How good are melee and ranged (missile) damage reduction (and which one is more useful and better overall?) compared to single elemental (physical?) resistance (secondary attribute)? Which 3 gems of those 4 are best for defense (or in other words which one is the worst): bane of the powerful, mutilation guard, esoteric alteration, Gem of Efficacious Toxin? Is molten explosion considered melee or ranged?
Seems like you’ve asked this before? Molten explosion is fire damage. You can test it with the amulet that gives immunity to fire damage. (If it’s also melee or ranged doesn’t matter, because it’ll kill you without the amulet… or without Goldwrap and a lot of gold).
If you have a build that has close up attacks melee reduction is probably better and vice versa if you have a ranged build.
Which gem that is the best depends a lot on the build. You’ll often see crusader builds that use esoteric for example.
Bane of the powerful has the advantage of giving both damage and damage reduction (it’s especially good for speed runs). But if you can’t stay alive anyway it doesn’t help much. The toxin gem is only used to increase damage to monsters, it’s mostly relevant for support characters. Mutilation Guard… well using google it’s hard to find specific answers on melee damage. Meteorblade came up with a list but removed it again. If the gem isn’t used in any build it’s probably a strong hint that that it’s a poor choice.
Generally speaking you can only get so far with defensive gems, unless you’re support, because it gimps your damage. Staying alive is a lot about playing the game the right way by moving and positioning yourself the “right” way and using your skills the right way. I often see videos where players stay alive in GRs where I would die over and over even if I used their account.
That’s entirely unsurprising as the last half dozen threads the OP has made have been duplicate postings to the EU and US forums…
I mostly stopped responding after noticing that the OP seems to just want to argue with the answers provided, rather than solicit answers. It’s also why I withdrew some posts from threads where I’d actually provided answers.
Perhaps the OP is unaware of the Forum Code of Conduct which says…
Creating Duplicate Threads
This category includes:
- Creating threads about existing topics
- Creating a separate thread about an existing topic for further discussion in more than one forum
Also, a quick look at the OP’s Career Page shows…
“Last updated on 13 Apr 2021 20:02 BST”
…so they’re playing the forums, not the game.
2 Likes
Sepiroth can’t play until he’s gotten all the answers maybe?
You hit the spot. I am just curious if molten explosion is melee or ranged. I don’t like that it is very unclear what is melee in this game and what is ranged? There were some lists but they are like half of a decade old and the results there were very mixed. I am just curious if melee and ranged reduction is good or bad and how it compares to single element resistances (secondary attributes). No wonder that Meteorblade deleted his posts because he wrote many false information in his posts so he was ashamed and deleted it. Looks like his knowledge is not as big as he thinks. He just want to have more posts in statistics so he writes anything and does not care if it is right or wrong. And don’t look at my game statistics and my character and use it as suggestion because I play mostly on consoles.
Lots of things are unclear about the inner workings and mechanics of Diablo.
It doesn’t matter if molten explosion is melee or ranged because it should be avoided - unless you have immunity.
Having items with melee or ranged damage reduction can be nice but it doesn’t make or break a build.
1 Like
I answered one of your previous threads and you decided to argue with me about the answer I provided, with the suggestion that you knew better. If you already knew the answer, why were you asking the question? If you didn’t know the answer, why were you arguing with the answer?
I make every effort to only provide information that, to the best of my ability, is factually correct. Where necessary, I back that up with facts / figures / statistics. However, if you feel you can back up that accusation, go right ahead and quote any of my posts where you feel I’ve given false, misleading or incorrect information.
