and how exactly would you upgrade your key? or would everyone run around with M+25s? 
I think what you’re looking for is a raid or pre M+ dungeons, we already have it with no real timers (except berserk on some bosses) so everyone could go ahead and do it while people who enjoy M+ do M+ :))
Raids are whole different game. raids come down to experience. And I believe we cannot measure raid experience and m+. In sense that even when I change role in raid (I tank mythics and am half way trough EP with casual 2 day schedule), I can do so abysmal performance you can ask “is she even real” - raid dps comes form knowing your class and knowing the fight. But without raid experience you know likely neither.
But dungeons are in a way simpler - people do many of them, and people play their class in there a lot more often. In dungeons we can see also that when people change role/spec 1st times - they underperform. However I feel that with amount of cleave, experience and so on a i440 player would have in dungeons would be a bit more than 17k or 20k
As veteran player - even my 405 (my yesterdays example) is speced and azerited (benthic) for dungeon aoe, and had 1 strong single target talent for steady boss damage or focus target. However with 440 even with raid single target spec, I am sure one would do more than posted by OP just because abilities hit already by default as much.
So something does not really add up on 1st post. No, not for me. But truth is also that any wiser player would see - including OP if he is smart - that classes, specs etc scale differently and yes, stats do matter. Definitely.
‘How to FIX mythic plus’
remove it
On bolstering weeks I am the one dealing with equalizing health pools of minions by constantly swapping targets which is something that drops my dps, also doing interrupts. Still this drops me to 31 k dps more or less while braindead zombie dps guys in my group does 36-37.
That, like the false rio scores is also a problem caused mainly by boosting, i.e. by the community, not by blizzard. Group finder and trade chat is full with people selling high level gear runs, aotc achievements and rio score.
I mean boosting isnt an issue for rio above 1.5k.
no one buys rio boost, like EVER, been boosting for 13 months now, havent met a single unit buying rio boost.
so nah, its not even a slightest issue above 1.5k rio at the most, 1k to be realistic.
also rio tells you how many runs someone has done in certain bracket.
say “X” has 7 runs in 10-15 bracket
“Y” has 340 runs in 10-15 bracket.
their score can be same but im sure i know which one i’d pick if they were the same class/spec etc etc.
Just take solace that you’re the one you probably speed’s the key up. When tanking I hate it when on places like WM courtyard people just AOE faceroll and then we spend 3 minutes fighting a mini raid boss rune etcher mob, all because they can’t fathom holding off their AOE until the etcher is nearly dead will actually make the run quicker AND allow them to pad their AOE.
What level of keys are we talking about in this case?
I am asking because my group is currently pushing 17-19 keys right now, and not even on tyrannical did we need to sacrifice anyone on Galavazz? Because you have an abundance of combat res at your disposal?
Overseer I can understand to a point, but for both it really depends on what classes you have in the group. If you have a DH in the group, and he has the chance to practise it he can technically soak every single one of them with one of their ability (I think it is blade dance? Gives you a second of 100% dodge.)
Well ye, why do you feel entitled to a carry? You can create your own groups and i can see people for what they are, since ilvl says nothing i wanna see their experience and average dps and ints.
Sounds elitist, well to bad, it’s very sad that my keys get ruined by people who do so low dps and it happens very often. Did this 14, and got 2 dudes doing 30k on the boss, like oke thats nice for a 10 what are you doing here expecting me to carry. I can barely keep 45k-55k up as it is. Of course that key depleted, nobody left but my time was wasted. Next time, i’ll just leaved when i see low dps.
hahaha you mean you dont want to just take random people and actually want to know who you’re playing with? how dare you!!! you’ve taken my childhood and stolen my dream…
Ye i mean the only people crying here and about rio are bad people. Also in my keys people who leave or cry are mostly the worst ones, not all the time, but mostly for sure. I might post the screenshot of the 440 rogue without name, his dps and what he calls this group, tbf tank made lots of mistakes but he’s being carried what does he want more lol
I understand your rage, but If you want to pug stuff, you have to accept this possibility. If you want to be certain about someone’s performance, then make a group of in-game friends and/or M+ community to run stuff with.
