I’m not the one wanting anything here. I’m asking what the OP wants. This is not my suggestion. I’m simply inquiring about the details of the OP’s initial post, because – as you kind of point out – there are differences between a PvP vendor and another PvP vendor.
The removal of PvP vendors and honor points/valor points actually made me quit PvP. I was never a hardcore PvPer but i participated in almost every season and really enjoyed completing each armor set. It felt very satisfying to build up a currency over time and then turn it in for a unique armor set that actually impacted my character’s power level.
RNG is just not satisfying. When i finish a battleground and get literally nothing i want for my time investment i’m gonna feel like i wasted my time, and i don’t like wasting time so i quit doing PvP.
Atleast with a PvP currency i never felt like i wasted my time because each battleground brought me closer to my goal, win or lose.
Edit: I just don’t see who blizzard is trying to appease with all this RNG. As a casual PvPer it killed my interest in the activity, and the hardcore PvPers seem to hate it as well, so who is the target audience exactly?
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Nobody is. Really. 
I feel casual PvP players took the bullet even harder since Legion, because at least 2400 rating PvP does provide some decent gear sometimes, but random battlegrounds and sub 1800 Arena and RBG really provides nothing unless it’s a stupid titanforge.
But regardless, the pvp system is pretty much superbad for any kind of pvp player. It’s simply the case that if you don’t want to do mythic+ and raids, you might as well quit, because it’s certainly not satisfying to do half the damage or healing in pvp because you don’t farm pve all day.
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They are pretty much different paths to reach the same effect. Whether you add pvp power and resilience to lower itemlevels which effectively make them behave as if they were higher itemlevel, or you simply give them +40 itemlevels when engaged in pvp combat - same effect.
And that’s harmed by the constant gear resets, again making you feel like you waste your time. It’s like they’re trying their hardest to get people to quit.
Sure, but that’s why I said the devil’s in the details. The side-effects of having Resilience are different from having scaling. So obviously there’s – for me – an inquiry as to which one is preferable and why.
Everyone can say they want a PvP vendor. That’s not difficult.
The difficulty lies in arguing why a MoP PvP vendor is preferable to a WoD PvP vendor (or vice versa) – or your own home-brewed PvP vendor concept.
They’re not all identical just because they involve an NPC that sells items intended for PvP.
If you ask me, I think the WoD style scaling was the more elegant solution. It was easier to comprehend for someone that’s new. They could have even implemented a toggle in the character screen to show the stats in pvp combat, would have been really easy. But at the end of the day, it really doesn’t matter, either of the workable pvp vendor systems is fine.
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i support the essence (boom boom) of this thread. #signed
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Same in Cata we didn’t even have elite sets that increased your power (correct me if I remember wrong) but we had ratings increasing your weekly conquest capa llowing to get geared faster. Yet despite using DS weapons (everybody did it… it was required to stay even/on par) I still went for a full set including weapons, both prot and ret. Used to weapon switch and/or switch to prot if carrying fkags. Completed every set even in MoP when PvP was just worse. I’m still running 6/9 for the third base/honor set and never managed to complete season 2 base set of BfA… FUN! I just conquest cap and stop now, no point with the RNG to grind out.
Back with honor to buy our own gear. It’s a total lottery!
I imagine Blizzard’s goal was to make people continue running the treadmill for all eternity hoping to get the right RNG drops, but instead it seems to have backfired. Like, i’m not even gonna bother trying to get the BfA PvP sets, because i don’t know how long it’ll take. I can get lucky and get it all within a few days, or i can be grinding for the final piece for months. I want a beginning and an end in sight and i want to be able to decide when i want to reach that end-point. I do not want it to be up to RNG.
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I think that people are confusing languages with regions.
e.g. It’s totally possible for a Russian player to create a character on English realms and still use cyrillic letters so some players might think that he/she plays on a Russian realm whereas it’s unlikely that an English player would create a character on a Russian realm and this is the reason that in your case you see only German players on German realms.
imo they aren’t just failing at that but also with balance both in PvE and PvP, there’s almost no diversity, it’s boring to watch the AWC and MDI but maybe that’s the best they can do at this point, dunno.