2 Likes
I 've posted this on a different topic that you created,
https://www.diablofans.com/forums/diablo-forums/diablo-iii-general-discussion/91166-elite-affixes-types-and-damage-reduction-mechanics
however, it is from 2014 and we cannot be sure how accurate this is anymore. For example for molten it says it is considered a melee attack but melee dmg reduction doesn’t work… I haven’t found anything better so far. Only through testing you can get pricise answers and it is really hard to try and controll these conditions and factors when you test. You need to make two identical experiments, no other enemy hitting you, no additional defensive buffs in one of the two tries, etc… Basically, that’s why you can’t find too many info about these things, they are really hard to figure. Bottom line is that melee / ranged reduction is one of the best secondary stats in the game… If you managed to find a piece which has all the primary desired stats and melee/ranged reduction as secondary you shoud really be happy. If not, then don’t break your head cause it’s not like this will drop you 20 tiers below if you don’t have it… And yeah, whatever jazz said… At GR 120 ± and above, i 've never made a character being able to handle molten explosions no matter how high my toughness is. They are meant to be avoided, not absorbed.
2 Likes
Also, of the two reductions, it’s generally ranged damage reduction which is more effective at keeping your hero alive than melee reduction. Think about all the white trashmob types that can one-shot you, e.g. goat spearmen (ranged, projectile), goat shaman (ranged, spell), porcupine / spine shooters (ranged, projectile), bogans (ranged, projectile). They’re way more dangerous to your hero than mobs that hit you in melee with the possible exception of Mallet Lords.
2 Likes
Indeed, and usually these mobs appear in large numbers, projectiles and arrows coming from all directions, and some of them are really hard to notice on your screen, let alone avoid all of them…
1 Like
Well, from the info I found people mostly state otherwise. That melee is better (especially) for melee characters. Because (and that is the part when Meteorblade provide false or at least untested info which he was unsure of) melee is not only when you are hit in the face (Meteorblade suggested that is the way it works that melee = only hit in the face). But the fact is that most wikis and tests done by serious players proved that melee works against all DoT effects, “pools”, arcane beams (“lasers”), etc. So that is the fact that makes melee probably better. Only I am not sure about molten explosion so I asked. The fun fact is that those effects (DoT effects, “pools”, arcane beams) are probably only things that can’t be blocked. So combining high melee reduction with a shield (with high block chance and amount) could be extremely useful. Ranged reduction might be good for someone without shield (but considering all the facts I am not sure if it could be better than melee reduction) and maybe better for ranged fighters. Funny fact is that Meteorblade wants me to quote any of his posts where he given false, misleading or incorrect information. But he deleted all of those posts made by him in my threads. LOL. So he knows it can’t be done. LOL. That proves this guy should not be taken seriously.
I already explained, in detail, with a screenshot, and underlying maths why, even if you had 100% block chance, no matter how much block amount you had would be worthwhile in providing meaningful damage mitigation…
…which is why, as I said in that post, shields are selected based on their offensive legendary abilities, not their block chance / block amount.
So, how do you explain the post I just linked above, made by me, in one of your threads?
2 Likes
If you want to test molten, i believe the infernal machine guardian in act 1 has a molten explosion when you kill him. Just make sure that you do every try under the exact same circumstances. I still think it is hard to pull it off. Meteor is right about ranged reduction. A barely standing 500 years old skeleton with a moldy bow, can be more lethal than a huge behemoth in D3 , lol…
Block amount is also not that impressive. Things hit for millions of damage in the high difficulties. Blocking will reduce what? a few thousands at best… Most of your damage reduction comes from sets, items that have flat out dmg reduction multipliers, resistances and armor (main stat), gems in gears, passives and active buffs. Block chance is semi - usefull because there is a ring called justice lantern. It “transforms” some of your block chance to straight damage mitigation. It is used by crusaders mainly and it can work at some extent when you stack block chance with the shield, ring and the passive. It is however, still considered a somewhat weak defensive option but there isn’t anything better at the moment like an elusive ring or band of might for crusaders.
1 Like
This thread is going nowhere fast… I usually defend Meteorblade against defamatory posts because he’s always been a great contributor to the forum (forums) but in this case the accusations are so ridiculous that it’s not necessary.
If a player has problems with molten explosions it’s because he’s doing something wrong.
