I’m doing fine rly, although I do not want to pvp because pvp in this game is bad. Even you guys admit it. PVP players skillset doesn’t make them useless in pve. PVE heroic raider is useless in arena, might as well be dogfood. Doing a +10 is ridiculously easy. Going to 1800 isn’t very hard too, but its % based and by nature of pvp 50% of players will be at 1400, getting 2-3 furors per week, out of 15. Getting 50k honor in battlegrounds requires an insane amount of time spent on pvp - pve beam from m+? You get it in 15 minutes at lvl 2. Lvl 1 raid essence? That’s 1 heroic raid for lvl 1. The mekagon and ankonan ones - do you think I want to grind my followers on every alt? Heck no, nobody wants that.
That’s not how this works. Specially since you also can lose 0 rating with high enough mmr
Yea I think he just gave him a challenge.Ion is likeChallenge accepted.
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What’s the challenge?
If there’s one thing that’s for certain in regards to WoW, then it’s the PvP community’s ability to always proclaim tomorrow’s state of PvP worse than today’s.
That’s been consistently true since day 1.
The next expansion will – according to the PvP community – be the worst one ever…like every single one before was.
I guarantee it.
That’s not a challenge, that’s a given.
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So far only TBC and MoP were considerable step-ups compared to their previous versions.
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Not on the forums.
You maybe mean not for everyone, but even on the forums for many.
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Well, during TBC I think the PvP forums was half troll topics and half QQ about world PvP ganking. The Arena topics didn’t take up too much space as far as I recall, but that which there was, it was all QQ.
MoP was a nightmare of horror.
I was the MVP back then, and I posted on the PvP forums and whiteknighted the state of PvP more than I did today.
The degree of QQ and sheer hate PvPers expressed back then was not for the faint of heart. There was not one nice word said about MoP on the PvP forums during the entirety of MoP. Not one. I know, I was there, and I have the scars to prove it. 
So it’ll be the same for the next expansion as it is now, as it’s always been.
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I agree with for subjective reasons. I have been the biggest addict for YEARS and the essence system made me quit in an instant. I am not even missing it and i actually find that quite sad.
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I think you are just making justifications for your own positions right now, as to how the pvp community is formed of bad guys who don’t understand the amazing game and that’s why pvp is somehow not played. Of all expansions I can remember, start of WotLK was filled with complaints (rightfully so, season 5 is still possibly the worst season in history), start of MoP was filled with complaints (again rightfully so, while most of MoP was actually a very good pvp expansion, the start was beyond horrible), start of WoD (ditto) too. Generally at the start of expansions, there seems to be really high criticism, and then it dies down to low-moderate as the expansion improves. One of the problems is how Blizzard can never seem to use their vast prior knowledge and design stuff that works to begin with, and need 2 patches until pvp is playable. In BfA, it still doesn’t work.
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That’s because every expansion is a reset.
The final PvP Season of an expansion is basically the culmination of a year’s worth of tweaking and changing. It’s polished to perfection.
That’s why most of the highly-regarded Seasons are the last Seasons of the expansions. That’s natural.
The first Season of an expansion comes straight off the heels of a Beta test with a tight deadline. The game experience reflects that. And naturally players get extra sensitive to any quality issues, because they come right from the final Season of the past expansion - a much more polished and optimal game experience.
That’s just how it is.
The best Season of an expansion will always be followed up with the worst Season of a new expansion.
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I pretty much agree. PvP is completely and totally ruined.
The class design is absolutely awful for PvP. People like to say “look how cool the rotation is”, forgetting along the way that, for PvP, a rotation is probably the least interesting thing about the entire game. It needs utilities and minute-to-minute choices, and the only way we’re going to get that is if resources become a much bigger factor again.
Healers basically have it right at its core. Make everybody a little more like healers.
As far as PvP rewards is concerned, it’s a shambles. The cosmetic side of it is actually, in my opinion, mostly fine. Where the trouble comes in is that PvP just doesn’t reward anything in terms of power. Don’t even begin pretending to me that 2100 rating and a M+ 10 is the same level of skill. The M+ 10 is much, much easier.
So basically the item levels of all the rewards is underwhelming, but as if that wasn’t enough, the item drops are pretty rare as well. Doing 2v2, I get a proper item drop or upgrade token about once in every 40-50 games on a good day. Assuming an average length of 10 minutes, which is completely realistic when you factor in the queue time and the prep time, that leaves us getting an item every 400 minutes. In M+, getting an item happens every 2 dungeons or so, and each of those take 40 minutes. This means that M+ is about 5 times more efficient at getting rewards on top of also being easier.