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Jito, i really dont understand your way of toughts
how the hell can u say doing random BGs doesnt improve your knowledge skills?
go and train on spamming polymorph while fake-casting, improve into doing cross CC, improve by engaging 1v1, improve by traking drs (you can use different addons from gladius that can let u trak drs of everyplayers, so you will get used to timers.)
personally, i become way better than i was when i started improving by spamming BGs and expecially duels!
then you says that resiliance and other worksaround to separate PvP and PvE gear doesnt works…
but let me do an example
i’m full pve geared, a mage cast a fireball on me, i get hit by 100HP and i have 150HP
now i’m full pvp gear, the resiliance make so that now the fireball hits me for 20HP
how the heeeeeeeell in the world would you prefer to go PvE gear? XD
dont ask for numbers because, as i said, its not my work… i just care to try give some feedback and think about the pro/cons, the balancing part its all about them ^^
never said this, but anyway… can you instantly go m+ or raiding aspa you hit cap level? the answare is simple
you can,m but you should not! why? because you dont have the appropriate gear!
and if you add 2 different sets like it used to be, gearing would not take that much time!
think again at the F1 example… if you crash and skip 70% of the races you automatically lose point and will have a disadvantage…
WoW has been ruined by players of your kind to be honest, people that wanna play but cant play more than 8h/week… wow IS grinding, wow IS playng the game A LOT, wow IS time-consuming
all the changes blizzard has done trough years were made to allow pplw with your time to play…
to make you way 12€/month when be able to play like 30-40/h month…
I’m sorry, but after you exposed your weeklt play time, i’m out of the conversation wtih you!
LFG to let people join QUICK…
m+ to let people gear QUICK…
RNG to avoid people the need to farm…
If you really love the game and want to play it, you gonna find the time , otherwise do act like my dad and quit it, even if he still would be able to play it like he used to do in vanilla/tbc with the hardcore raiding system.
i am not sayng “fk you casual” i’m just sayng that WoW changed in a bad way in favor of casual players, removing key-features that where actually good!
in real life i would love to partecipate at downhill racing cups, unlukily i’ve not enough time to train and compete… at this point, i would be right to ask to all the athletes to reduce the time they spend? would i be right to penalize the majority in favor of a minority?
if you say so… idk man you are just wrong 
you could says that the majority now is people like you that play few hours/week … well, at this point just remove evey cap, dont gatekeep content, remove the RNG and the gear from pvp so i can go naked and its all a matter of skills with no progression, with the loss of the RPG part of the game and so on…
I’m curious the hell you gonna answare at this point 
If you play Battlegrounds, then you become better at Battlegrounds.
If you play Arenas, then you become better at Arenas.
You don’t become better at Arenas by playing Battlegrounds.
You might become better at WoW in general, but that can be said for anything you spend time on in the game.
Besides, the angle here was whether your suggestion to grind currency for gear in Battlegrounds so you could compete in Arenas was alt-friendly. It isn’t. It’s not alt-friendly to be forced to do Battlegrounds before you can do Arenas.
And it doesn’t become more alt-friendly even if you “improve your knowledge and skills” which is highly superfluous and intangible
So the devil’s in the detail here, because - like I asked before - how do you add Resilience onto an item budget?
Let’s say a PvE belt has these stats:
+100 Stamina
+100 Intellect
+50 Haste
+50 Mastery
What does the PvP version look like then, with Resilience?
Does it look like this:
+100 Stamina
+100 Intellect
+50 Haste
+50 Mastery
+50 Resilience.
…In which case it’s just flat-out better than the PvE version.
Or does it look like this:
+100 Stamina
+100 Intellect
+50 Haste
+50 Resilience
…In which case you lose an important secondary stat to get the Resilience.
If it’s the former, then I’ll obviouslt want to use the PvE version if I’m trying to complete a World Quest.
If it’s the latter, then the PvP version is by default always superior to the PvE version, because the Resilience is “free” on the item budget.
That’s why it’s always irritating when people say they want Resilience back. They omit saying how. The how is important.
In the past Blizzard opted for the latter of the two options, replacing secondary stats with Resilience. The negative consequence of this was that PvP gear became absolutely terrible at anything except PvP, and it made some classes clunky and slow (because the PvP gear barely had any Crit or Haste).
