Disheartening and discouraging

General Discussion
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So, I’m a Bronze rank player. This isn’t a rant to say I don’t belong in Bronze or my scrub teammates are keeping me back. I’m a terrible player and I deserve my rank. I’m not happy about it but it is what it is. My issue concerns some of the comments I’ve read from higher ranked players regarding bronze players. Many of the things people say are correct. Many players do have bad aim, there is no coordination and no one uses comms. However, some comments are passive aggressive offensive. I’m not offended myself, I’m more discouraged than anything else. comments such as ‘bronze players must play using a track pad’ or ‘bronze players are mindless’ and even going as far as to say ’ players in bronze might be disabled’. Not to mention the videos on YouTube showing a GM Genji or Tracer smurf running rings around the, clearly mindless dribbling bronze players. I mean, LOL, right? It’s disheartening to think that this is the opinion some people have. I know there are many bronze players who want to progress and climb the ranks, but simply cannot. I’m sure they don’t want to be told they have the skill of someone with a possible disability (granted, that comment was only in one post).

I’m interested to know what people in lower ranks think. I imagine many don’t really care, but as a person trying to climb, it doesn’t fill me confidence.
This post sounds more whiney that I was intending. Sorry about that.
Anyway, use your words.

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If you aren’t the “best” then there is probably someone who thinks you’re bad. If you can’t live with this it’ll just make your life harder and playing a game like OW or any other multiplayer games will not be fun for you.

Yeah, people think that bronzes are bad simply because they are bad. But there are a lot of people who think the same about silver, gold, plat, etc…

Recognising that you are bad and finding out why you are bad are essential parts of learning/improving. You can find videos that make fun of lower ranked players but also some other videos that can help.

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The reason why many players make fun of Bronze players is that, it is actually hard to be and stay in Bronze. People who cannot either is using terrible hardware, are very young so still have not the necessary skill, or simply have no idea at all how to properly play the game, and thus, are victims of jokes.

I myself have played purposely on bronze rank just to see and feel how are those games. Nothing happens in there. There is zero team cooperation. No team fights. Complete silence games not only chat or voice coms but the game itself. Everybody is split and doing stuff without any logic and honestly, my friend, and not wanting to sound offensive but is indeed funny to see.

Not being able to rank up such “easy games” (I know they may not be for many and I apologise for being any offensive) is either simply not wanting to learn at all, or not having any mechanical skill.

Bronze players are a minority, since the average is Gold and low Platinum.

As a player of this community, I apologise in the name of the “higher” ranked players. But unfortunately, just like you said, the quality of bronze games is very poor, and thus, funny to watch and comment on.

You have to accept dark jokes, not only in the game, but life as well.

I am aware my reply is not helping too much; but my intentions are for you to “understand” the point of view of the higher ranked players.

Good luck. Focus on yourself and having a plan all the time.

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You’re right. Bronze players are bad and of course people are going to say it. I say it. I don’t have a problem with people saying what they think. Everyone has the freedom to comment however they please. That’s what forums are for right? I’ve seen videos of GM players ribbing on diamond players because they are only diamond rank. I’d give my left arm to be diamond. Would probably hinder my performance even more if I did though right? The issue I was trying to address was because I’m at the lowest rank I must have something wrong with me, or so people must think. That puts a downer on you. especially when you try your hardest.

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Many hardstuck people fail to educate themselves about the ranking system and methods that make it possible to climb. Just playing more hours doesn’t make someone better.

Mechanical skills (e.g.: aiming and navigation) can be improved easily. A lot of people don’t even try. E.g.: I’ve seen a lot of players even in silver and gold who had so high mouse DPI and sensitivity that no one could aim with it. This is very obvious when you spectate them in QP or see their POTG/highlight. They haven’t even tried to find out the reason and playing more hours with those settings will NEVER make them good at aiming.

Overwatch isn’t a pure FPS game. It has a lot of MOBA elements and very diverse set of heros/abilities and a lot of them don’t require aiming. Aiming is only one of the many skills in this game. For example positioning is a much more important skill than aiming: being at the right place at the right time helps you in dying less often and helps you to extract more value from the abilities of your hero (for example if you know the good locations on the map for pharah, junkrat, etc…).

Another thing that can be improved significantly: building a team with LFG can eliminate a lot of negative factors that are in play when you solo queue and get a random team. If you watch some tutorials and commentated matches from better players then you can easily build a better team manually in LFG then the random teams you get from the matchmaker.

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This is another issue. Bronze is not easy to escape. I’ve had the game since launch and haven’t been able to climb. People in higher ranks have to make a special effort to throw matches to get into bronze. I can understand people having difficulty accepting that people can’t escape bronze when others have a hard time getting into it.

I, personally, don’t feel like a victim. The jokes and the ‘making fun of’ I can totally accept. Bronze players, like myself, are trash. I’m not offended by what people say, It’s the passive-aggressive “sympathy” towards lower ranks. “If you’re not playing on a PC powered by a potato, then there must have something wrong with you” is the vibe I get. I know that isn’t the majority, but when you’re looking for a little insight and see comments in that vein, it makes me wonder, is this what everybody thinks?