1 Like
Meteorblade is only good in manipulating and deleting posts. He is not good at reading and understanding. And because of people like him (that have no knowledge about the game but like to post posts) this thread goes nowhere. According molten the best thing to do would be to test it. Blocking is interesting because in theory it can give you infinite thoughness (if you have high enough mitigation). Some people here seem to forget how it works. Block reduces damage but first this damage is reduced by our damage mitigation and at the end by block amount. So it is not that monsters hit us for millions and shield only reduces it by few thousands (and that’s why shield is bad). If it was the case all characters would be dead by now (because there are many top characters with under 1 million HP). Think what you post before you post. Blocking is great but only if used together with good mitigation. Mitigation is more important. But if we have both it is amazing (in theory infinite toughness is possible). It is not about doing something wrong or right. It is about playing for fun and testing and understanding game mechanics. If people post such stupid misinforming and misleading posts that means there is something wrong with them.
Trust me they hit for millions. Numbers are crazy high in diablo 3. It’s not just millions, it’s tens of millions. You cannot realize this easily if you don’t count all mitigations. I can give you an example, for my necromancer that i recently played. This is by the way a really tanky setup.
I have 83% dmg reduction from the set. 50% dmg reduction i get from the belt which leads to combined 91.5%. Bone armor cuts another 30% so this increases it to 94%. I don’t use razeths volitions often, but for pushing i do from the 6% dmg that hits me, half of it is also reduced, making my dmg reduction 97%. Now 3% of the initial dmg goes to me… of that 1/3 is also mitigated because of the automatic cast of all 3 curses (decripify gives 30% dmg reduction), so that leaves my dmg reduction to 98%…
OK. So far i have 98% dmg reduction from my items and buffs without calculating armor, main stat resistances, gems… Now let us factor armor and resistances too… Armor is 20k, meaning 85% of the damage that hits me is also reduced. The average of my resistances is also more than 90% thanks to high main stat so that means of the 15% that hits me after calculating armor, only 10% of that goes through and hits me… You see where i am going? I have 800k life if i remember correctly and there are times in high grs that after all these toughness layers i get one shotted or proc my cheat death…Not that i die easily cause this is a tanky setup but it can happen. So yeah, stuf hits you for several dozens of millions if not billions in some cases (blighter smashing the ground, molten explosions, coldsnap charging at you)…Millions was an understatement. For a few millions of dmg i would need a microscope to see my life bar reduced.
PS: Edit: I might be wrong about the multiplicative reduction from armor and resistances, i don’t know if they work exactly the same as in dmg reduction in two items for example, but my point still stands even if they dont.
And yes block amount might indeed come after some forms of mitigation but this stat is so bad in diablo 3 it cannot support end game content. If you are going for block, i told you before it is better to concentrate on block chance instead to enable your justice lantern to give you a flat out damage reduction (that you are never going to reach with block amount by the way) or to proc some typical crusader things like invoker 2 pieces and stuff like that. These are small bonuses that you pick along the way after you 've done min maxing your character, but just like every other class, crusader has the same logic. You itemize according to what buffs your damage skills, you are looking like everyone else for crit chance, area damage, cooldown reduction, etc. with the exception of thorns, and so on…
There is nothing wrong trying and experimenting with game mechanics or trying to find some ways to improve your game and your stats, and i am not trying to tell you how to play but it is old news by now that block amount does very little to damage reduction. Now, if you are advocating for a new crusader build where all these block mechanics will be very valuable and a core part of the playstyle, i am with you 100% and it would make some sence for theory crafting to have a huge guy holding a 3 meter shield actually rely on that shield…
1 Like
Oh really? Here’s what Meteorblade wrote:
I already don’t care what he wrote. What about those gems? Second and third best after esoteric alteration? Defensive perspective of course.
Great, that means I don’t need to care about any questions you ask from now on because you’re not actually interested in learning the answers.
2 Likes
You would need to know answers which you don’t