Never understood how Blizz can be so incompetent when it comes to reasonable balancing in their games…
Its not only dumb as hell to nerf a class after ppl could play them only to lvl 25 and T2, no you just have to nerf skeletons into oblivion!
First boss (Xal or whaterver his name is), 5 minuts and only rezzing skeletons because max 2 hits and they are done. THAT is no fun at all and will only lead to builds without minions… This paired with the timeframe for leveling to 100 and seasons, i cant see myself playing Necro even once…
Sorry but thats BS. Nobody knows how endgame will be and nerfs/buffs came from beta feedback. Besides that, how the hell should they live any longer if they are that brittle from the beginning onwards…
Yeah and as you saw, the “balance” came after the sh*tstorm from the open beta… Would the nerf come form the closed one, it would have already be implemented in the open beta…
I dont deny that the late necro was strong or as a lot said op, BUT the new necro ist trash when playing with minions and that cannot stand for the “original” pet class.
Dude, nobody in their right mind puts out such a huge nerf on basis of a beta test with 1/4 of the game, 1/4 of the lvl and everything around it… Play him now, see for yourself how “balanced” he is and then come back and hold your statements.
I find it ironic that you are making your opinion on the beta while chastising them for your perception of them making a balancing choice based on the beta.
You haven’t played further into the game. You don’t know what the balance was like in the late game.
Again, if the balance was so bad in late game, they would have already implemented it before the open beta and not just right after the crying masses called for it.
And of course can i give my opinion. They ppl crying about the necro were mostly the ones not playing it and thought their classes are not competing well enough with it.
The Necro felt good as a minion class. Maybe a bit too good but the nerf now is to hard. It killed all the fun and its more work the anything else playing him now. Why would i play 250 hours to get max lvl on a class which feels like crap the first 50 lvl or so?
You obviously didnt play him in the first beta nor did you play and compared him with the one now. I would go so far to say, you were in the crying crowd which called for this nerf.
I played all the classes and I know how development works in the first 2 years (early access and after release) of a new game.
It will eventually find a good balance.
Also, I am not saying it’s good. I think all nerfs are bad. I was avocating against nerfs and they need better scaling.
The real problem is that so many skills and abilities are multiplicative and do not add direct damage. Too many percentage modifiers. Then need more modifiers (for early game especially) that just add flat damage.
Some specifics for people who haven’t played it yet:
Certain bosses, like Malnok, Tchort, the story boss where the mother is drawing on the ground with her blood and more, can either 1 shot your Minions or have mechanics that melt them you don’t have any way to avoid.
We have no ability to control the Minions or tell them where to go. We can’t prevent all 7 dying in some cases instantly and there’s no corpse generation that allows for us needing to resummon them 7~ times a second.
Even if the corpses were available, the skill can’t summon fast enough to keep up with multiple dying each second.
Bosses aside, even in general content, the time out of combat it now takes to heal them mean you have to stop what you’re doing and sit around for extended periods of time. Priest only recovers 2% of their HP per second, with the other generation being 10%(?) of what it was before. I understand that the idea is that they die and you resummon them, but you don’t take the corpses you have with you into a boss encounter and have multiple minions at 5% life eat into your early corpse generation, preventing Priest as the skill will instead prioritize resummoning over buffing. I now spend time watching their health bars tick up… Who thought that was a good idea?
Maybe Minions work at ‘endgame’, but if that’s the case we’re in the same situation that Druid was in and they got buffed as a result. Assuming they indeed become viable later, could a dev let us know at what level we can expect to be able to play with our minions/“the way you want”?
All of the above was with both Skeleton Mastery’s maxed.
I play summoner builds almost exclusively in every ARPG I play, if that’s not going to exist in D4, let us know in advance so we can make an informed decision.
You complain about necro being nerfed after beta feedback from people only playing until level 25 and saying it was unnessasary and now it´s ruined because of it but now you are only reaching level 20, Isn’t it the same now, too early to tell how it will be in the next 80 levels or so ?
Obviously, we’re nowhere near endgame. Obviously, things were OP before.
Does it mean the progression to endgame needs to be completely ganked as it is now? Why would anyone in their right mind want, or actually design that experience to be deliberately bad? That doesn’t make sense.
Does it mean things need to be nerfed into the ground? Why would anyone in their right mind think that if one end of the scale is bad, the other would be great? There’s a nice section around center, a middle ground that would actually provide the balance that’s needed.
The way skeletons are now is just stupid. If there was any internal testing before this release, I’d really like to know the details, because I can’t imagine anyone enjoying having to re-summon every skeleton every five seconds because they collapse if someone breathes on them. Or wait around twiddling their thumbs while they heal up after every fight.
Yes. The early Necro is a fail!!
The only skill you have to plays with for the first 4 or 5 levels is your skeletons and a random skill that main purpose is to replenish your resource pool.
Half of the summons die at any encounter instantly almost and most of the “gameplay” is not to fight Demons but to re-summon your bloody skeletons.
People that are saying “oh… everything is balanced around end game” are just idiots…
Balance at the beginning is probably more important than than the balance in the middle of the road. You have to LIKE the class in the first 5-10lvls and not hope that maybe, some day at lvl 100 finally it will be fun to play.
Balancing character at later/max level is another story, but we are talking about a fun factor at the start of the journey. And at the moment Necromancer is not fun to play compared to Open Beta weekends.
If you really think that skeletons are too “powerful” than lower their damage but don’t lower their HP. It’s not fun to run around and re-summon everything as your only activity in every fight.
Why would I bother playing anything that won’t catch my attention and excitement in the first 5-10 levels and waste 30-50 hours of my time in hope it will get better “later”.
Making something feel bad intentionally so it can get “better” weeks later is just waste of everybody’s time. Gamers and developers alike…
Balance is exactly what they are trying to accomplish i recon, but balance is not in one character and how that plays, it´s a balance between all the playable classes, balance means making things even. Before the change Sorc and Necro where Op, Druid and Barb felt squishy. So they upped and downed to make things “Balanced”.
Saying that you "have to Like it"in the first 5-10 levels is just not correct and a bit sad that you give up on things so quickly. it´s really hard to say if you like the class or not early on since low levels will always be the trial stages of getting to know a class by trying different things, some things that you might eventually like the best might not unlock until later on in the leveling process. Also, what one person likes another doesn´t, it´s always personal preference.
Saying that something is broken after reaching level 20 and comparing it to last beta is ridiculous. For one, it´s 5 levels lower, for two, the legendary droprate now is allot less and they do play a big part in how a class plays.
I kinda agree, about necromancer core - is it playable yes, you can find a spec, but you don’t want to play another sorc , you wanna play a necromancer, idk summon were overnerfed…less fun
Like don’t get me wrong , blood hits like a truck but your playstyle with summons is situational / generator instead of beeing core to the playstyle…
Like prev beta I realy liked it to play … whoever decided that spam resummon is fun should go read a book about fun