Make it a meter like d-va’s matrix, not a fixed time ability. Currently no reason to pick Orisa over other tanks really, as her static CDs are outplayed easily by anyone familiar with them.
orisa is already plenty strong-she has a hard cc, two sustain abilities and good close range damage. her only slightly weaker area is her ult
Ok, if her ult wasn’t a “now shoot me dead” button (like Brig’s whip shot when enemy team has hit scan), she wouldn’t need any other changes…
does her ult give her fortify for the duration? every orisa i’ve seen is gold while ulting. she seems pretty survivable in ult, it’s just too slow to reliably secure kills
I’d just keep it as it is… cooldown, damage reduction and so on… Just remove the no headshot nonsense.
The only added that as she was getting rolled in double sniper… (sadly that just aided double shield 
). It really isn’t needed now.
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i don’t think it’s much about orisa herself per se, she’s plenty tanky it’s that it’s hard to play orisa when the enemy team understands that you can just ignore the orisa and go for the backline, to me she’s very much so mid tier.
honestly i think the worst tank is junkerqueen currently, she gets messed up by everything and she’s so easy to read into what she’s gonna do.
Not a bad shout (although personally think it is Doom).
JQ is just only good in with very specific heroes in the comp… and most of the times you see her, she wont be in that comp.
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i don’t think doom is as bad as people make him out to be, he’s just a bit difficult.
like to me he’s a better dps/support killer than junker queen and he does have ways to outplay most tanks in the game in some way.
junker queen all she does have is basically her knife toss which is difficult to hit with and most of the times when it does hit it’s not gonna result in anything.
like what are you gonna do? shout and telegraph your moves by just running at the enemy? it just doesn’t work, good luck using carnage because it really doesn’t do a whole lot, i’ve had lucios boop me everytime i tried to walk forward using it, i’ve had kirikos use suzu on them too.
like how are you gonna hit anything with carnage unless you hit your knife on someone and if you use carnage on tanks you’ve basically just killed yourself because now you’re dealing with their tank and you’re about to die because you’re not as tanky as other tanks or you don’t have that same amount of dps and you don’t have that much mobility so you just die to other tanks.
and the supports all pretty much mess over JQ in a major way.
really JQ is a shotgun hero but is just plain worse than hog because he still got one-shots and his hook is more reliable and has a bigger HP pool and has a more functionally useful ultimate.
like JQ isn’t really that scary, there are lots of ways to just avoid her and if she does manage to do something it’s easily nullified.
that’s why i think JQ isn’t that good.
she’s fun though because it feels good to hit those knives, it feels good to shotgun people to death, it feels good to hit people with the axe, and the ultimate is really flashy and cool but usually don’t amount to anything.
but unless you hit most of your knives you could have just picked any other tank basically.
I mean it purely playing against.
I’ve not seen a Doom player in a game I’ve been in yet.
this is the main thing making junkerqueen better than doom. it’s an incredibly strong ultimate
i’ve seen a very few, either they hard fed or they were amazing, no real inbetween, like a doomfist would either slam in and die or they would kill 2 people off in less than 1 second.
the ultimate will most times kill you as junker queen if your team doesn’t follow up on it and it will accomplish nothing except your own death, and the mere existance of kiriko just makes the ultimate so much less worth doing because of her cleanse, like it’s a win more ultimate because your team had to have pressured the kiriko into using the cleanse before hand for the ultimate to be useful to begin with and if they can’t it just won’t do anything.
and dooms ultimate does kill more regularly than JQ’s ultimate especially on slow enemies and he doesn’t even need to use it to kill with, he can use it as an invulnerability escape which to be real is not bad.
let’s take one interaction into consideration, if the roadhog got you against a wall with his whole hog, if you’re JQ and got ult, you’re just dead because you can’t get out even with your ult, a doomfist it’s simply a press of a button to get out of it if you got your ultimate.
in that sense doomfist is better than winston, ball, JQ and reinhardt in that one example.
because all those tanks i named can’t do much against whole hog if they got cornered by it, but doom can.
you can still get a few kills with it-all it takes is the ult plus like one shot to kill someone unless the enemy have bubble, lamp or kiriko.
it’s pretty bad if it’s main use is an escape or it can only really solo secure kills on ana zen, and only then if they misplay and stand in the centre. it also takes the tank out of the fight for a bit. the devs have stated that they are looking to improve doom ult in season 2.
yes that’s true. however doom as a hero is countered pretty hard by hog so it doesn’t really matter because as soon as you land you’ll get hooked anyway
ok, take a look at ZBRA’s gameplay and montages, now find a junkerqueen player that even comes close to getting that amount of value.
at a bare minimum skill junker queen is better because she’s not as risky but she don’t get as much value as a doom can when you just skill up a bit.
like junker queen falls off really fast, but doomfist excels.
but with that said, doomfist is a bit unpredictable in how well he does even if you do manage to get good at him, that’s why i don’t put him as high as zarya, d.va, winston or reinhardt.
but doomfist can outplay any tank, it don’t mean he always will, but atleast he got the option.
compare that to junkerqueen, she has to basically hide and run away from every tank.
junker queen is about out maneuvering the other tank so she can get to the enemy backline, she don’t frontline and all she’s betting on is landing those knives because if she can’t land one she simply does not kill, if she manage to kill something with anything else it’s because the enemy made so many mistakes that lead them to die and if that is the case you could have picked literally any tank.
you get carried by your team as junker queen and never the other way around.
as junker queen you can’t go toe to toe with any tank and those that she could possibly go toe to toe with can escape her and outplay her with movement pretty easily.
but let’s say if you take a 3 day junker queen vs a 3 day doom i’m gonna bet that the JQ wins every time, but it shifts if it’s a 3 week junker queen vs 3 week doom.
also “hog counters doom” i think is false, why? because if you get hooked you can survive especially now when you got more HP and if your supports is worth having it won’t do anything to doom, but a doom can royally screw over hog and interrupt his self heal and mess up his hooks with his stuns and boops.
my tierlist goes a little bit like this.
