It was a bad system and I dont want it to return~
I dont want to farm two sets to play this game and fortunately to me Ion dont want to do that as well 
PvP stat to murder people for free before they will find some expertise items pff~ fun as hell
Good for me that noone listens to you
It wasn’t. It injected a degree of fairness in the game that the current system cannot accomplish.
Also, back in MoP and WoD the amount of “effort” you had to put into getting your full PvP set was really not that huge, so it’s not like you had to put ungodly amount of hours to get your “second set of gear”, and in MoP you didn’t even need PvP gear to do well in wpvp, it was only really needed for instanced pvp content.
Oh and you could even spend your pve tokens to get high-end PvP gear iirc, so there really was no real downside to it.
What if you are just assuming things, since pvp gear is not even implemented in the alpha?
The person I replied to was assuming that PvP vendors will fix the current PvP fiasco. I’m just showing a scenario where it would not fix anything.
Hey, posted in the same topic the link of the PvP vendor at oribos.
i relink again for you what PvP vendor at Oribos in Shadowland Alpha has to offer :
No I wont. When Im fully geared for PvP I enjoy PvP until next expansions prepatch breaks it again. Every single PvPer I used to know quit WoW when PvP gear was removed and PvE became dominant.
If I can get PvP pieces from PvP in Shadowlands thats fine. If I get to upgrade them via PvP token system that matches to current PvE Tier in equal strenght its good. But if PvE still remains stronger Im simply not going to play.
Resilience is gone from the game and damage is halved in PvP. Wether that is a good thing remains to be seen. Right now there is too much HP and auto-proc-damage-healing-shields.
That problem is not only for pvp players, pve players have to get specific pvp pieces and trinkets as well. The difference is they dont whine and some of them adapt.
Personally i wont play something i dont like, although im not gonna bother whine about it on the forums.
The sad truth is… Casuals play one aspect of the game, the truly good players shine both in pvp and pve. Ive met alot of them , therefore i can only see whiners whining because they need to whine. Thats all
Truly good players play what they want to play. I like tennis not badminton. I like soccer not hockey. Our way of playing and enjoying the game has been taken away. If Shadowlands lets me get gear via PvP activities that equals PvE tier, I have no problem.
And not everybody have time to do both PvE and PvP. And I have zero interest in listening 20 random unknown people, their squeaky girly voices and their cheat addons either.
Virtually the top pvpers say that the current system is something they strongly dislike. (to put it mildly)
At least the ones who stream or have an audience in general do… They just tend to not post on the forums about it that often.
Also, you’re right that the current system is doubly bad for a casual pvper, which I see as a problem in itself.
I knew a lot of people who enjoyed just spamming BGs and doing occasional wpvp.
The game has no place for them anymore, even though it accommodated them in some capacity from TBC up to Legion. Not anymore though.
Kinda sucks when the game changes and suddenly forces another type of content onto you as a prerequisite before doing other, entirely different type of content.
Who has time to do raids and Arenas all the time? Nobody. Give PvE heroes Valor and Justice so they can buy PvP pieces by doing PvE. Let us PvPers gain them via PvP. Problem solved and everybody is happy except special no-life snowflakes and you should never ever cater MMO for less than 1% playerbase who are nothing in real life.
In your opinion. We’ve been over this.
Good for you I guess, why actively talk against it when others want it to be reverted to something that worked, though? How does that go against what you like to do in the game? You still haven’t answered that. It’s just the usual contrarian garbage I see so often on these forums, isn’t it?
Now i get it.
Im pretty sure pve players say exactly the same thing, its the whole system that is problematic. Not pvp problems only i guess
Indeed but do not forget blizzard gives us what we whined previous patch for.
Virtually every bad grind change is due to OMG IM BORED whinings on the forums.
Why? What exactly is the problem for casual BG spammers?
They get a weekly chest, they get blue’s. I fail to see the problem here.
His fun in making edgy comments on the forums. He’s either trolling or on a crusade against normal pvp systems and… basically against people having fun without him.
I just read his comments and fkn hell dude, it’s not normal to say something like:
or
I mean wow…
No, he wants you to farm 6pieces of azerite gear (full rng) and 2 full sets of gear with proper stats, 1 for pve and 1 for pvp.
Instead of farming honor and taking out the pieces YOU want you like this current system where you farm endlessly what THEY want you to farm.
Clever guy you are.
The difference between the amount of time a pve player has to spend on acquiring their pvp pieces and the time it takes for a pvp player to get their pve pieces is enormous.
Pve players will farm 1 trinket and 1 ring or azerite or whatever which takes a few hours in bgs or 1-2 hours in arenas per season while for pvp players it takes the same amount per week, or more.
Arena barely gives any gear, bgs give you like 425 ilvl I think while everyone else who has pve gear rocks in 470 and the damage/healing difference is huge.
I don’t dispute that, the entire progress system that’s buried in systems that bump up daily retention is bad imo, really burns people out I find.
It’s just that in order to do PvP, you have to engage in PvE in nearly the same amount of hours put into it as a PvE’er would in order to remain viable, even in casual content.
I do realize that PvE also has that same ‘mandatory’ problem with PvP content in terms of essences and maybe certain trinkets, but the 2 are very disproportionate in the sheer amount of time investment.
I don’t know, maybe.
I can only say that I personally have never “run out of things to do” in previous expansions and what have you. I could always level or gear an alt, or take my fully decked char into a BG and have fun just playing the game, or dabble in all that ‘other’ content like PvE, at my own pace and my own terms.
I think my previous paragraphs alluded to this, so I won’t just pointlessly repeat myself.
