i tried to follow a javazon build on icy veins, but found it a confusing spreadsheet of a mess. that seemed to assume that before you even get back to camp after den of evil, you will have runes to use… lol?
so does anyone have a ‘new player’ friendly guide that lays it out very simply, rather than focusing on stuff ive got no idea about like breakpoints, runes to use and gear im unlikely to see/use for a very long time?
h ttps://maxroll.gg/d2/guides/amazon-leveling-guide
remove the space between h and ttps
maybe im stupid or something but thats another guide that reads like you need runes and the horadric cube before even returning to town after den of evil.
and why is it putting points into fire arrow when it doesnt even use a bow until much later?
its like these guides are designed by people that have played the game for decades and forgotten what its like at the start.
is quite frustrating for me tbh
other guides for games have a much better progression write-up
Not really. But ymmv.
just try strafezon with any gear but u 100% need the atmas amulet to break immunes. also u can try to find giant skull for knockback and Loh gloves with razortail belt. u can use harmony runeword at start and windforce after. btw java is sucks if u dont have gg stuff like a phoenix shield or griffon.
some general amazon tips to help you out. all the guides pointing to equipments and runewords are looking at the end game where you want to diminish your weaknesses, or they want to trade themselves online to the end game part, sometimes for nefarious reasons. but the biggest part of the game is the part where you progress, thats what i want to focus on
strength increases physical melee damage, dexterity increases physical bow and crossbow damage, both increases physical throwing weapon and dagger damage
the damage increase is exactly as your stats are. 20 strength is 20% enhanced phys damage in melee and throwing, 20 strength and 40 dexterity is 60% enhanced phys damage to throwing and dagger, and 40% enhanced phys to bows and xbows
amazon has an attack speed bonus to anything that thrusts and punctures. spears, bows, and javelins. daggers and balanced knives has the fastest base attack speed on her in the game. she blocks and recovers slower with swinging weapons in hand
even though she is mostly a ranged class using far reaching weapons, she is treated like a warrior to the game. which means she gets a lot of health from vitality and more health from healing potions. but she is also the one that requires a lot of stats in strength or dexterity to wield her weapon types, so she could be treated closer to a mage, avoiding to get hit altogether
she benefits a lot from picking energy to stay in the fight because most of her skills are not too expensive
she does not have a lot of buff and support skills compared to attack skills, which means you can pick several offensive skills to make her a versatile killer. something for single tough targets, something for groups, something for different immunities, even starter skills for reserving mana
bow/spear, bow/javelin, and spear/javelin hybrids are also an option. after all, you have two weapon slots and no way to get buff boosts through weapons like other classes
to save mana, a dagger and different throwing weapons can also be used on secondary slot. she might not have an attack speed bonus to throwing axes but they are still a blast to use. if i want amazon to use non stabby weapons, i usually just omit a shield. i would advocate for all classes to use throwing weapons more. can just use em up and throw them away when depleted. if you have good stats, normal attack kills just as well. hitting fast and hard with higher version daggers will keep most of her targets stunlocked through hit recovery
speaking of skill buffs, its usually only a good idea to wield amazon only weapons if you are using more than two skills in those related trees. dont feel forced to stick to amazon only weapons like its your thing. restricting weapon choices will make current wields go outdated fast. most common complaint for amazon is that she deals low damage. i think it comes down to weapon restriction and not picking enough of the stat that damage boosts your choice of weapon. dont fall into the “put rest into vit” trap on guides unless you are prepared for the outcome
there are no right choices in d2, only choices you want to make because it works just fine for you. d2 is not a oneshot bullet-hell-esque kill or be killed like most arpgs are today, it was made with the versatility of dnd in mind where player chooses their strength and weaknesses and works around different situations that way, with merc and other players helping out where you fall short. you can even ignore the part where i said she needs high dexterity or strength, and instead put all points into energy and rely solely on spamming flat damage skills, or truly put all into vit and become a golem meatshield, and instead putting all skill points into dodging. as long as you dont die and somehow manage to progress, its all viable
incorrect. Cite your source / proof.
like the paladin, she gets average amount of health from vitality. The barb gets “lots” while the casters get little.
general advice for almost all classes to the OP: Avoid placing points into energy. Exceptions are for example energy shield sorcs.
Lightning Fury is an S class build and one of the fastest crowd killers.
Charged Strike/Ligthning Strike is one of the most powerful boss killers with outstanding crowd killing capabilities.
