowered Bar

Over the last few days, we’ve made several tweaks and fixes to the new Empowered mechanic in Torghast on the Chains of Domination PTR. With today’s new build, we’re testing that anew.

Please leave any feedback you have on Torghast, especially the Empowered bar and how it feels, in this thread after you’ve experienced it in a fresh Torghast run on the PTR.

Thank you very much!

Hello I like torghast but what I would like to see improved is when your powers make you powerful you have more opportunity to let them shine, because the boss dies too fast. i would like to see the bosses, especially the last boss have a lot more health

Wozu braucht man zusätzliche Leisten ? Oder gar Timer. Zeitdruck hat man im wahren Leben schon genug. Ist mir nicht verständlich. Ich will mich mit Spielen Entspannen und nicht unter Zeitdruck setzen. Torghast ist eh Langweilig.

Could we make the button instant? I just don’t feel the mechanic. Ok I click a button -> cast -> something happens.

I would love if we atleast change our appearance:
Kyrian covenant: Emporerd -> Transform into Kleia or Pelagos and do some cool stuff.

So… granted my addons don’t work properly on the PTR, but the tooltip of the empowered ability didn’t really clarify what it was doing.
Truth is, i did not understand what it did, so maybe that is a hint the effect needs to be clearer and more visual.

I want to propose a change of the current bar. It feels not as good as the last one. But I know you want the time factor reduced.

0->100%
you steadily build up the stats to max.
At 100% you have 30% dmg etc.

On use:
all of your energy is spent on summoning your 3 covenant’s assist you in battle for a certain time frame.

While the general approach to bar maintenance was changed in a good direction, the way it impacts scoring feels horrible. Since you will probably spend the whole 1st floor collecting it to 100%, you lose out on score from that and just hope that 2nd floor is easy to mass pull and clear, which it rarely is.
Once again, please, stop putting so much scoring on the bar, it doesn’t work the same way for every class/spec and it feels horrible that our of 200 points 50 is decided by the empowerment system. The only thing this system will do is force people to group up to be able to mass pull floors and get the bar which will turn this into another m+ clown fiesta.
I’d argue that considering all this, the previous bar was a better implementation, albeit not ideal.

2 Likes

It’s like the entire empowered thing doesn’t exist anymore. The previous iteration was fun because it kept you going and created momentum. This iteration just runs out immediately and you cannot keep it up for more than a few seconds. you might just delete it at this point. It’s so far off from what you originally intended for the empowered mechanic to be that it lost its purpose.

After doing probably more than a dozen runs on +12, it’s still very uninvuitive what the scoring system is supposed to achieve, what I am to do for a good score, why going fast is bad and why I need to kill everything on the way. How the empowerment plays into this is the least understandable thing. But I somehow still get a “Flawless” run even though having almost no empowerment?

Everything is confusion, and in the end nothing is different from a 9.0 torghast run after all.

1 Like

The entire idea is bad and should be dumped, along with anything to do with timers.

Go back to the simple yet effective idea: clear a level to progress. make each level harder but with more powers too for more fun.

Having to get a certain score to progress is just another way of putting people off retail.

2 Likes

I tried thinking about this new bar as a concept in isolation, to figure out how good it’ll be, and found I couldn’t make heads or tails of it as there’s a lot of variables, so decided to try a series of tests across many difficulty levels and now it’s a lot clearer.

In its current form on PTR (this is the day before the reset so might change tomorrow) I just think the payoff of the empowerment ability doesn’t feel worth it overall. The bar takes potentially most of a floor (about 70/80% of it) to fill up, and this could take anywhere from 5 minutes to 20 depending on class and the difficulty being attempted, then there is a period of time, maybe 1-3 minutes after the bar is full, where you are coasting until the time is right to unleash the empowerment.
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…and then essentially all that happens when you activate it is a boost to haste. There are other stat increases and movement speed too but the whole thing feels very flat. This is exacerbated by the fact that its over very quickly. The bar drains away in practically no time during the empowered state and keeping it filled up simply is not an option, you cannot kill a group of mobs fast enough during empowerment to replenish the bar significantly, so its not much like a Shadow Priest’s insanity bar in previous expansions where if you timed each spell accurately, you could maintain void form for longer and longer.

For this long buildup, it should be a super-cooldown where your damage just explodes and destroys everything. The movement speed bonus should be set to a recklessly high level to make it more exhilarating, something like +80% movement speed, so you can rocket through the level aoe-ing everything.

Also because of the long wait time and the short window of opportunity it can feel pretty punishing if you get feared or interrupted during the empowered state as you then have to build it up again from scratch, perhaps if you made it so that you have the option of deactivating the empowered state and saving some of the empowerment up for next time, instead of having it all drain away for nothing if you’ve already killed the mobs you pulled.

