Something to offer is not enough to make 1v1 good. Something to offer is mostly in context of playing with teammates.
I am not a Blizzard defender by any means. They dropped the ball on PVP hard. It’s just that 1v1 specifically is a dead end. It cannot work.
“Providing equal skill, SP can heal so he’ll lose agaist a melee but at the same time, he can heal so has the advantages against other caster. Same for the mage, he’ll lose against the hunter since the hunter can have 1) more range 2) better heal and movement to los the mage.”
Mage has healing abilities like Temporal Shield, and back in the day they had Evocation which could top their health. Classes don’t need to have the same abilities for them to be viable and balanced against each other. A Mage cannot heal as well as a Shadow Priest, but he can kite better, snare better, whereas a Shadow can heal better and dispel himself. It’s a different type of style, but provides equal opportunity (if balanced properly) to win. That’s what matters. Not SAME gameplay, but SAME potential for grabbing a win.
“Again, it’s not balanceable unless you gave to each class something to counter the opponent strength”
Which isn’t happening in 3v3 and never did, so try again. You’re actually sad at this point… ![:slight_smile:](https://d1bg94bbsh66ji.cloudfront.net/en/wow/images/emoji/twitter/slight_smile.png?v=6" ":slight_smile:")
"3vs3 is more balanced. "
Listen, you’re actually getting on my nerves at this point. Disagreeing with me is fine, but saying things over and over for which you have never made a proper argument is almost crossing the line into severe trolling.
“There always going to be a better comp than the others”
AND HOW IS THAT DIFFERENT IN 1V1?
Holy crap.
@Mellinora
“Something to offer is not enough to make 1v1 good. Something to offer is mostly in context of playing with teammates.”
Uh, why do you need teammates for a certain gamemode to “have something to offer”? What are you on about? Jeez.
“It’s just that 1v1 specifically is a dead end. It cannot work.”
I can name a handful of good Rogues, Mages, etc., because very few play 3v3/serious PvP. I can name tons of players having quit because 3v3 is crap and never properly balanced.
Can you name a good reason why 1v1 would be WORSE than 3v3 in any way mechanically/gameplay-wise? Name one. GO ON.
Notice I also never said 1v1 should be added simply NOW, but with a TOTAL CHANGE in balance, meaning add like +15 spells to each spec so as to make 1v1 a sophisticated gamemode.
You know what would be better about 1v1? People actually relying on their own skill. People actually spending hours a day playing and not sitting in LFG. People actually having a chance to compete against established players who are carried by the weight of their BNet friendlist.
When Blizzard decides to make PvP great, 1v1 will come. Wait for it.
I told you what the reason is. Everyone has to be universal or the meta settles into excluding 90% of the specs. Both cases are boring. The end.
You know why 1v1 works in, say, HS? Because there, 1 is not really 1, there are different decks you can play for each class. And the balance there is not terribly great even with that.
You think if one or two specs are too good that it cannot be balanced?
It cannot be balanced without making specs universal and this is boring.
Sure, add more healing to kiters, so they will be even stronger than now against melee.
Dude, everyone in this 3d is telling you 1vs1 is a bad idea that won’t work.
We’re getting on your nerves because you won’t listen.
1 vs 1 is a rock / paper / scissor game.
3 vs 3 is more balanced. You can have comp of all kiters, all casters, all melee or mixed to try balance out the possible enemy team strength, and on top of that, in a 3vs3 match you have the strategy component, something you totally missed. There are many many combinations of possible fight outcome in a 3vs3 due to how your team is and how you decide to fight that makes the system much more balanced than how ever a 1vs1 can be.
It’s like Mellinora said, It’s either everyone is the same, or you have a meta that excludes 90% and it’s boring again.
They have to be UNIVERSALLY CAPABLE and not “universal” in that they offer the exact same thing. I already explained how that would work. Mage vs SP. Mage can kite. SP can heal. Mage can root/snare. SP can dispel himself.
The important thing is how well it makes them both able to win, and that’s all that matters.
@Tahen
“Sure, add more healing to kiters, so they will be even stronger than now against melee.”
Meanwhile you can give melee mortal strike (which already exists), good damage uptime (already exists), or something else creative to balance it out?
You’re saying “there could be issues, therefore it’s bad”. I say: There can and will be issues, but as with everything else, you can have something great that is also not perfect. 3v3 is also imperfect. Let’s remove it?
"Dude, everyone in this 3d is telling you 1vs1 is a bad idea that won’t work.
We’re getting on your nerves because you won’t listen."
Bahahaha, just like the Vatican told everyone else we’re wrong about disbelieving a man 2000 years ago dying and coming back to life. Give me a break. I don’t give a damn who disagrees. None of you gave a good argument in favour of 3v3 over 1v1.
"1 vs 1 is a rock / paper / scissor game.
3 vs 3 is more balanced."
Right NOW 3v3 is more balanced because Blizzard are balancing around 3v3 and not 1v1. If they decide to focus on 1v1, it will be a different story.
Adding more spells to classes will also add more complexity and make 1v1 very flexible so that you can have a winning strategy no matter which spec you play. 3v3 is no different in terms of balancing per se. You fix one comp, you ruin another, etc.
Clearly you’re a 1500 rated player… max.