This is why the best PvP gear comes from PvE. I mean it technically doesn’t in most cases, although it does in some, but the PvE gear is so much easier to acquire that there is basically no hope of getting the equivalent PvP reward, thus the PvE reward becomes the default option almost all the time.
On top of that, the rewards of PvP are excessively random. It’s basically the random weekly reward except doubled up. It’s really quite awful. I don’t know if vendors are necessarily the solution, although they are definitely a solution that will work.
On top of all the poor rewards already discussed, you also get almost no Azerite from PvP, either - so you need to get that from PvE.
So now we’re getting all our gear and all our Azerite from PvE. That means PvP becomes a side-activity - a hobby. A hobby most of us have no time for.
And on top of this BG’s drop worthless, random items as well.
The combination of all of this: PvP is a joke. It’s not fun, and it isn’t rewarding. You can’t focus on it.
I PvP’d in WoW for 12 years. Only very recently did I shift my focus to PvE. It hurts my soul to see PvP in this state. This is truly the end-game of everything wrong with BfA: Random loot, repetitive gameplay, Azerite (and low Azerite rewards), and one-dimensional, rotation-based classic, and to top it all off there is no open world community because of CRZ and the ability to queue from any location.
It can’t get any worse at this point.
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They repeat too many past mistakes. If they would be new mistakes, people would be more inclined to understand. But when, for example, every time except WoD and Legion there is a new first season, some pve items are broken, then yea, people won’t get that lightly.
Well, if you understand that, you should understand why people almost invariably say the new expansion is garbage instead of using that dismissive crap you use about how the pvp community. Because it is mostly true, because of what you just said. Then again, that usually dials down the more the expansion progresses. Not this time though.
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Sad , 2000 cr arena queue are also long right now. I cant imagine over 2400.
I have gladiator hota friends , they dont do rbgs anymore. Just arena or random bg.
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Funny enough I also thought WoD was the lowest point Blizzard could sink to with the Garrison-simulator WoD (with terrible lore on top of it)…but they keep suprising me.Somehow BfA turned out to be even more grim that WoD , something I thought was not possible.
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Yeah, and it also gets worse with each release over-all. They destroy everything with a new expansion and then kindda fix it throughout, then rebreak with the next one. If you could put it like a percentage of quality, with the first season we’re discussing adjusted to 100%, it would look kindda like this:
Pre-season: 100%
Expansion 1: 50%
Season 2: 60%
Season 3: 70%
Season 4: 80%
Expansion 2: 40%
Season 2: 50%
Season 3: 60%
Season 4: 70%
Expansion 3: 30%
Season 2: 40%
Season 3: 50%
Season 4: 60%
Expansion 4: 20%
Season 2: 30%
Season 3: 40%
Season 4: 50%
Expansion friggin’ 5: 10% lul everybody’s gone /shrug
If WoW should be PvP at all, it needs to be entertaining. There is no point continuing to create this garbge. If this is truly the best Blizzard can do these days, then I suggest expanding Classic with a tBC arena server and be done with it.
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I think it’s a matter of index.
I’d say the Seasons go from tolerable to acceptable to decent to good to great.
The PvP community seems to work with a scale that goes from worst ever to completely dead to total garbage to slap in the face to retarded joke.
Regardless, I’m not deducting why people say a new expansion is garbage, I’m simply concluding that they have always said that, and that they will continue to do so. Doesn’t really matter what Blizzard does or doesn’t do, their scale of expression doesn’t really contain anything positive.
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Well…u can always add more classes like bfa destro or dh…theres always a way 
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You just figured out earlier that it does matter. They can, for instance, not follow up the best season of an expansion with the worst one of the next.
Thats EXACTLY how it feels indeed. The only notable exceptions to that, imo, are TBC S1, which felt miles better than grinding 20h/day for rank 14 in vanilla, and MoP after season 1, which was a major step up from cataclysm’s pve infested broken meta.
I’ve watched BFA PVP streams randomly and almost fell asleep in the process. Each time I tuned in, it is some attacks, run away to heal then go back out, rinse repeat. Like literally nothing dies unless someone makes a seriously stupid move. If I wanted to watch something constantly recharging… I’d rather watch some rechargable batteries recharging than sit through hours of poke, heal and hide then poke.
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