I realy dislike rio, even if I use it myself

Gameplay Dungeons, Raids and Scenarios
25

I have seen each level of key in the groupfinder where the leader was asking gir a good score, even seen multiple +2 and +3’s like that. Now i admit those people have the right to do that because its their group, but nowadays about 80% of groups for +6 and above check for Rio, and they cant really be blamed, because its their run and they can ask whatever they want, but your point that they dont ask for Rio under a 10 simply isnt true.

This may sound stupid, but really the only solution to this is as long as Rio stays, to get your own key and level it up so you can do Keys and grind up that damn score so you’ll finally get into that +3 with 1.3k Rio and 415 ilvl requirements…

26

Honestly, up till 9 I rarely see it. But perhaps it’s different at different times / perhaps even dependant on the faction.

Just roll Tank and nobody cares really. I usually don’t have to look longer than 2 minutes to find a group, even when I had literally 0 score.

27

I have friends who don’t play a lot m+ becase their jobs but they know tactics and how to play own class. But rio make difficult game to them. A lot ppl don’t want stay in party because them or don’t want us in party when we join. What is more sad than anything else I think 50% in wow have boosted rio, don’t know how to play m+, and it is like kinder surprise because you never know what you will get.

28

I feel that M+ is all about experience with M+ (and the affixes, how they relate to each dungeon, setups, etc), which is what RIO measures. It goes beyond just the score, although that is what people look at mostly.

I’d be surprised if it was even 5%. The RIO add-on does show how many timed runs somehow has in a bracket, which makes it easier to filter out potentially boosted players. I suppose someone could buy five or more boosts per week, every week, but it’s probably unlikely. Likewise, if someone only has 10s in time, but no 11s, 12s or higher, that might also warrant a second look.

RIO was used in Legion as well.

It works the same for everyone. PUGing end game content isn’t what I feel new players should aim for, because PUGs are generally not great places for learning. It doesn’t matter if it’s M+, rated PvP, or raids. People who organize PUGs expect experience, because they want to get the content done smoothly, quickly, and successfully.

Learning happens with friends and guild groups, and nobody is excluded from making friends or joining guilds. It does require social effort, just like in any multiplayer game.

I disagree that RIO has anything to do with elitism. It is not unreasonable that the owner of a key wants to do it with people who have the experience to do that key in time. The key is their “investment” and if they choose the group poorly, their key gets depleted. This is particularly annoying with a +10 key, because then you’re stuck with a +9.

Nobody is excluded, either, because everyone has equal access to keys and the opportunity to upgrade them. RIO only matters if someone wants to do someone else’s key, especially if the four other people are unknown entities (not friends, not guildies).

If you have your own key, you can also choose to ignore RIO, item level, classes. Would you, though, if you played with strangers whom you know nothing else about?

2 Likes
29

When i am using rio to pick out players to my own key, I care most about if the player has run the key I have before in time, and how many times. How much rio score you have is not the most relevant. I want to see that that you have experience in that duengon i got the key for.

For eks Wm 10 key. My requirements would have been

  1. Atleast completed a lvl 8 or 9 in wm
  2. Serveral runs in that instance… 3 or more
  3. You have done a lvl 10 before in any duengon.

I dont care about that you got 1000 in score if you never have done wm before at all.

1 Like
30

I feel this is a sensible way of going about this.

31

Sure you can roll tank however for me that would mean staring over with learning how to play, i have only been playing wow for half a year and im quote satisfied with the level i’m at now, but im not at the level of making a char and being able to immediately do m+ with it.
I dont disagree with rio in itself, i think it is a tool with which you can to a certain extent see the experience of a player, however i dont agree with people abusing this by asking for high rio in a +4 for instance.
On the other hand it is indeed the players responsibility to make sure they know the mechanics of a dungeon before joining any key at all and without rio this is something thats really hard to make sure when you are making a group without using rio.
All in all this is and will continue to be a touchy subject within the community, because rio brings good things but also bad things to the game, which, however, are all caused by the players themselves and not by having an addon or not, it cones from 2 sides

32

So first its hard to get over 1k if you never did a dungeon.
Second +9 and +10 is night and day, while +10 and +11, +8 and +9 are almost the same.
Reaping is not the same in every dungeon. Sure it mostly affects the tank knowing what he is doing, but still.

