Whats up with the balancing?
Demo locks sim like 30k and so does many other classes meanwhile here I am on a 410 equipped with all haste/crit gear, 3 Festermight, 1 tretch and sim only 20k…
Same thing with for example mages (especially fire) that sim Less that Prot Warrior and the same as Guardian druid?
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while I completely agree with you, they more than likely wont change a thing as we’re performing well in arena and historically they’ve never buffed us while in that situation
You know that different spec/classes perform different in different circumstances right?
Some excel on long ST fights, some in Burst AOE.
Unholy is fine in ST.
Not compared to other specs in the game that are way to OP.
Unholy has a nice long burst but thats it, outide of Army of the dead it doesn’t do that much.
A 410 ilvl with best 3x festermmight and 1x trechous with BiS stats on gear should sim more than 20k. I see alot of classes in like 395-400 without optimal gear sim higher or about the same.
Balancing used to be better, now it differs like 50% in damage from Demolock to Firemage/feral druid.
Not just DK is in a bad spot
Demo locks don’t sim anyhigher than you are me, to the point where it is OP.
Again, Unholy dk St is in a fine place. Yes, it strengths is in army of the dead/apocalypse.
But strongly disagree that Unholy is “underpowered” compared to other specs that are “overpowered”
Yes, some specs are better ST, but i find it hard to relate. as i play Unholy every now and then. and feel that Unholy ST compared to other specs is “underpowered”
I tend to agree with OP.
Even following addons like Hekili as closely as possible given the raid situation, lining up cool downs etc, effectively minimizing human error, I still feel like DPS is bad.
It’s the age old story; we don’t have utility, we don’t have raid cool downs like Heroism or Time Warp, we don’t have heals or support abilities, all we really have is damage and we can’t even do that very well.
About the only reason I’m even in my raid group is, with Death Pact, Icebound Fortitude, AMS and Healthstones, I’m not really a burden on the healers so I’m almost guaranteed to be alive for my combat ress.
It doesn’t feel good; it’s like “we don’t really have regular Warlocks or Druids, but we have you and our Blood DK tank, so I guess we have to bring you along.”
Have you even seen the sims from this raid? Its insanely unbalanced. Yes now demolocks has veen nerfed which is good.
But DK is in the bottom with Both UH and Frost. They are still behind like 20-30% (down from 50% behind before 8.1.5) in damage compared to the best classes.
Go watch SimCraft website
Our Single Target isn’t great, but then Unholy really requires haste probably next tier it will scale much better.
It’s just dk doesn’t match in those “some” in any way shape or form. But sure, some classes are good (excluding dk)
I got 1800 Haste, so I got alot 
ST is not the best because they took us Gargolye (now it is as a talent). Iconic skill, focused on ST injuries, all the time, since this character exists.
I would like to get to know the position of developers about the fantasy of the class and how it should look and work.
I remember that DK should be slow but strong. Why, then, warriors and paladins hit harder than us?
I do not mean here the final injuries worked out in the fight after the fight,
but pls compare what injuries are made by the individual skills of these classes to dk.
Why they can hit over 40,50,100k ??? (pvp and pve)
When will the times come that they will have weaker hits than us?
Since we are the slowest class, then we should, in comparison to the other, we should hit over 100-200k right Blizz? Where is your consistency, your logic?
I see a lot of lies.
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Now unholy just summons a lot of slow zombies, that don’t even apply any debuffs like in legion (despite class fantasy about zombies being festering and diseased).
And frost is just throwing snowballs and sometimes blowing a little bit of chilling breath from its mouth.
Agree DPS is not so good to be competitive in M+ or raid groups against DH, mage or rogue, but i think it’s not so hard to boost us, for example azerite trait Magus of Death can stack, or boost DMG from Festering Strike, it will not affect cleave DPS but boost our single target DPS…
Death Knights in general need a buff.
Although the combat ress is a huge utility we don’t really bring anything else to a raid group; I mean, you’d get better damage from Druids or Warlocks who can also combat ress so why bring the Death Knight?
Damage is basically all we have and we don’t do that particularly well.
Maybe the gear is the problem not class itself, you can have crap dps because you have wrong stats, or traits, anyone considered this?
Yes, people have considered this. No, it’s not just gear causing problems.
Is that a single target sim or aoe or dungeon slice?
Actually in BoD the raid Demo lock is (using all bosses here at 75%) doing 23 503.03 dps
Unholy DK is doing 23 489.78.
Right now as of me writing this.
First of all who said I was comparing to the top dps spec? Second, single target sim is a fairly reasonable way to compare dps with other specs/classes, so that’s what I go off of. The issue is that we’ve don’t have the utility to make up for mediocre dps.
Yeah i was wrong there i made assumption as last time i looked demo was right behind shadow priest.
Sims are terrible ways to compare actual data is how you want to use as something could sim 40k more then another spec but if you need to micro manage in to 0.001 of a second every second to do that you will never be able to do it.
It is a good way to approximate what has the potential to be better but it is not a rule of thumb to use. There is a reason we always go back to logs even though we have sims before the raids as different raids give different reasons for why something is good.
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Agree on all points. The real issue, looking at it now, is mostly the amount of setup required to do damage to a target. This, as you correctly stated, is not reflected in the sim. I can’t speak for warlocks, but I’m certain my warrior, paladin, shaman and hunter don’t require quite as much setup on each target to deal dps.
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