Like all classes, they are best with godly gear, unlike many builds, they are already strong even with low level gear.
and how do you kill things? In a finite timeframe?
i have done a passive only build on amazon a lot where i use any kinds of weapons. her swinging animation is slower than her thrust animation, even if it states the same attack speed on both weapon types. like druid and sorceress who has an attack speed bonus to two handed swinging weapons, she has an attack speed bonus to all thrusts, and it also shows in how she blocks and recovers. you can try wield an axe, mace or sword with a shield and see how fast she blocks, then compare it to a dagger, throwing knife or javelin. you can try to make an amazon wielding balanced knives or a dagger and have any other class wield the same and compare side by side how fast they attack the air
barbarian is abnormal to fit his close combat one on one style, that does not mean the rest are average. they are still warriors who are capable of close combat
the general advice for energy is only if you want to replace modifiers with more mana and mana leech. it does not break a build to be more unreliant on mana potions and mana modifiers, its just another way to do it, and the cost taken from other stats are practically not noticable depending on how you go about it
i dont think you are going to win a lot of new players over by saying “this and this skill is great, the rest you can safely ignore”. bows and crossbows have commonly been talked down, ignoring the safety in ranged, the benefit of having weapon modifiers on ranged attacks, and how dexterity helps boost the base damage while simultaneously giving attack rating. you dont have that luxury on melee weapons. i am an advocate for using all skills, till and through end game. there are skills for different purposes, designed for dnd like combat
relying on friends, relying on merc, however you plan to go about this challenge. its not about being efficient. its about opening up doors to what is possible. people can have fun exploring the different mechanics of the game and how they can work a build around different stats. i like to do these things, have dice decide things, or see how a single stat works. i play on hardcore by default so its not like im breaking my character in half going about it
Oh yes! THat’s because the amazon uses over a dozen different IAS tables:
h ttps://www.theamazonbasin.com/wiki/index.php/Amazon_attack_speed
But there is no bonus anywhere.
I did not claim the opposite.
You originally wrote:
which is a bit vague. Barbarians get 4 points of health per vitality, amazons and paladins 3, and casters 2. That’s why I called it (not her) “average” in this specific regard.
Once again, I didn’t claim the opposite. Quite the opposite actually:
And the fend amazon is also quite doable.
who “talks down” bows? I don’t.
Here, someone else adviced a bowa.
Yes. And if this were a discussion with someone who enjoyed BNM on d1, or has run thru the game on a naked sorc or necro it would be fine. But OP is new to the game. And I remember my first playthru, I got stuck with DUriel on normal difficulty (again: NORMAL!) since my first char 24 years ago was a sorc. The game has been analyzed to death and experienced players will find it easy. But a new guy might actually struggle and find it hard. So for a first playthru going all energy will be tougher than need be.
I’ve seen new players use their one free respec per diff rather generously and when they go stuck in hell they didn’t have any left. And a token isn’t even possible to get unless you rely on others.
You’re an experienced HC player. Don’T give them experienced HC advice, give them newbie advice. You can do anything (I’m exaggarating) is fine for you and me - but it will only confuse a new guy.
the references to challenges are more to say anything is possible, so its hard to make mistakes in this game as long as you take advantage of what you pick, and its ok to experiment. some arpgs dont let you do your own thing without halting your progress and deals out ridiculous punishment for getting out of line or failing to follow rules unwritten within the game. diablo 2 has a lot of unwritten stuff but its more often hidden benefits than hidden punishments. it mostly encourages players to instead go by what feels good instead of following the script of others. that is why a lot of my advice points towards just trying things instead of following a recipe to success. i was once told how to play the game and it kept me from trying my own thing for years. if i tried to step off the script, i would still succumb to the fear that i was wasting efforts on something that was inevitably going to fail. but i eventually broke out of it and learned the game is a lot more merciful than i thought. so i would rather encourage new players to do their own thing and understand that the game plays along with that, and that any unexpected suffering is really not going to be fixed by picking different. those will be general punishments that all builds have to learn to deal with respectively
i think its a bit of a misconception that newbies need specific advice tailored to them. they might be new to this game, but by today most are not new to video games or genres like this
when most of us started playing diablo 2, we were new to every game, or at most had some 2d sidescroller experience, or been grinding certain genres. we had a much different learning curve to wrestle with. there are still some players that tunnel vision a genre to this day, but from my experience they are a minority and unlikely to look for advice and instead return to their bread and butter genre when they had enough
when i invite friends who never played diablo 2 before into the game, they already got the hang of it. they know what the game mechanics are about, without having played arpgs before, and they know how to gauge threats. their reflexes arent rusty and they dont easily get overwhelmed as we would have remembered our first games. the visuals might be new but the mechanics and concepts largely stay the same across all similar games, not just within arpg. they still get tipped on things they cant possibly know, like thawing potion for duriel fights. i dont think more vitality is the solution to that fight, they are still going to suffer without enough cold resist or knowing how to keep their merc alive during the fight
also thanks for being more lighthearted in your response, i appreciate that
sharing the attack speed of amazon vs all with balanced knife link here too, i think it was more relevant to what i said here
h ttps://drive.google.com/file/d/10U4nsyd6SZ_HQAT2OmMx91CEioImv9I6/view?usp=sharing
java is amazing with garbage gear until you hit hell. would be more accurate