My friend decided to step away from the game until season 1 today, and I learned a big problem with the games design from it that I haven’t seen discussed here.
He was enjoying himself solo, levelling his lightning wolf druid build, then we ran nightmare dungeons as a group of 3 for the rest of the night. He mentioned feeling weak and that something must be wrong with his build because just earlier he did a couple of nightmare dungeons and felt way stronger. We were doing around tier 5 dungeons, and I was sort of feeling weaker than I should be also.
After he logged off I went into a tier 7 solo, and low and behold, I’m suddenly way stronger again! Turns out, the strength of the monsters is scaled aggressively based on party size it seems, to the point of making builds feel like they are not working. This is fine for me because I love playing solo, but this obviously has a HUGE impact on the vast amount of players that enjoy playing in groups.
TL;DR: Solo nightmare dungeons are insanely easier than group nightmare dungeons
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d2 and d3 had that aswell. but d2 then also gave better loot like increased rune drops
I feel like this is a good thing.
Groups are much stronger relative to solo players. (much more CC and debuffs like vulnerable etc are always up) Maybe your builds dont synergise or something because i feel grouping up is MUCH easier.
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This was always the case in Diablo games and makes sence that it is in D4 now aswell. Single player mode in D2 you could also emulate more players to make the world stronger by doing /players x in the chat.
Monster difficulty does scale aggressively with group size, but in the situation of equal strength players it actually gets much easier, group synergy in this game is massively powerful.
Of course Nightmare keys do not scale to player level like normal dungeons do, so a lower level player is simply much weaker and the other players have to pick up the slack. I’ve been running my friend (now lvl65) through 30 NM dungeons, and they do feel closer to 40+ solo in difficulty because he has pretty weak damage and survival having only just reached WT4.
possibly, but its like, in a group I we each die in 1 hit and do really low damage, but solo we stomp, I get that it needs to scale to group size somewhat but it does feel too aggressive much like the level scaling
Sounds like “kills for hp” is the issue. If you base survivability in groups on kills for heals, you get issues.
If kills proc buffs on your build in groups where monsters have much higher hp… What is the outcome.
You need high damage and survival based on abilities not kills. 
Attack the same monster in the mob, lower the dps pool.
If you group and all the monsters are tougher and all do more dps it’s literally the only efficient way to play.
Group targets an enemy, slays it, instantly less incoming insane DPS. Rinse and repeat.
Game is new, so learning these tactics is vital. Enjoy.
Yeah, even if that is the case, thats a real problem. Am I supposed to have a build for solo and a build for groups? Not good game design there, the scaling definitely needs to relax a in groups
You didn’t think that through, your bad solo build needs to scale with your friends/group’s good build.
Not my build, a very good online build that destroys nightmare dungeons 15 levels higher than I’m meant to in solo…but takes 10 seconds to kill trash in group dungeons of my current level. There is no avoiding the fact that this is bad design, it should be and WILL be fixed.
Ah, you are a copy paste player… There’s the issue. You need to learn the build.
Best advice, play your own way and actually understand the build by making it yourself. Copying other people’s homework has a similar issue. Sure, endpoint is reached, but did you learn the lesson from putting in any work?
Good luck.
No need to learn from playing if I can learn from a video. Did you need to discover mathematics by experimenting yourself? Or were you taught it?
Copying would be just following the guide without reading/watching the guides to learn about the build.
Terrible analogy with maths.
1st you learn what 1 is
Then 2
Then 3 etc
Then addition
Subtraction
Then more of PEMBAS
Then you do advanced maths from there.
You can’t even understand the terms used in explanation, how could you learn.
I watch Eddie Hall lift 500kg, I am now able?
Bro, the Logic? 
You have abandoned all reasoning 
, the mental gymnastics are real.
Are you actually going to die on this hill? That the ONLY way to learn a build is by experimenting yourself? That you CANNOT learn a build from studying it? Yeah, I did not think so.
You must be trolling with the Eddie Hall comparison 
, as if doing dungeons in a casual game is anything like lifting half a ton. Comparing mental things that can be learned, vs physical feats…just wow.
That’s because loot was shared…
I mean, you are not? That’s not all it takes? What a wuss
So you require zero mechanical skill, the button timing works by itself. The animation timings are intrinsic? The cast delay is part of your core being. You watch a Rubiks cube master you are now literally just as fast?
You watch Dafran play Torb, now you can be top500?
Copying a build is doable, mastering it is the issue we are discussing.
When I switched to Darkness necro it felt weak from the start, but it was simply because I wasn’t using it right - even tho I made it and knew exactly what I am suppose to do, there were nuances to different playstyle. It took about hour and half for it to just click in completely with my brain. Theory and practical applications are bit different.
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I don’t get it , I watched the video and the barbell just won’t budge, same leotard and everything…