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I played competitive only in the last 3 seasons (the current one is my 4th) because I had a crashy PC before that. In my first two seasons I was hovering around 2000SR and I played mostly as a flex (mccree, roadhog, mercy). For this reason I often played support and sank down close to 1500SR several times. I could always climb back by instalocking mccree or roadhog. (Today we have LFG so you can easily play the role you want.) Around 1500SR teams and players are so bad that you should be able to kill a significant part of the enemy team alone with certain heros (given that you have OK mechanical skills and good positioning).

In my experience players in the silver-platinum range aren’t too different when it comes to mechanical skills. The biggest difference in my opinion is positioning. Better positioning helps one to die less often which results in better E:D ratio and better total damage output (and somewhat better “teamplay”).

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There is a difference between saying “diamond players are bad” and “bronze players are disabled”. The first one isn’t nice, but okay why not. The second one in unacceptable.

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Saying “disabled” instead of “having very bad mechanical skills” is disrespectful. You can find a lot of toxic/disrespectful people but why do you give them any attention? They’ll not disappear and doing this exactly because they know that some people have their attention and get hurt. They should be unworthy of your attention.

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LFG is only good when you at least have a friend that you know and “trust” in game.

You have no idea how many six stacks, us me and my duo, have found and been able to even full hold, and then you see that one or two leaves their team. That was, highly likely, a stack made by LFG. The feature is amazing, but the difference between somebody randomly jumping into your team, and another player on solo queue, is not that different. But yes, the role planning is at least a way better choice.

Bronze can be climbed my ONLY team work. Just the basic combos can make you reach silver fast as hell.

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The settings commentary is actually true. The highest DPI and sense is NOT the optimal choice at all.

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What i think about Bronze players is that they are people that started in FPS with OW and didnt bother to play enough with bots. This is specially true since bots in Hard mode are … actually better than Bronze players.

If you practice vs bots in hard mode everyday, theres no way you stay in bronze that much unless your learning capabilities are severely low. Sorry but it is what it is.

This game doesnt even require aim (winston, mercy, torb etc) and with if you play the objectives … it is super easy.

PS: If you find yourself unable to destroy bots in Hard, then you should ask yourself why and start learning. Replays are coming so, you will be able to record yourself and analyze afterwards.

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I built good teams several times and most of the time I started out without trusted team mates. You simply group up, try them in a match (not worse than solo queue) and then keep only the good players (if any). Refill the rest of the slots and repeat. You can continue this as long as you wish.

A lot of group leaders don’t check profiles don’t ask anything and don’t filter for anything. Team building is a skill.

Not different but in LFG you group up with them and you might be able to keep good players. They volunteer for groupup, you don’t have to approach and ask random people to groupup like you would have to after a solo queue match.

Besides role planning there are other significant advantages of LFG:

  • Filtering for endorsement level 2 or 3 can lower the number of toxic people in my experience.
  • You can check player profiles (and make sure they don’t have the same mains) and ask them about things before the match starts. These are essential if you want to build a good team.
  • You group up with them and it’s easier to keep good team mates for several matches - you fill the rest of the slots with newcomers (lottery like in case of solo queue) but at least they come to fill specific roles.

Having only 2-3 good players on your team for several matches can make the gaming experience and the outcome significantly better. Good players often play long hours and recognise that win rate is never 100% so don’t leave immediately after a loss if they think you are also good.

There are some downsides too: Some people don’t like grouping up with strangers and checking player profiles. As a group leader sometimes you have to be a d### and ask bad players to leave. If someone can’t ask bad players to leave then it’s impossible to improve team quality between matches. Some players commit very basic mistakes like overextending and those are bad habits that are unlikely to improve during the next 1-2 matches.

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I am sorry to say this but I find the bots advice insufficient to get better. This game’s AI is not the best, and if you practice against bots, you will just learn bad habits about positioning and awareness.

The hard bots are mostly harder due to them having almost aimbot-like aim, their positioning and movement are still predictable and bad.
I highly suggest just playing against real people no matter what, and learning from that. There are also numerous good guides online, if someone is into that thing.

To reply to the actual post: There are people in grand master that are being shamed for not having a high season peak, not hitting top500, or if they did they shame people for not staying in there, if they do stay in there then people shame them for being “low” top500.

Tl;Dr: There are rankshamers everywhere, don’t mind their opinions, it’ll keep you back from enjoying the game and/or getting better at it.

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Sorry but that statement is flawed, specially when certain ranks are actually worse than Bots. You get better by playing against better enemies, if you are worse than a bot and you get aim and reflexes enough to beat all hard bots fast, you will effectively climb. Its a fact.

You literally described the lowest rank of Overwatch but without the aimbot part. If the rank he wants to climb off from had good positioning and movement, he would not be in that rank. Again, fact.

If your aim and reflexes (basic mechanic skill) are so bad you cant beat bots in Hard, and according to you people have better positioning and awareness, what makes you think he will be able to beat those people?.