You can actually only pug your way up if
a) you are a tank
b) you do your own key with tons of patience

best result if you combine a+b.
Thats what I did and it also took me quite a while, because sometimes you get garbo keys that no one wants to do. I could lower the key for easy mode, but I don’t have the time to push my key several times till I get the dungeon that I want

Anyways, I mostly do my own keys and I like to invite players between 900 - 1100 RIO
Everything below or above resulted mostly in a disaster.
very high RIO players are the worst people (not players) I have met. They think they are the crop of the crop and everyone should bow. After 2 death they will immediately bail because it wastes their precious time

33

Dude what? Did you even play in Legion?

Let’s say that raider io is somehow removed from the game. Give us a better metric for performance in mythic plus that is currently in game.

Let me tell you exactly what would happen if raider io was taken out without a similar replacement: People would ask for the seasonal Keystone Conqueror/Master Feat of Strength achievement for joining.
That would only make it harder for people to join +10s.

Is this what you want?

Raider IO is the best available metric for performance in 5-man dungeons currently.

1 Like
34

I had a hard time getting into groups before i pushed my score 1k+
It is indeed a 2 sided coin and some key owners abuse it TBH, like asking 1.4+ for 11 or 12 keys!
And regarding that “PPl with low score don’t have time”, failing the key/leaving is also a waste of time for the owner + waste of gold (Consumables), and it’s mostly avoidable by checking the score.

I think more important fixes needed to mythic+ are:
1- Incentives.
2- Class balance.

I don’t know why there is no Mogs or mounts for certain high keys, something to work toward like the PvP mounts and enchants, it will be great.
another thing is that the “Loot table”. It’s tedious to have the same gear over and over again even with higher ilvl.

35

Tbh the greatest issues are most likely that there’s no incentatives to become good at the game. Most ordinary content, Normal, Heroic, Mythic, LFR and perhaps even normal mode raids require so little of a player to complete(Not to mention WQ, Assualts and Warfronts).

These activities also take you so far gearwise, that upgrading beyond these points start to require higher mythic+ or HC raiding. Heck you can reach ilvls high enought so any guide whould start to point you in the direction of mythic raids.

So when people start to expect some kind of performance in heroic raids and mid tier mythic+ keys(and beyond) It cause a disconnect between a player and the content.

Suddenly you have to dodge abilities and deal proper damage, interupt and know priority targeting. Not to mention that you also need to pay attention to abilities you might rarely or never even bothered using, like for example purge and soothe.

The difficulty curve vs the gear curve in BfA are totally out of sync.

3 Likes
36

I don’t feel this is abusive. If I had a FH +12 key and wanted the trinket really badly (I do!), I’d probably ask for as high of a score as I could reasonably get away with. It would be my key and I’d want to maximize the chance that I do the key in time, and ideally +2 it. There’s a better chance of accomplishing this with 1.4k people than with 1k folks. My goal wouldn’t be to learn and grow together, I’d just want to successfully run the key.

(It’s very hypothetical. I do my keys with the same group of people, so RIO doesn’t really matter. But I understand why people do this, especially since it probably wouldn’t be a problem to get people with a high score for certain keys.)

37

Well it totally depends on group needs, means utility. for example this week mages would be high prio to counter necrotic.
I am have 404 druid, 402 pala, 398 hunter.
if i sign up as balance , i have a chance to get invited in 10+ (reason cr)
if i sign up as retri pala it can take 2 hours to find group 10+
but if i sign up as prot pala it can take 5-10 min max to find 10+
for hunter it is similar with retri pala if i sign up for up to +6 easy to find but no benefit to me. if i sign up up to +9 there is a chance . people know they can finish in time.
But when it comes to 10+ people becomes picky.
I play resto druid, prot pala mostly , but there is not much fun so i do weekly 1-2 dungeon and dont bother for more. for me having someone in group that ruins the run is not fun. so many need of interrupt, purge, dispell, spell steal, soothe is not fun. Means if you do waycrest you definitely need an offensive dispell . that strains the people’s choice to invite.

as others stated there is no incentive to do dungeons other than weekly requirement. means not more tanks and healers are into doing multiple dungeons.

