Yes. Also he doesn’t seem to concered in the vid, more worried about ST.
Indeed, what the fire mage can do with PI and evoker+half dungeon pulls is not normal. But is it the correct way to nerf only the mage? Because its scaling well with the two other class? Then what will be the recommandation? With a fire mage you cant do a single run whiteout PI and Evoker, because the nerfs which were mainly due to them, its just a nonsense. Not one class should be specifically nerfed because it is overscaled with a triple class combo.
You commenting as a priest, the sh was reworked like 6 times since SHLANDS. They strengthened/lightened it even when it was already S tier. So as a priest you can tell me which class deserves a rework, after almost 2 years, no other class received any attention, only the priest.
Even after the paladin rework everyone was spitting on the paladins, but are the priest buffs ok? and also the fact that the SH priest is slowly becoming an indispensable factor in every m+ teams.
There’s really a bit of a problem with the hunters, but it’s stupid to say it’s not suitable for 20+ keys. The biggest problem for hunters starts with the fact that it is the most popular class and there are a lot of bad hunters.
I know several hunters, with all 3 specs you can do outstanding dps and not dying in every s***. But the average RANDOM hunter you meet is definitely BM, and definitely useless, because all the idiots want to play with it.
It is true that something should be strengthened on the defensive side, but this is not a new topic and is not rooted in 10.1.5.
Even WITHOUT pi or augmentation fire mage is great atm, just did a +16 HoI the fire mage did 150k overall, we didnt had priest or evoker. Most hunters we know dont have brains but they will be the least favored class for any group right now, they have no utility, long defensives cd, an immunity that you can laugh at tbh. So yes they need a desperate change.
Well the ST nerf is part of the nerfs, which I addressed before you started busting my balls about the 11% aoe. If it was only the ST nerf, or only the aoe nerf, I wouldn’t be here moaning that it is way too much of a nerf.
I’ll think there will be a lot of tuning over the next few weeks. Tuning the augvoker is new and difficult for them I imagine. I can see them getting everything balanced and tuning that last so its easier to tune and people try out the new spec while its op. Mages and paladins were the obvious place to start, bear nerf and a few spec buffs this week maybe then figure out augvokers.
Sp as well but sp is kinda hard to hit. Their AoE damage is very good but there are specs that do comparable or more aoe in larger pulls, and their ST isn’t great at all so finding a way to nerf them that doesn’t impact that when their damage is effectively a cleaving st rotation. It’s the utility that’s a problem and it’s all very binary with things like mass dispel and mind soothe either being enormous value or completely worthless.
Clearly wasnt too much of a nerf.
Your still top.
Start with PI, nerf the external part to 10% or something. Should never have got rid of seer, or at least replaced it with a different aoe spender. O, I know, reduce shadow crashes dmg and cd so you can apply more dots but then have deminishing returns on link’s spread dmg, the more targets you hit the (slightly) less dmg you do to each one. Square root scaling or whatever. That’d be great for tuning. They should do that with ignite too tbh. Works themeatically too!
I was playing a lot of shadow before the 10.1 changes. Then it had the same problem as fire had, same build (mostly) and same rotation on ST and multi target. Gets dull.
I think it could be easy to fix SH, remove Psychic Link give back Mind Sear and let them do aoe damage with multi dots. +As i remember there was a good stuff in shadowlands i dont remember the name of it but when you channeled mind sear then you could push it as an extra tick or something like that.
I think it was much more enjoyable than now, but for example, I also liked the previous version where the mind sear was a spender.
It is true that it had quite a lot of spells before, which sometimes didn’t even needed because of the higher pripriity ones, but it would have been enough to pick out a few of them, not to switch to a full passive aoe damage class.
Mage dropped behind UH and Demo in raid for the new week and the M+ logs don’t have a week 11 rubric yet, so what are you basing your wrong assessment on?
The fact mage in turn is above these both in m+
And being top 3 is being a top performing specc 
my god, play a different class for a moment. Thinking ur over nerfed cuz ur top 3 and not number 1…
Ur still a meta specc across the board.
And before u say “what if” unholy is in the bottom of m+ logs and warlocks are mid. Trying to act as if ur gonna drop beneath them, simply aint gonna happen
Logs may not be in, but all the highest keys run since wednesday still run with mages in every case. So no. Not a wrong assessment, anyone of high level play is still running it, which means its extremely likely its still the meta class.