You have to walk before trying to run pal. Theres a progression, bots exist because of that progression.

Some people skip the tutorials and play vs AI and then get into a map and ask “WTF is the objective? who is talking? … where is the health pack again?”

Yeah, dont be those guys. Everybody hates those guys.

Having tools to improve and not use them makes zero sense but hey, you do you.

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I have used AI when I started to learn genji and how to engage/disengage with him in close combat. 5 hard AIs with me, 6 against me. If you are 2000SR with the hero you are playing then you can win effortlessly with lots of gold medals. The current AI can help people to get silver level mechanical skills and they can help bronzes a lot.

AI can simulate a lot of aspects of PvP gameplay (not all, but a lot) and the positioning of AI teams is significantly better than that of most bronze teams I’ve seen on youtube: the current AI doesn’t really have any strategies, it simply groups up when necessary and they go together. The difficulty level indeed comes from better aim and more rapid fire.

There are other good things when it comes to training with AI:

  • You can easily recreate and repeat certain situations that you’d otherwise face rarely in real life matches. One example is aim-bot custom games where a lot of headshot only bots spawn. You can play whatever kind of game you want on whatever map you want with custom settings (e.g.: you can set the cooldown of genji dash to zero if you want to practice something that requires dash). This way you don’t have to wait painful seconds to repeat something to improve your mechanical skills.
  • You are the only human in the match (or you can invite some friends for training into your custom game) and for this reason no one is shouting how stupid you are when you screw up something while practising.

For the above reasons I would really like to see improved AI with multiple levels of difficulties and different strategies/positioning. I think it could be a useful training tool for higher rank people too (most players are gold and plat). There are also some players who prefer VS AI matches and they would also welcome better AIs.

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Its a fact.

Again, fact.

Before I start saying anything, please stop treating your opinions and misinformations as facts, it makes you look dumb. You just threw in the “fact” card while you don’t really understand what a fact is, from what you wrote.

Sorry but that statement is flawed, specially when certain ranks are actually worse than Bots. You get better by playing against better enemies, if you are worse than a bot and you get aim and reflexes enough to beat all hard bots fast, you will effectively climb.

If a bronze player wants to climb then practicing against AI is still worse than matching up against bronze players, because:
If one learns how to beat the overwatch AI, he has learnt how to beat the overwatch AI and little else.
It is a common saying at this point that bronze players play like bots, but that is not really true. They are still people, it will be more realistic to train against actual players.
The only thing he will learn from bots is that they stick very close together, on the objective, all the time. That strategy above bronze will get you demolished instantly. A really useful tip what I’ve heard a while ago: Don’t train to be good at your rank, train to be the rank one above.
The mechanics will come with time, so it is still better to shoot at real players.

If your aim and reflexes (basic mechanic skill) are so bad you cant beat bots in Hard, and according to you people have better positioning and awareness, what makes you think he will be able to beat those people?

Do you really think it is about beating anything? No. People learn best from failure.

You have to walk before trying to run

Quite the opposite.
If you don’t challenge yourself you won’t grow at all.

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You should quote other people by selecting the text in their post and pressing the “Quote” button that appears above the selection. That way the quote contains a reference to the original post and the author of the quoted text. By repeating this process you can quote from multiple places from multiple people inside a single post.

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Quite ironic that you are calling me dumb when you dont even know how to quote in a forum but sure pal, you do you.
Facts are facts because they are. My statements are based on a reasoning that is true, therefore are facts. If you dont agree, then you have to prove why. Calling someone dumb because you dont like what he says or how he says it is a fallacy pal : Ad hominem.

No its not.
Ive played vs Hard bots and Bronze players and they are worse, what part of this are you not getting?
Bronze players, hard stuck in bronze players, already play vs bronze players all day and guess what happens? yeah … they dont learn and climb.

You cant train to be the rank above if you keep playing with players that are worse than you. Still if what you say is true, then bots WILL yield results because like i said, Hard bots are better than Bronze players.

No they wont. Because they are not pressured to have them.
Theres no person with aimbot in a corner that puts the pressure on you : If you dont strafe and kill the dude, you die. That DOESNT happen in bronze dude. In bronze you can do the most stupid stuff and get away with it. The Bots WONT let you get away with it because even they are super basic and dumb, they will hit you first.

No they dont, specially in overwatch. You cant learn from failure vs Bronze players because they LACK the awareness and gamesense to KNOW WHY they have lost the match.

Holy christ dude, you really look clueless about the situation down there.

You cant challenge your self to be an architect when you struggle doing basic maths and equations. Do you think we can all, as humans, skip school, high school and straight up study architecture at 12 ?

You are making zero sense just now. Zero understanding how the learning process works.

Good luck. Your profile is private (shocking lol) so i really hope you are way above bronze because otherwise, you are getting stuck there forever with that mentality.

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You just lost all credibility with starting to attack me on a personal level, or how I do and do not quote.

I hope you can grow from that and from your rank as well, peace out.