38

if you don’t like it remove your character from it and ignore it.

Blizzard lets you choose whether or not to share your information with 3rd party sites.

If they still display outdated information you can have them remove it via GDPR in Europe.

I took the time with Warcraft Logs, can’t be bothered again for IO really - I don’t get involved beyond Heroic and LFR.

1 Like
39

I actully saw a player asking for 2200 io score for a lvl 10 yesterday. He was around 700 himself. I also saw another player that asked for 1100 io score When he was 250 himself.

You shouldnt ask or reguire alot more of other players when you got bad score yourself. That is like asking… pls carry me, i dont know what I am doing…

I saw a good advice on another forum about rio score and the system. You should set the reguirements to join your key level - 100 so people can get experience in higher mythic + keys. For eksempel if you have a 10 key, rio score requirement should be 900 +. For a 12 key, 1100 io acore.

The problem with the game and rio now is that alot of people cant get into 10s or above, and they dont get any experience in it. It excludes people, and force you to run alot of keystones under 10…even if you are overgeared for that content.

40

Well curretnly many active m+ players have a situation when they created and lvld new alt VERY fast and rio doesn’t know that particulat character is an alt of some 2k+ keyrunner. It takes about 2-3 days to reliably mark fresh char as an alt with displyed main’s rioscore. This way I have no issues with 1.8+ guy on main finding a party for weekly.

it works for lvls 2 to 14, but timed 15 gives you 160 points and it grows.
timed 21=280+
timed 24=380+
so u don’t want 2.4k guys in ur 24 :stuck_out_tongue:

and even if we are talking about 10-14. Sometimes u want to PUSH not only current key, but the upgraded one aswell. So you probably will search for a bit more geared/experienced teammates.

41

There’s no exclusion factor in the game at all. Every player have a keystone and thus it’s possible to run, push and fail your own key as much as you please.

If you struggle to upgrade your own keystone, that’s the limit of your own knowledge at this time. Once you figured out how to construct a balanced group this gap will dissapear and the possibility to progress will be much higher. Another thing is, once you have figured out how to not fail you will notice you start to cause the same sort of exclusion.

There’s always alot of people signing up for a +10 key, 20-30 dps, a massive overflow of healers etc. So out of 30 people 2-3 DPS will be lucky and about 25+ will be excluded/rejected.

Yes I know It’s quite a douche move from my part suggesting people to make effort to upgrade their own keys. Not everyone wants to lead a group afterall… however there’s solutions to it; Be honest and say you have little experience leading groups which, might cause you to find someone willing to choose paths and put up marks if needed(tbh most tanks are just fine picking this role).

Once you have done the dance to hit +10/11 once you will get a +9-10 key in the chest every week. Keep on doing that key and wow suddenly your 900+ Rio without any excluding factor present. Will it make it easier to find a group? Probably… but the issue about the 30 guys and 20+ rejections will persist.

42

This is a good requirement … when you want to play keys with players that should be able to do a key about in time.

However everyone forming a group has the right to choose a goal. And if the goal is to push +2 or +3 (maybe they missed a few weeks and have a rather low key), why should they be held to an arbitrary standard?
If someone looks for players who are willing to carry, why wouldn’t they be allowed to? Noone has to join those groups and if those groups require more score than you can offer, these people either have higher goals than you probably are able to achieve currently or they are entitled to get carried and it seems you don’t like this kind of entitlement (I don’t either).

Setting to high requirements is a non issue, because if those people would lower their named requirements they would not have lowered their goal and probably just leave the key.
Look for players with the same goal as you and you will get much more enjoyable runs than trying to sneak into other runs with different goals.

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