And with the introduction of Warmode where players can do both PvE and PvP at the same time, having disparity between the gear makes it difficult to equip yourself for everything at the same time. Today you can, because all gear is universally useful.
Considering the fact that I have played since day 1, and I have definitely put a lot more hours into the game than you, I am very thankful and appreciative of the fact that Blizzard keeps the changing playerbase in mind as they continue to develop the game.
When I played WoW 15 years ago I was a teenager. I easily dumped 10+ hours into the game each day.
Today my life is different. I still want to play WoW, but I obviously cannot commit the same amount of time anymore. I appreciate the fact that Blizzard seems aware that the veteran players have grown up and have gotten busier lives, and that WoW needs to accomondate them - not the other way around.
Suit yourself.
So you’re a kid. When you grow up, then get back to me with your 40+ hours played per week. Then we can have this discussion again.
WoW has always been aimed at casuals. That was Blizzard’s intial goal with WoW - to open up the genre to a broader audience than the traditional MMORPGs like EverQuest and Ultima Online. They succeeded with that - and every EverQuest and Ultima Online player who tried out WoW quickly deemed it an MMORPG for casuals - because it is. It’s always been. It’s still today. If you want to play a hardcore MMORPG that’s all about dumping in a lot of hours, then there are better ones out there.
I hated resilience back when it was live and now I miss it so much… 
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i’m out.
this is the most false bullsht i ever heard about WoW hahahha
Casuals? casuals in vanilla? someone call a doctoooor
damn man, i already explained it
add resilience as a bonus stats, lower min stats, gg
this will have the followin consequence
- get pve gear if you wanna compete in pve
- get pvp gear if you wanna compete in pvp
- dont give a single fk about world quest, since this type of content require a ridiculus short amount of time.
tell me how much time you spend for a world quest… its like 2-3 min for each quest! how can you tell me that having ±10ilvl while doing world quest would force you to swap set?! and maybe you even think about farming a whole set for doing world quest? W T F MAN?! what are we even talking about?
you do.
you become better if you are totally unexperienced, because you will gater knowledge about your class, other classes, CCs types, DRs, and counterplay mecanics
keep going on trying to prove i’m wrong, feel free to do this, but you are only wasting your time since you cant actually rebut
Actually, when WoW launched, it was considered a very dumbed down, casual MMORPG compared to the big MMOs that existed before (Ultima Online, Everquest, Dark Ages of Camelot). It was very restrictive and easy, in comparison.
Vanilla wasn’t hard, just slow. Raids were too large, tooling and information access (addons, sites, guides) were lacking, and people didn’t have much experience. None of the vanilla raids was mechanically challenging in comparison to modern mythic raids.
So, yes, Jito is right, WoW was aimed at a more casual audience than other current MMORPGs when it came out.
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There is far more crossover between battlegrounds and arena than between mythic+ or any other kind of pve and arena.
That depends on how long the currency grind to get starter gear takes. If it only takes a few hours, it’s alt friendly alright. If it takes a month, obviously it isn’t.
There is no devil in the detail. Obviously you can’t make pvp items to be absolutely equal in pve with pve items, they would be broken, but you can make them be somewhat worse in pve and add enough resilience and pvp power on them to make them better in pvp.
But as I said earlier, you can even avoid all this by reintroducing the WoD system, where the pvp items simply increased in itemlevel when you were in a pvp instance or flagged as engaged in pvp combat. Same effect for all that is important, more elegant solution.
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Don’t tell me for a second that if you queue up for a Random Battleground on your alt, then you’re learning something you haven’t learned in the past decade. You’re not a newbie. And the point wasn’t to talk about whether newbies learn something, but whether the guy who’s trying to gear up his 3rd alt for Arena learns anything from farming currency in Alterac Valley.
That’s the proposal to earn the entry-level gear, i.e. blue PvP gear that you need because the OP also wants to disable PvE item effects. I say it’s not alt-friendly. I will stand by that opinion.
This is the proposal for the epic-quality gear:
So if a PvE tier lasts 3-4 months, then it should take 3-4 months to acquire the full PvP gear.
Again, I stand by my opinion that this is not alt-friendly, catch-up mechanics or otherwise.
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