Generally, while I like the torments/blessings/talent-tree changes this PTR, I’ve not really been a fan of the empowerment bar in any of the iterations. It feels tiring to be watching out for the bar all the time, and boring to watch it fill up really slowly, and also frustrating to have to go and do everything in the level just to increase the bar (eg all the Ashen Phylacteries). You always feel chained to the bar to try and increase it and it just becomes this hassle, once its over you have to start again, etc. I would much prefer if the bar simply didn’t exist, or perhaps if you made it into an blue/purple anima power, making it optional, which would drop like all the other anima powers, the same for all classes, as it is still an overall increase to the player’s power level.

One important thing relating to the time pressure aspect. I think the recent iteration of the bar where it is no longer time pressured is a move in the right direction and honestly a sign of good will from the developers so I think it is much appreciated. However it is not made clear to the player that they don’t have to speedrun to get a good score, because the score window at the end of each floor presents you with a floor time, and the player cannot tell whether that is being factored into their final score or not, because no doubt completion is an important factor and that is also being displayed on the score window of each floor. So even though the bar doesn’t time pressure the player, this score window does. If time really isn’t a consideration, don’t present the floor time taken to the player at the end of the level, I don’t think anybody particularly wants to see how much of their life they spent on a floor anyway.

Lastly, if you are committing to the empowerment bar being there, it would be more interesting/fun if the empowered state was some massive class/spec specific bonus. So as an example, for me, a destro lock, a random suggestion would be something like Chaos Bolt becomes instant cast and each time you cast it you gain another charge of conflagrate, so you still feel some benefit even after the empowered state has expired. It’s more interesting than a flat set of stat increases as it changes your class’s gameplay briefly, instead of just doing the same spells a bit faster.

It should be something unbalanced ideally, because Torghast is the place for that. No raid teams will be affected, nor M+ teams, world first races, pvp tournaments, arena comps, metas, no levelling alts, no pet battlers, no twinking alts, etc, …nobody will be negatively affected by some crazy powers in Torghast, because its all locked inside the instance. Generally you guys need to add in more of those, as realistically it’s just harmless fun which will make people want to go to Torghast to try the powers out. If you somehow added a crazy new anima power each week for every class, there’d be nobody anywhere complaining about grinding soul ash, because everybody would want to go see what its like when they can convoke 20 targets at once or set a whole floor on fire with the ignite dot or something wild. This cautious mentality gets us nowhere.

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I played diablo for the first time and could find some similarities between torghast and rifts… But let’s be clear. Diablo is soooo much rewarding. Why are there no chest events, towers grant you powers or actually some useful drops. Torghast will suck if it goes live like the current state. It’s a waste of time to put so much energy in the feature without giving the player something worthwhile…

My feedback for borghast is delete it and never create something like this it is freaking stupid and boring

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The very first version of the empowered bar was working very well and actually encouraging us to continue our kill streak to maintain it.

The ‘updated’ version has following issues;

1- Big button. None of us is going to click that button unless we feel the ‘empowerment’. Currently it adds almost nothing and lacks amazing visuals to support that feeling.

2- Especially with the increased difficulty of Torghast and mandatory scoring system, we need to be more careful on what and how many packs we are pulling. Which means we have to wait for our cooldowns. But empowerment bar doesn’t last that long to give us an advantage.

3- MOST IMPORTANT ISSUE is that button is a cast ability. No one, I repeat no one will use it or wants it. We already don’t like casting in fast paced environments like Torghast and it’s a terrible idea -and lack of user experience knowledge- to expect people to use it. Especially for melee or squishy specs, standing still and casting an ability that barely empowers you is a terrible idea. Personally I rather to skip it and just clear floors without touching it.

2 Likes

Remove torgast, comunity will praise you! It’s most annyoing thing ever!

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nope I like it. Also I like the crying of the m+ elitists that don’t want to but are forced to :smiley:

Still don’t get this new version of the Empowered Bar. It does literally nothing. There arent even enough Enemies on many floors to become empowered in the first place. How am I supposed to keep my empowerment up for the scoring system if I cannot become empowered in the first place?
Even if I start on a fairly low floor which I can basically clear in a single pull, I cannot remotely create enough empowered uptime. Not to mention that there is no reason to press the empower button in the first place outside of having some imaginary bar with no effect on my character adding a fraction of completion score to my final score.

edit: and yes, I am aware that the Box of Many things is adding effects to the empowered buff. My experience comes from both an empty as well as a fully maxed out box of many things.

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I will explain it to you. Blizzard found something potential fun and changed it. End.