So you farming right now an HC raid to get 2 items is harder from what a pve player must do: 2200? Rating for max ilvl item and wait for it to drop on the chest for better ilvl.
You serious now or you wanna pull the victim card like the rest?
Yep, but once again when it did not like WoD they complained 
Later came legion and they made it a nightmare, i had to quit it. BFA is ligher for me pre S4 tho.
Not really, both a pve+pvp player need super bis gear to remain viable at high difficulties. You want to tell me you cant reach 2k without destra trinket? I highly doubt so…
PVE players actually have to invest alot more time im afraid. I know we can argue about that but… I guess everyone to his own view. Thats why i dont do it, it was the best thing for me!
I didnt run out of things to do even in WoD the game has an endless amount of things to do.
Nice dodge, but as far as i could see from WoD or example you could not get any epic item from BG’s it was just blues. Now in BFA though you have the chance to get epics when you cap, at the end of the week. WoD for example again needed rated content to give you any conquest.
Take a dh for example:
2 weapons from ra-den + drest trinket + shoulder and chest azerite items from the raid as high item level as you can and like 6 or 7 items from mythic+ to be BiS for pvp.
From pve point of view: you need 1 trinket from the pvp chest which you can choose once you opened your weekly pvp chest 2-3 times and reach 1600 cr.
I was serious, you can’t even compare the two.
Its not only 1600, there is not only 1 pvp trinket and its not only a trinket.
Several classes need azerite pieces from pvp as well. From the few i know is dk and shadow.
Farming drest+raden right now is a joke. Getting the bis trinket at a viable ilvl + the correct chest at a viable ilvl is probably 10 times harder.
You should not be serious, but yes not even close as you see above
WoD is a divisive expansion, but there are a good portion of people from PvP focused audience specifically that did not mind the WoD progression system apart from some BiS items being locked behind the RNG box from Ashran weekly. What problems people had in terms of PvP were about either class design or Ashran box, not the overarching gearing process.
I find that most of the complaining about WoD came from PvE audience, which is fair, PvE requires much more hefty feed of new stuff to run through, and WoD really dropped the ball in that regard.
The difference is that PvE content scales fairly well to your gear, whereas PvP content cares not for how well or badly geared you are, even in the casual activities.
In other words, you can much more effectively decide your own “cap-point” in pve, which is fine, but also makes me say that the 2 types of content ergo should not be conjoined in the manner that they are. Because they’re functionally so different, yknow.
And no, I don’t need Drest trinket for 2k, I’m currently 2.1k without it, but it is still an ABSURDLY strong trinket in PvP, and just having it will give you a considerable edge over someone who does not. And unlike in PvE, not having a certain BiS piece when others do will hurt your progress much more than it would in PvE, because you will need to play against it.
It wasn’t a dodge. I just didn’t want to reiterate the burnout point, which does hit a PvPer harder than a PvE’er due to the PvE prerequisite not having an endpoint in the same capacity as the PvP prerequisite does.
And unlike in PvE, you have no ability to play PvP in an enviroment that accommodates to your lower gear level.
Again, not something I want fixed per se, but it is, again, the reason why I think a separate progression path is required. Because the 2 don’t have a 1 for 1 conversion due to the nature of both content types working so differently.
You also could get fairly viable gear just doing BGs starting from TBC all the way up to WoD (with Wrath having some issues in that regard due to there not being any honor/rating-free gained weapons).
In TBC you could buy gear from 2 seasons ago with honor, and it was perfectly adequate for random BGs, and at least in MoP and WoD, maybe Cata too, you got a token amount of conquest points from BGs, I fully decked out my priest doing just casual BGs back in WoD in fact, months after people who did ranked did, but it was doable.
Apologies for typing a wall of text, but I feel like I’m going to be told to be “dodging” if I don’t.
Well I mean the raid is out now for 6 months, obviously it is easy to get in a pug every week and farm the items you want but when we’re talking about a season start you’ll never get into a hc pug as a pvp player for weeks, in fact pure pvp players aren’t welcome in guild hc runs either, at least in my experience.
The trinket/azerite is guaranteed once per conquest cap cycle tho.
Also this. Very much this.
Yes its always these pve players, right? 
Cmon mate
You can do exactly the same in pvp.
Afterall all these PVE geared cheaters will climb really high and you will miss them right? The you can progress your own 2200 or whatever your point is. Now if you wanna climb to 3k, its like climbing to top 100-200 world kills nzoth or like 5k rio and all that is not easy.
Good, i dont need pvp gear for the content i do but i told you again many do its not only the pvp’ers problem.
Yeah be around 4000 M+ rio without bis gear, try it.
Or try a raiding nzoth for example without being carried by $$$ without a good gearset.
Things are not as you “imagine”
Again the PVP victim card, let me explain you:
At the start of the season i need to play at least 2-3 hours a day M+.
I have to raid 9 hours a week
This, is not to reach HC content.
Now the WQ activities is something both have to do, no need to mention.
But for the very best example, in start of S4 i should be focusing to all above + at least 1900 rating in pvp or more to get corruptions. I choose to NOT do it, PVP players could do a M+ and get their corruption from weekly chest and have spare time to come and drown all forum people with their tears.
That, does not mean you need to invest more time.
All need to invest time but only the pvp players pulling victim cards here.
You will never get in a pvp pug with decent players either, i pushed around 1600 for my essence with people sitting inside a smoke bomb and flaming me i didnt heal them. Thats not only your problem im afraid.
Everything takes time, but im not talking about this trinket the highest ilvl comes from chest. Not cap cycle reward.