Look, let me offer you an example.
LoL has both team matches and solo matches. LoL’s balance is much better than WoW on all metrics. WoW PVP team are complete babies compared to LoL guys, WoW PVP team never even tried to balance to anything other than “spec representation at the top” and even on that single not-great metric they look far worse than LoL team who balance to multiple more involved metrics. LoL balance is lightyears ahead of WoW.
Yet, what happens in LoL solo play? The vast majority of matchups are considered to be hopelessly one-sided. The number of heroes who are in any way viable for endgame is something like 10% of all heroes, in many cases with very specific builds. In tournaments, they have to have a ban phase otherwise it becomes a fest of the same five classes. And even with that it is boring, and the mode is considered just something you sometimes play for fun, while the real game is team-based.
1v1 is a relic of the past. It is inherently not interesting.
Cool story. That has to do with 1v1 balancing being harder than 3v3 exaaaaactly how? ![:frowning:](https://d1bg94bbsh66ji.cloudfront.net/en/wow/images/emoji/twitter/frowning.png?v=6" ":frowning:")
I am saying 1v1 balancing makes things boring and so 1v1 is a dead-end. I feel like I repeated this enough times already. If you are unconvinced, so be it.
Again, if you keep adding spell to counter the opponent strengths, you’re making classes all the same since to counter every possibile opponent, you need to be able to do everything. Boring and nonsense, won’t be wow anymore.
If you don’t, some classes will just be stronger like rogues and war were in vanilla and everyone will play those.
I really don’t know how to expain it better than this.
That’s what we already have in 3v3. We have spells to counter enemy spells. I have Dispersion as Shadow to counter the burst of braindead specs like your Retardin. That doesn’t mean gameplay isn’t fun. You can MANEUVER AROUND. Just because you CAN counter someone doesn’t mean you WILL. In a complex game, someone can do something that you CAN counter, but you may need the talent and practice. For example, you need to know which heals to use and when if a Mage bursts on you (hypothetically). Maybe smaller heals and not big heals. Maybe more mana-light heals. There are ways to make 1v1 really fun, unpredictable and complex.
Hey, come back to me when you explain how 3v3 is easier to balance. Say HOW. Danke schÖÖn!
@Mellinora
If you think 1v1 is boring, that’s your opinion.
I think LFG is boring.
I think people having advantage in 3s progress because they have a full BNet friend list is boring. And unfair.
1v1 is the future. Deal with it.
If i came up against a paladin 1v1 i’d just give up ![:frowning_face:](https://d1bg94bbsh66ji.cloudfront.net/en/wow/images/emoji/twitter/frowning_face.png?v=6" ":frowning_face:")
Sure, because your 6 second damage reduction is absolutely going to save you from a 30sec burst window.
I fell of my chair at this.
“Non c’è peggior sordo di chi non vuol sentire”.
“Sure, because your 6 second damage reduction is absolutely going to save you from a 30sec burst window.”
So either I die after Dispersion (no balance) or I live (due to playing with a healer in my team) and therefore I can counter your burst, rendering your burst meaningless and useless.
That’s balanced gameplay with fun mechanics? And 1v1 is not? xD
“Non c’è peggior sordo di chi non vuol sentire”.
“The Lord will cause you to be defeated before your enemies. You will come at them from one direction but flee from them in seven, and you will become a thing of horror to all the kingdoms on earth.”
This got me interested by the way and I went to check your armory.
It looks to me that you played mostly 2v2, not terribly well, and it’s only in the last season that you paid for a carry to get glad in 3v3.
I suggest not throwing stones when you are in a glass house.
Telling a 3k player who is way more talented than you that he “paid to get carried” shows how incredibly jealous you are. I mean, if you think I did, do show the evidence.
Jealousy is a bad feeling though. Can’t say it’s true as I tend not to feel it, but rumours have it that it shortens life.
Don’t be sad about your 1500!
So now you have a team?
And also, what do you think my teammate will do when you disperse? Leave you healer alone happy to cast on you? Or it’s going to do some CC/damage?
Team strategy, this unknown mistery.
Anyone with a brain can look at the achievement dates and note that you only suddenly got talented two months ago and never were particularly talented before.
“Anyone with a brain can look at the achievement dates and note that you only suddenly got talented two months ago and never was talented before.”
You are so incredibly stupid and sad… holy crap. I never played a full WoW season and only played WoD and Legion to level and have fun. Was unsubbed most of the time. Came in BfA and took 3v3 seriously the one season and got my rating because I am talented. You can watch me on streams facing top pro players all the time at high mmr. So get a grip, dumbass.
I know 3000 is a lot for someone who only needed 2 months of a season to get it, but that’s the difference between me and a monkey like you.
@Tahen
“So now you have a team?”
Omg. IQ level 80. I swear. If you’re higher than that, I’ll give you 100 euro. Please take a Mensa test, okay? You don’t have more than 80. No way, no way…
"And also, what do you think my teammate will do when you disperse? Leave you healer alone happy to cast on you? Or it’s going to do some CC/damage?
Team strategy, this unknown mistery."
Of course you can counter what I do. THAT’S THE POINT. Whether you can counter things in 3v3 or 1v1 IS THE SAME THING.