I wish I could give more than one like for that very extensive explanation of how massive “benefit” boosting other players gives.
It won’t make a difference for Prometheus though…
You got to give it to meteor… I always like people who prove stuff with mathematics…
Not everyone agrees with that…
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And I shall always maintain that stance.
I never really understood why people try turn something that is supposed to be entertaining through its designed random nature into something that can be controlled and predicted.
You claimed group play gives an advantage. You provided zero evidence. Meteorblade disprooved your claim by providing evidence.
Cases like these are situations where it is necessary to understand the underlying mechanics.
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There seems to be a theme brewing in this thread…
With “math” meaning anything that has to do with numbers you don’t play Diablo without using it. You augment with level 80 or level 100 gems because it’s better than level 50 gems. You assess various drops in the game to see if they’re better than what you’ve already got… is 20% elemental and 4,5% crit better than 15% elemental and 6% crit.?
But if you don’t know what you’re doing you might assess wrongly - even when you think you’ve made the best choice.
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So playing running GRs in a group provides no advantage to each of the players in the rift? Isn’t that precisely what “Strength in Numbers” does? And even if other players are out of range, they still gain a larger advantage in Paragon gains than they ordinarily would have in Single Player.
You go right on believing that groups provide no advantage. Everyone is free to believe whatever they want, even if they are wrong.
If Meteor is the Einstein in this discussion maybe you’re the Frankenstein? (the doctor not the monster of course).
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You seem to be deliberately ignoring the fact that Meteorblade is the one carrying other players, not the other way around. By carrying other players he is gimping his own XP gain rate which he demonstrated with math. In other words he is definitely not gaining any advantage. What instead he is gaining is a disadvantage.
Or are simply so miserably bad in maths that in your opinion 46 times more XP in pure solo play than while boosting other players provides less paragons?
Your logic (or more accurately the lack of any logic) sometimes makes me facepalm so hard I’m worried my head explodes. This is one of those cases.
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There’s a massive difference between me carrying three people through content they couldn’t possibly do themselves and playing in a group where all four of us would be capable of GR90s in 2-3 minutes solo so we can equally contribute and/or split up in open maps.
You’ve seen the “advert” that I use in General Chat. I literally take anyone and everyone that responds to it that has GR keys. In almost all cases, I get respondents that have recently ding’d 70, are alts without gear, or have very low paragon, i.e. I am carrying them, and they can contribute little to nothing to the clears and are usually so far behind me that the Strength In Numbers buff isn’t active.
If I wanted to farm huge amounts of paragon, I’d be doing “Rat Runs” for trillions of XP an hour, and if I wanted an easy way to get rank 150 gems (for equipping and/or Caldesann’s Despair) then I’d be playing a zBarb. Well, I’ve never done either of those things.
I am carrying people, despite it providing almost zero benefit to my hero’s power, for one simple reason… I like helping people.
I like to believe as many true things as possible and as few false things as possible. For that reason, I tend to listen a lot more to facts, evidence, maths, science, logic and reason than feelings-based arguments.
You feel like I’m gaining a huge advantage.
Maths shows you’re wrong.
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And there we get to the meat of the problem.
Shall I quote that again?
That is the whole problem, isn’t it? people in this game have gotten so complacent in their need to get boosted, they have either forgotten how to do it all themselves or just never learned to do so to begin with.
That is perhaps the very core of my challenge. To do it alone. Without help.
You seem to be under the impressions that when I say you get an advantage from a group game, I mean a huge one?
Tell me. In those game where you carried others. All those 2, 3 and 4 man Greater Rifts? Did you gain any Paragon points yourself while doing so? And how do you classify that as not having had help?
LOL! It wasn’t Meteor who got carried.
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I find it rather patronizing that you thing it’s ok to “carry” someone who is at Paragon 723 https://i.imgur.com/VIbiDAr.jpg and then go on to say that you are doing so only because “they cannot possibly do the content themselves”.
How the hell are they supposed learn how to do the content themselves if there are constantly people like you out there that will do the work for them?
I think I know the answer to my own question. Because that’s how you learned to play the game, by letting others do all the hard work for you?
You sicken me.
Yes, clearly I got some paragon points from carrying people.
I notice, however, that you’re conveniently ignoring the huge amount of maths where I showed that each time I was boosting people I could have been earning 16 to 42 more times XP by playing GR90s solo instead, i.e. I was choosing to earn less paragon than I could have, purely to be helpful to other people.
I classify earning less XP in a group than I could have earned solo as not receiving help.
How do you classify it?
Oh, wow…
That screenshot is the second one of a pair of screenshots that I embedded into the thread to demonstrate the range of the Strength In Numbers buff. Did you miss the chat box in the first screenshot? Let me embed it again…
I had asked in General Chat if someone would be willing to join my game so that I could take a screenshot of something. In the chatbox, you see the other player say “inv if needed :)”, I sent them an invite, you’ll see in the chatbox that they have entered the game, and I say in party chat “teleport to me please, then stand still”. I took a screenshot whilst standing next to them, demonstrating that the Strength In Numbers buff was in effect. Then, I ran about 100 yards North and took a screenshot showing that the Strength In Numbers buff was no longer in effect.
By the way, did you notice there were no mobs in either of those screenshots? Do you know why? That’s because I’d already cleared the map of mobs solo, prior to the other person joining, so that I wouldn’t need to worry about protecting whoever came into the game to help me by standing there so I could take a screenshot.
As soon as I had the screenshots, we both went back to town, and left party, i.e. I killed zero mobs whilst that player was in a party with me. I provided nothing to them what-so-ever other than saying thanks for helping. I did not carry them. I did not kill anything for them, or with them. Literally, they were in a party so I could take screenshots to demonstrate the range of the Strength In Numbers buff.
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Your stated intent with this thread was to prove you could do something…
You actively chose not to take screenshots, even though they would prove your claim…
When you were asked to provide screenshots that would prove your claim, your response was…
I think you probably meant overestimated (i.e. you were insulting me by implying I wasn’t very smart) rather than underestimated (i.e. you realise I’m way smarter than you thought I was) here…
How smart was it for you to create a thread saying you could prove something, fail to prove it and then get upset and insult other people because you did not prove it?
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Because maths and numbers are a big part of these type of games. It is in their nature. If you compare builds, you really are comparing numbers, percentages, functions, expressions, vector spaces (lol) etc… Not just diablo. But diablo is a very strong example. If you understand the mathematical function behind every mechanic then you truly understand the game. You can even improve your gameplay a lot… For me it dosn’t go against the fun that the game can offer. They are 2 different things…And maths either fun or not is probably the most powerful tool that human has ever created. I guess i am lucky cause i find entertaining both maths and games that can implement them on every turn.
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We’re talking about someone that not only kept existing CHC / CHD affixes on his Invoker’s gear after being told that Thorns cannot crit, but actively rolled CHC / CHD affixes onto gear that didn’t previously have those affixes on.
Maybe if he gets the value of X high enough then X * 0 won’t be 0…
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