’ [+30 Neltharus (32:51) - Mythic+ Keystone Run (raider .io)](https:// raider .io/mythic-plus-runs/season-df-2/15448135-30-neltharus)’
oh looky. mage still in the highest runs of this week
‘[Mythic+ Rankings (DF Season 2 - Timed Runs Only - Tyrannical, Storming, Raging) (raider. io)] (https:// raider. io/mythic-plus-affix-rankings/season-df-2/all/world/leaderboards-strict/tyrannical-storming-raging)’
heres all the runs this week, Check the log times if u really wanna check it out, ALL RUNNING MAGE. ALLLLLL RUNNING MAGE amazing that isnt it lmao, Imagine being the most used class In the Meta in M+ top 3 in Raids and then saying “we got nerfed too hard”. bruh.
we all know, what edges out the win In regards to raids, will be at sheer disparity, because priority of Augs buffs and PI will be focused on them, the fact that shift had since Minor impact on mage is Outstanding realistically, Just as we’ll see Demo and Unholy DK get nerfed next.
Ion said they would not do nerfs anymore that remove specs from the top that happened to land there due to a new patch or tier. Somehow they were able to keep their word for Shadow and Ret, but not here. So forgive me if I put very little stock in your take on this. M+ meta is still very affected by last week and people are slowly coming to new conclusions.
Except from the litteral fact this patch caused 1 speciifc combo to be the only used comp for m+ entirely while dominanting the raid meta simultaniously.
It created one of the most rigid and exclusive metas to exist.
Did u by any chance only roll a mage because u knew itd be completely busted and hoped to remain so for the remainder of season 2 by any chance?
Ret was nerfed in season 2 several times, and so has shadow been nerfed repeatively.
Ret isnt even used in current meta? And hasnt been meta for quite a while now, might wanna keep up with info
As for shadow u wut? Theyve been nerfed 4 times over the course of this season! Lmfao their meta for their utility not their dps
Theyre not gonna delete shadows dispels or PI that are making them so vital right now mid season.
But theyve defintly had their damage nerfed several times lmfao
Expecting Ion to honor words, in the extremes this has became is ridiculous and remotely believing the game should hold a ground where 3 speccs are the only representation in game is insane.
Theres being top. And theres litterally killing 99% of the entire class pool, its absurd ud even beleive so. Being top is fine, however that doesnt mean it should be completely limitless to how far the gap is.
U were like 30% stronger then alternatives. Lol.
Slowly??.. u beleive the people who sit on PTR perfecting runs practicing bzck to back with comps, are slowly coming to new conclusions. After pushing +30s this week.
If mage dropped from meta, theyd of dropped the class before the patch even launched, just like they did with the class they played prior this patch.
We are 4 months deep into testing this meta lol. If something overtook mage, itd already be there lmao. These players will drop a class at the hint of meta change.
Aug went from non existant to the most played class in keys over night
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That was 1 week of data and which spec do you think caused that? Could be the brand new support spec that makes everbody fly through the roof? Dont overwork your marbles on this difficult question. Why are you even getting your panties in a twist over this?
Actually no.
If it was then the comp wouldnt be so precisely what it is. We all know by charts different speccs scale to different degrees from such.
PI is on bloodmallet of u wish to check, some classes gained a far higher increase from augs presence then others.
It didnt make everyones either. Lol, it bolstered everyone for sure. But if u honestly think people just threw a dice and picked mage cuz everythings even stevens its not.
Mage was considerably outperformjng other classes, even with a augs presence.
If you nerf aug u nerf every class retaining the same dps disparity also, so again not a fix. The only solution is to nerf the outlier.
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The reasons were already discussed here. You could catch up on the thread before running your mouth. Just an idea.
Bruh.
Lol we know why fire mage went wild, its overpowered and the implementation of aug espically with a mastery which bolsters one of fires BiS stats involved aswell as being most impactful for dps classes with huge burst (i.e fire mage) through things like breathe caused it to go even wilder.
At the end of the day. You cant have ur m+ meta limited to 3 speccs.
Mage was crazy OP. And aug made it even more insane. It doesnt chsnge the first statement though.
Mage by itself was already crazy OP after its rework
Nobody said it wasn’t. The whole argument in this thread was about how the nerf was too much, especially in sight of the ST nerf. If they had it in them to make 2% tweaks to Shadow and Ret, it seems overkill to bust out the sledgehammer right after they introduced a broken support spec that happens plays a major role in it. The spec has also to exist without PI and Aug.
except from the fact, Ret is now a below Mid pack DPS lol, and isnt highly favorable in any PvE content once again? Also, they freworked it in time to give it one of the worst DPS increases via Its tier set going causing it to naturally scale badly.
and Shadows tweaks were larger then 2%, its the classes utility that caused it to become mandatory u only have to look at raids to reliese its a upper pack DPS, not a Leading
performer.
How can it be a Over nerf. when the stats still show this class to be Meta?.. WHen ur class Drops to mid pack all of a sudden is when u consider a Overnerf lol or something losing viability over night, which none of the mage speccs have sustained.
also as mentinoed above, people were managing very high numbers without PI / Aug with the class also lol
That happened due to a new tier set and scaling, which you very well know (maybe you dont actually). Shadow tweaks were less than 1% on ST and around 4% aoe, which is miles off the treatment mage just got.
That’s your opinion. My opinion is based on what the devs said and did not keep.