The M+ is functioning pretty decent as it is I’d say (except class representation, especially healers), so is RIO ranking. The problem on higher keys is having group synergy, but if you want to pug higher keys, that’s something you have to deal with as well. Some days I have 5 failed time runs, some days it’s much better. Just try to stay calm and patient.
First wipe rage quitters can be annoying but that’s a problem on player side, not the system itself. Maybe some harder punishment would be in order for deserters, but I wouldn’t touch anything else when it comes to M+
We did, and it was nice, till two of them left us for Classic, only leveling to 60, ye now they can’t play retail anymore… So you know, more pugs needed.
This is what I am dealing with (437 toxic rogue) (boss fight):
imgur. com/8gxm7M6.png
^For context; boss died, wiped on trash due to tank being a bit iffy, anyway the other mage is ilvl 410 and is brand new to the class, also plays this game since legion, we play on and off so a new player actually.
imgur. com/3rlx0sY.png
Here we have another gem, total damage done with a 430 feral druid. Of course tank kept wiping us so people left, I’m not mad about that, the run went horrific anyway. Eitherway my brand new friend again out dpsing him.
Brand new but started in legion
wot
but yeah that DPS is abysmal
Ye that’s brand new, especially since we play on and off, so we play a few months than not touch the game for a year or more. Anyone who started wow in 3.0 aka legion, bfa, is brand new imo.
You really have to be clueless to play feral druid these days in the first place
Damn I’m really getting called a baby in WoW too
This topic will probably never stop coming up.
There is no punishment for people leaving PuG content, no matter what kind it is. It can be extremely frustrating dealing with leavers in M+ but Blizzard changed the system (a while ago) so that depleting a key lowers it.
Pugging is always a risk no matter what type of content you are doing.
Sites like Raider IO can help indicate what someone’s experiences is. I have both pugged and had our own team. The team was always a laugh, we weren’t looking to do serious pushing. Even if we screwed things up royally on occassion, no one left the key and we’d finish.
Pugging can go smooth or it can be hell. If someone does something wrong people behave as if that person just stabbed their grandmother. You also don’t generally get the best out of people if you hurl a tyrade of abuse at them.
Some people leave because if their sole purpose was to improve their score and you’re already set to fail and the timer can’t be met, they are wasting their time and want to find a new group.
I have been in groups where they literally could not get past a boss and after 20 mins or more of bashing your head against it you agree that it’s time to move on and try something else. Other groups will fall apart faster.
We had two people d/c in the middle of one run as their internet was being dodgy. I can’t remember if we timed that key or not but one of them was offline longer than the other.
Blizzard are not going to implement any punishment system for Mythic plus. I can’t see any addon recording the kind of data you want either.
Well yee, but i cannot blame that on him, the game has handicapped classes, it’s sad. But it just illustrates my experiences 6/10 times. And some people call me elitist, fine you can have your opinion but I find it sad that I can’t see who is decent or not. Just asking for decent, I’m not a pro either.
What, no I don’t mean it that way. Just for my POV everyone who is here since legion and BFA is new, considering they don’t know legacy classes very well.
The rogue had a rio of 1100, god knows how,. If this was my only time, but no, only after 1.5K I can be sure people out do me in every way possible, below that it’s a 50/50 between nice and decent or full on carry.
So the crux of this post is me asking for a system to see dungeon dps, ints, and deaths, maybe key leaves without wipes as well, just more data really. Rio is frankly quite bad, it’s better than nothing but it doesn’t tell ingame how often someone has ran X dungeon. It just tells a generic 10x 10+ timed. Oke great but what if that’s all freehold, how can I trust them in siege??? Eitherway I cannot remember this from Legion I’m sure the bad classes play a role in it as well, and the azerite.
You can’t run Freehold ten times and get a 1k score. The score is based on the best time/run you do in each dungeon the game offers. When people apply to your group it will show you their score as well as the highest key they’ve run in that dungeon you are listed to do. The addon also allows you to copy their raider io profile name so you can paste that into a browser and look at stuff in more detail if you feel you need to.
That still doesn’t guarantee that the person has a clue how to deal with the affix in that dungeon. I had a tank who kept standing mobs in the pools of blood (sanguine) this week or cut us off with a great big sea of blood from where we had to go next etc. Placed bloods in places that were awkward for upcoming boss fights etc.
I don’t think you will ever get the kind of data that you are looking for.