Titanforging, masterloot, etc... Blizzard you're killing the game

(Leymaiden) #22

It kinda isn’t. Only your belt and 1 ring is out of place really. It’s within reason.

(Leymaiden) #23

No it wouldn’t.

The performance that matters for a raider is how they handle mechanics in addition to doing their rotations. A patchwerk fight showcases absolutely nothing towards the practical value of a new prospect nor does it provide any form of training towards acquiring such aptitude.

They are absolutely worthless other than providing free loot.

(Ishanku) #24

Did you even read my post? I quit 2 months ago, 1 week after our heroic G’huun kill. The highest M+ I had done was a single +10 not in time. Despite that I was beating the other rogue who was grinding his balls off in M+ since launch, and it definitely wasn’t a L2P or spec issue.

At that point I was outgearing the highest level of content I was doing by about 9 - 10 item levels with limited effort involved. How exactly is this fine? Especially considering I’m not even wearing my highest possible ilvl gear because Blizzard can’t be arsed to balance raid loot for an entire tier so that it isn’t worthless for most classes.

(Leymaiden) #25

The only part that isn’t “fine” about that is that the limited effort involved is due to you being a rogue and in high demand for M+ just by courtesy of your class thanks to poor class utility distribution.

They never did. There were times where Shadow Priest tier sets had Spirit.

(Ishanku) #26

Tell that to mythic Ursoc. It was a simple yet demanding fight.

A raid doesn’t need to entirely consist of fights with 10+ mechanics or stupid gimmicks. Heck, I’d take an Ursoc over a Taloc any day of the week,

(Ishanku) #27

You struggle with reading comprehension, clearly. The “limited effort” I meant was me barely doing any M+ at all. No more than 1 or 2 per week and only 1 at +10 ever because Infested is making me downright hate a game mode that I otherwise just sort of don’t like. By the end of our heroic progress I’m pretty sure I didn’t even bother completing a single one.

How is that somehow related to rogues being utility-bots and being in high demand? Demand is irrelevant if I never sign up to a group.


Seriously I really hope masterloot is never ever ever brought back into WOW, all it led to was power trip raid-leaders, ninja looter pugs, and those giving loot to their friends. Good riddance to it.

Why would you raid just for the gear and not the achievement? I know I couldn’t care less what I ilev I have once I get curve.

I think it is a good thing that those who have no interest in raiding aren’t “forced” to do so. I would much prefer to be raiding with people who are there looking for the achievement and not the gear.

(Gannet) #29

I’m pretty sure the majority of mythic raiders don’t care about TF and as usual you twist facts to fit your conclusion.
All your arguments are laughingly bad yet you keep repeating them like a broken record, furthermore you make it clear you aren’t going to change your mind regardless or what anyone says or any evidence presented so why are you even here?

With these people you weren’t going to kill any bosses anyway, so maybe make sure your goals align with the people who you recruit.

(Rezista) #30

Have you watched Allcraft recently? Josh said it himself along the lines of - I hope the next raid tier is a failiure so that I can quit the game in good conscious. You can keep white knighting as much as you want, the game has like a mil subs in the west combined. Nobody cares how much you try to dispute that Titanforge, PL, lootboxes and casino of mountcraft is anything but the worst Blizzard game made up to date.

(Gannet) #32

Oh some famous player said, in what i assume is like a youtube channel, that he’ll quit the game. This automatically means whatever garbage comes out your mouth must be true. That’s how logic works now? or is that just an appeal to authority?

And here we go again with the subs argument, i thought this was done to death but like a broken record, i don’t like an aspect of the game now therefore whatever bothers me must be the reason for the sub loss.

With such debating skills no wonder that even people who dislike the direction the game is going in don’t support your lunacy, while anyone pointing this one must be a “white knight” blizzard defender.

(Rezista) #33

And hundrets of thousands of other people, because it is pretty much the same thing which can be summed in one paragraph:
Forced PL, no class balance, Titanforge, loot boxes, no gameplay progression at all after lvl 100, professions are in the dumbster, world content is none existant, Warfronts being a free win, AP grind takes place only in expeditions, Mythic+ being absurdly clustered compared to Legion.


you know whats funny?

Masterloot was removed at the start of BfA :joy:

what even is this thread.