1, zarya
2, winston
3, d.va
4, reinhardt
5, wreckingball
6, doomfist
7, orisa
8, roadhog
9, junker queen.
I watch zbra. he’s good, but the montages don’t tell the whole story. doom’s a burst impact hero, always was, which means better montages.
doom doesn’t excel. at the highest ranks, he is still outclassed by most tanks
really? I feel like she could easily take on a ball, winston or doom.
that’s the issue with the tank role. some heroes are just obsolete and get outclassed
because doom isn’t surviving a hog hook if the enemy team is also looking at him. he is incredibly squishy. block also can’t stop hook and he has an easy to hit crit with no armour
Ehh Orisa is actually pretty good and roadhog is mid. I’d put junkerqueen as second worse, just slightly above doom. I thibk it’s telling that on the US forums I see many posts regarding doom being bad and how people are always getting asked to swap off doom, but very few regarding junkerqueen
Interesting list, I’d put Dva over Winston though, and Rein even before Winston too?
i’ve been told to pick a shield hero a few times playing JQ, i default to winston and just win but i’ve played winston a lot and i know how to solo tank with him a lot and actually get value out of his primals which not a lot of winstons seem to get.
there isn’t a tank i can’t outplay with winston, if i lose that’s on me.
like legit i think if doomfists block actually was good he’d be sitting comfortably next to zarya just because rocket punch is that good of an ability.
it’s an insane aoe stun and boop on a squishier than normal tank, a tank that can travel really quickly in any direction he wants and his burst shots are actually good at eliminating squishies.
like i’d rather pick doomfist to fight pharah out of the sky than junker queen.
why i put orisa that low is for the simple reason that she’s avoidable, her biggest strength is that she does not die, well not that easily, like she’s the hardest tank to focus down.
but you don’t have to which is why orisa isn’t that good.
and roadhog isn’t that much of a scary tank unless he got hooks, difference between hog and junker queen is that hook kills squishies more often and is easier to hit with than junker queens knife tosses.
but hog in of himself gets countered by a lot of characters especially in the support roster but he can bully some tanks if he gets the chance which is why he sits comfortably above JQ and below orisa because orisa doesn’t get messed up by supports that much but gets outmaneuvered by the other tanks above on the list very easily.
i’d put d.va and rein over winston too if the game loop was about killing the enemy tank, but it just isn’t and winston can out maneuver d.va and rein and kill squishies easier than both, the thing d.va got is the ability to protect her squishies from projectiles and hitscans but winston don’t care and neither does zarya.
why i put zarya ontop is simply because she has self cleanse, and potentially 800 hp and the bubbles themselves can negate one shots like d.va bomb and she has an insane amount of damage and a versatile weapon that you can’t really deal with outside of a barrier and even then it will just straight melt barriers too and she can very easily enable her teammates.
but really the top 3 is all extremely good, it’s just that zarya beats both of the other 2 in ease of execution and value so she’s just more consistent overall.
I agree. punch is an insanely powerful ability. it’s just that to use it you have to utilise a kit that is rather underwhelming
yeah that’s fair. what rank are you btw? I’m judging tank strength for the average player, who often just shoots Orisa. however I do think while it is very possible to ignore orisa, it’s hard for low-mobility heroes, so she can easily secure kills on some heroes
yeah that’s why hog is pretty decent. he is the best 1v1 hero in the game and can destroy other tanks.
well it’s more than what some other tanks get, i’d rate rocket punch higher than hogs hook and orisas javelin for example and the mobility he has with it is extremely good.
i don’t play ranked, only QP, it’s more so to deal with less point/rank obsessed people because i don’t think ranked is competitive when you’re playing with a group of random strangers in a team game and it’s just a nuisance to deal with people think that it matters, QP have hidden MMR anyways but it will put you up against a larger playerbase which i’m totally down for because i get to see a wider range of players that way, everything from the widow that can’t hit a shot to save her life and the widow that clicks heads like it was their day job.
yeah hog is probably one of the best 1v1 tanks, it’s just that the game isn’t a 1v1 game, that’s why hog isn’t that great, but if he’s given space enough and the enemy isn’t looking out for each other hog will just wreck shop if he lands hooks but hog is also slow and his range isn’t that impressive in terms of threat outside of hook which is why he is where he is at.
as long as you can dodge hook you don’t really need to fear hog and if you got supports that’s on the ball you don’t even need to care about hog at all, a kiriko that slaps suzu on the teammate that gets hooked every single time? well hook becomes borderline useless.
yes. but they have far higher survivability and can use their strong abilities without having to charge it.
yeah I got matched against a rank 26 widow on junkertown today in qp. not fun.
hog isn’t great, but he’s decent because when the enemy don’t directly try to counter the hog, they can do whatever they want