Design: Breaking Immunities

At the launch of D2R it seems any source of reducing resistances could, stacked enough, potentially break an elemental immunity. I am recommending this behavior needs to be restored.

This was not how the Old D2 worked, but it was a surprise embraced by many, and arguably made the game a great deal more enjoyable.

New builds cropped up, the hegemony of “infinity or bust” was deposed, and the playability of this classic title soared. Diablo felt like a trove of opportunities - a feeling long overdue as practically every elemental build had previously been pigeonholed into utterly clunky gameplay (LR wand swapping), ridiculously expensive mercenaries (infinity), or simply quarantening the gameplay to specific areas without specific immune monsters. Often also restarting games to get “better rolls” on creature types. The old format always felt broken.

Some time ago the (supposedly) unintentional change was reverted. I believe this was a mistake. I would strongly argue for reverting the “fix” and returning the option to deal with immunes in multiple ways.

Here’s a few points to support my ask.

  • The original design has Cold Immunity at much higher values on monsters than other elements. This only makes sense in the context of Cold Mastery being intended to potentially break immunes. As it stands, the implementation looks like a mistake rather than by design.

  • Diablo features many interesting options for lowering resistances. Griffon’s Eye, Doom, Crescent Moon, Phoenix, Rainbow Facets - to name a few. These are not easy to come by, and stacking them is an effort and sacrifice in itself. Should there not be a payoff?

  • While the reduced resistances still add to a player’s damage against non-immune monsters, by the time the player has such items, these small percentages in damage feel irrelevant as you’re wiping the floor with everything anyway. It does not seem intentional for some of the most restricted items in the game to do little more than add a (largely irrelevant) damage bump to an already powerful output.

  • The inconsistency of how certain sources can break immunities but others cannot. It would stand to reason that a source of reducing resistance would work consistently. Don’t tell me you intuited how only Conviction and Lower Resist can do this, while other sources cannot. The only reason a player knows this is learning it the hard way, or reading it online.

  • The accessibility of immunity-breaking abilities is constrained to essentially two classes: the Necro and Paladin. Would it not make sense that other classes could reasonably achieve at least a fragment of similar gameplay fluidity?

  • Yes, there are “solutions”. Like the LR wand. This is like saying there’s nothing wrong with a broken chair since you can just balance yourself on the corner with the intact leg. The “solution” other classes uses looks and plays like a clunky workaround, and feels completely unintentional.

  • The rule of Fun. Diablo is a more fluid and enjoyable experience when the options for the player are increased. The old model does the opposite, reducing lategame build choices or playstyles to a handful. The accidental immunity breaking of early D2R refreshed the experience and opened the door to possibilities, new builds, theorycrafting - the lifeblood of the community and game.

It is clear there is great fear associated with tampering with the “original design”. However, looking through a gameplay and design lens, the old system looks like a bug, accident, oversight, or plain design flaw. Reintroducing the “old immune breaking” does not feel like fixing an issue. It feels like reintroducing a bug we were all happy to see gone.

Best,
Elrathi

3 Likes

Auch wenn du evtl mit einigen Punkten recht hast, deine überhebliche Art und dieses mit Zwang auf alle Threads mit Deutsch antworten zu müssen, völlig egal ob der Gegenüber Deutsch kann oder nicht, ist mal so RICHTIG zum Kotzen… :roll_eyes:

No, the opposite. If immunity is breaken, monster resistance immediately goes to -100% with cold mastery. But all other elements still have to deal with +99% resistance, if immunity is breaken. So, cold immunity is unbreakable for balance purpose.

Ok i gotta ask, why do people randomly reply to english topics in non english?

As for breaking immunities, i dunno, i’m not a fan of making it easier already to just use the same build from normal up to the end of Hell.

Etwas weniger Dramatik wenn man bitten darf, Bertolt Brecht. :joy: :-1:

And than deleting your initial post…:man_facepalming: you really have some serious problems dude…

And fyi, you’re not funny :wink:

Да никакого драматизма, всё норм тут.

As a 20 yo veteran, i must say that i agree with you. the -rez should count to breaking the immune system because… logic. Also i think the 1/5 rule should be revisited as imo with sufficient -rez no monster should remain immune including the ones near ubers.