(Adirei) #35

Well I have no clue in what guilds you played, but till this day (played since classic with interruptions in wod and mop) I have to encounter one of these things. I agree with you in one point though, masterloot must not be brought back for rnd-grps (say a group consistent less than 70% of a single guild).
It should be very easy to implement something in the Dungeon tool which shows you which loot type is active and to disable the possibility to change after you started an encounter.
And in my honest opinion it’s because of the very bad situation for guild raiding groups, that more and more rnd-groups are seen.

(Iggwilv) #36

Luckily the raiding community is actually very small compared to the non-raiding community

(Adirei) #37

I’m pretty sure, that you’re wrong about what you think myth-raiders opinion is. just look up some of there videos about the current situation of raiding. Especially not the 3-5Guilds who compete for the world first kills. check around ~50-150 in raid clearing rank.

But as long as around 20person in the forums are defending every sh*t that’s done to the game I love so much, that I’m still playing it after 14years, it’s no wonder, that it’s crashing like it is today.

It’s actually not that small. The change to dynamic group numbers and the dungeon tool opened it up to a quite wider audience.

BTW: I personally ain’t a big fan of the dungeon tool but nontheless I see the convenience it’s providing and that it makes the life for smaller guilds way easier, as they can quickly fill up their grps. but the discussion about advantages and disadvantages of the dungeon tool is a possible thread of it’s own. :wink:

(Redoctober) #38

Well spoken OP, titanforging is garbage and should go away along with rng sockets.

(Destruct) #39

Take ML, hardly any ninja’s encounter. Some people abused it yes but that’s is no reason to take it away, Legion was perfect it ruined pugs for me but eh atleats we had ML in guild raids. You could actually help the guy who was having trouble with loot, now? He is screwed untill he gets lucky like the rest.

People praising titanforging also is weird, it’s about the jouney? Well with TF you can skip normal and even HC by doing solo content. Which journey? Which learning curve? Oh yeah “Pff they won’t accept me in their pug for HC G’huun because I have no AotC!” well it used to be IL but since everybody could get close to 370 even before 8.1 by not even doing neither raiding or M+ what other options did they have for a quick confirmation you can actually handle it? Same thing why M+ now also is score based.

Blizzard wanted IL to be measurement of players dedication, titanforging and way too easy and too early in the game catch up gear ruined that.

Also with no TF mythic Uldir loot would be BiS for most us, the only soruce of 385-395. Nope, keep gridning those 370 caches and pray the item drops in a TF stat that actually has your BiS stats or better stats than the raid drops.

Short and precisly what I want aswell, a +10 I wouldn’t even chase I would simply jump to the next raid/dungeon/difficulty because the difference will be 15 Ils standardly. And sockets back nativly will revive JC. My complaints about gear:

-WoD: Away with the RNG socket and bring back a PvE vendor to offset bad luck
-Legion: Why TF? Why did we need it? Also still the socket and well atleast we had vendors which allowed you to select a gear slot, instead of complete RNG boxes
-BfA: Socket, TF, removal of ML, complete removal of vendors and caches replacing them (gotta loves maces and axes as a assassination/sub rogue!), too early and too high catch-up gear introduced.

I don’t know what the expansion after BfA will bring but more RNG than this it can’t get.

(Gannet) #40

This wouldn’t be the first time someone started a crusade against titanforging because some youtuber said it’s bad.
It seems this hysteria comes in waves, shortly after BFA launched a well-known youtuber released a video bashing TF and dozens of “I quit” posts emerged on this forum citing that TF is worse than ever and it ruined the game, DESPITE the facts that compared with Legion (1) weapons can’t TF (2) you have fewer items overall that can TF and (3) the max TF cap was lowered.

So considering these factors some people, who played Legion, believe that TF is worse in BFA because a youtube video told them.

There are some examples pre-BFA aswell, granted most of them are on the old forum, but the story is the same, mindless sheeps stirred up by some youtube video.


Not so, since AOTC came out in wow as an achievement it has been a requirement for lots of pug groups. Prior to that even as far back as WOTLK you would be asked to link the achieve for having completed a raid.

And if people aren’t raiding because of gear progression then it is because they don’t like raiding. I raid all the time regardless of gear. I even brought this guy along in an Uldir Normal despite being 382ilev to help a few guildies on alts tonight.

You should raid for the achievements and because you like it, not for the gear.

Forcing people to raid, anymore than forcing raiders to quest isn’t a good thing.

(Шамсунг) #42

This is a pve game and has always been. Raiding is a part of character development which provided better gear.