P2 shadow priest

i have a feeling that shadow priest will become a staple in every raid comp, much like TBC and WOTLK SP, 1 SP per raid,

with the increase in shadow damage via new runes and talents, void plague, shadowform, darkness etc, + new runes we do not yet know of,

paired with vampiric embrace and 2 points in improved, is 30% of the dmg converted into raid/party wide healing, which can be the difference between a wipe or kill,
on top of that raids with warlocks will benefit from shadow weaving a 15% shadow dmg increase,

i think shadow will finally be seeing many raids with a sp spot, lets be real it wont be topping meters which we have warriors, rogues and hunters for anyway, but shadow will sure be welcomed,

anyone think otherwise?

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In my opinion - you’re full on copium.

Right now Shadow is so terrible, that outside getting some crazy runes in P2 and/or major buffs to existing runes - it will remain a dogwater DPS spec.

Everyone gets 31 talents and for almost everyone they have major boosts in them not unlike what Shadowpriests get.

You get to be a cloud and a situationally useful utility, but damage-wise, many have comparable increases with these extra talent points. Except their starting point is almost double yours.

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well of course a hunter would think its copium, which has nothing to do with what im saying btw, im looking at the numbers and predicting, so no copium here,

shadowform and darkness alone is a 25% dmg increase, like i said paired with vampiric embrace, 30% raid/party wide healing, also most raids have warlocks… you think warlocks would say no to a 15% increase in their shadow dmg, if a warlock is tanking guess what, more threat,

all you mentioned is dps, i said that SP wont be topping meters, did you only read the first line?

youve done a typical " zugzug brain " thing, completely ignored everything i said and focused on pure dps.

youre focusing on the individuality, im talking about a raid environment, unless theres a boss which requires 1 player to kill it…

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I am not only playing one class and in fact, it’s not even my main - it’s Warlock.

And what I am writing is a reality of when you go look at WCL - Warlocks do roughly 50% more damage than Shadowpriests right now and Hunters almost 70% more.

You know what this means? If Shadowpriests would exclusively get 31 talent points right now - they still would do less damage than Warlocks and Hunters - they’d be roughly where Mages are now currently with 16 tp.

That’s how bad it is and it’s nothing to do with Zugzug brain - it’s a simple combination statistics and math.

But hey, you get to cosplay as a bad version of Arcane Mage healer once in a while.

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no no i am fully aware of what SP is now, im not arguing that, even before SOD was released i couldve told you hunters and warlocks would’ve been much better, which is why i titled the thread " P2 ",

again youre talking about dps?, dps dps dps dps dps dps dps, do i think is P2 SP will be doing big dmg, no i have never said that,

our brains work differently, in your head you’re smacking the keyboard trying to pump…looking at WCL and seeing pure dmg numbers, of course its that way, which makes sense if you play hunter, all 3 specs deal dmg…its all you know.

in mine, im seeing a potential utility class that converts its dmg into healing while buffing another classes dmg,

again we dont know the new runes yet, its just an interesting topic to predict,

pre SOD: " i wonder if ret paladins will ever be good in classic? "
" COPIUM "

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Yes, 1 spot and a few bench… just like classic. More than 1 SP is useless, but it’s always a good thing to bring as many warlocks as possible

which is exactly what im saying, you didnt see more than 1 SP in tbc and wrath. i may have writen that wrong, i meant to say many raids will have a spot for a SP.

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I mean, what we’re trying to tell you here is that so far SoD gives no indication whatsoever that SP will be worth to bring to raid besides one token SP for the shadow debuff.

And quite frankly? If Warlocks actually switch to fire full time - even that one spot may go, except for just MC/BWL.

okay we may have been arguing for no reason then, im saying every raid i predict will have a spot for 1 sp,

i do not at all think multiple SP’s will be in the same raid,

have we been in agreement this whole time?

I don’t think so, as warlock main in SoD the following I find to be pretty nonsense:

on top of that raids with warlocks will benefit from shadow weaving a 15% shadow dmg increase,

i think shadow will finally be seeing many raid spots,

The reason being - Warlocks now gone full fire, it’s stronger by a mile compared to Shadow and this trend will likely continue in P2.

So, the one sole reason to even bother with SP in raids is not there. And if you bring no damage and no real utility, then what is the reason for SP existence in raid?

So, the bottom line is - given the reality of the above and the fact that warlocks gone fire and it’s not likely to change in P2 - I just don’t see why you’re so optimistic about spriests P2.

In my opinion Spriests need massive buffs and some serious runes in P2 to even be on the radar for raiding.

the increased shadow dmg taken to the boss is not the sole reason at all, i merely said that as an addon to the other utility i mentioned,

you dont see why im being so optimistic? because its season of discovery, and were in the first phase,

did warlocks top meters in classic? no,
did hunters top meters in classic ? no,
was ret good in classic pve? no
were warlocks, rogues or shamans tanks in classic? no
were mages healers classic? no
was SP good at the start of SOD? no…

" yeah rogues are tanks and mages are healers but SP will never be good …"

how can you not be optimistic in SOD is beyond me.

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Warlocks were top 3 in classic meters btw

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I mean you do you.

I just don’t share your outlook on this due to several simple reasons:

  1. Shadow Priest damage is extremely subpar, they are lagging 40% or more behind almost every class besides Shamans as far as DPS goes.
  2. The biggest reason to bring Shadow Priest to the raid is taking a hit by Warlocks going full fire.

So, given the above 2 points, not only there is no reason whatsoever to bring multiple Shadow Priests for DPS spot in raids, but there may not even be any reason to bring them at all. Vampiric Embrace just does not cut it.

Could there be some super wild Shadow Priest rune that changes everything? There could… or not. I can’t guess that, I can only operate based on information we do have.

i think warriors, rogues and fire mages say differently.

Pre-AQ40 were warlocks and warriors

im not taking this thread 100% seriously, im just looking at the numbers we have now, adding that to the talents we’ll be getting, and wondering if we will be getting BIG runes,

the main word i use is predict, im not saying for sure or putting anything down,

it is season of discovery, and to not be optimistic is going against the principles of SOD itself.

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Well, if we’re talking about hopes and feelings then sure.

I mean, if Spriests pop off, I’d be glad too because they are quite cool. It’s just they have some very serious gaps to close here.

Im afraid im looking at AQ40 on WCL, and warriors, rogues, mages and hunters are before warlocks…
unless you have found more bullet proof data.

Warlocks were a middling dps in Vanilla and Classic Vanilla. It wasn’t a top 3 class.

With newfound fire powers though, I wonder how it will go down the road.

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isn’t it hopes and feelings the reason why rets are feeling great right now, why enhancers have been teased at getting a 2h rune in phase 2?

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