no id rather play the game and not sit in queues and ccs whole day.melees have no clue how much it sucks to have interrupt with 15 seconds cooldown on a lot of classes.kick used to last 6 seconds.there are interrupts in cata that last 8 seconds.just tune down damage in retail like in cata.
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I wonder if Serral could solo win WoW blizzcon multitasking 3 characters.
At least it would give room for Maru fanboys to be happy again 
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The ideology of making CC matter doesnât come when some classes dont have access to important game winning CC. Windwalker as an example is unable to win games unless being carried by a dk or rogue, if CC starts mattering again and durations go up then it is more than fair to give monks back their stun so they can finish games. Monks are also one of the few melees with the least amount of micro cc in the game if you ignore ring of peace. And thats also part of why it is so easy to play into monks atm and why it feels like youâre on the drivers seat all game.
Boomy can shapeshift to remove slows, disengage in boomy form, typhoon you away and clone you to get distance, all things which make boomy mobile.
SP never really was mobile you have feathers but thats about it, its more compensated for having baseline DR and short cds on defensives + offheals
Ele can ghost wolf kite, thunderstorm, use their wind torpedo jump, root people, slow people
This matters more than you think, because if mages are dependant on 1 blink they have to make important decisions to use it for CC or Survival, Alter Time on a 90s cd lets them gain one blink charge every one and half a minute. No blast wave means one less tool to get melees away from you, no slow removal on barriers is especially big for arcane because you usually run faster than a ferrari so thats not an option anymore. The only options mages have at this point is 1 blink, displacement on 45s cd and frost nova to get melees away from them. This means mages will be much more trained and have to deal with the lockout changes too since especially a few melees (monks, DH and Feral) will probably stay on top of mages since theyre considered the (mobile) melees with a twist which should be in the number changing apartment. I do not feel it is right that those melees do more damage than a warrior for example with the mobility they would have access to.
Deepfreeze gives mage an intentive to go for CC and use blinks offensively and use the important cc they have (polymorph) to win games. Every single healer in this game has tools to stop polymorph on them, so if you interrupt the mage during deepfreeze or stop him then he most likely wont land his cc and you stopped him successfully. Moments like these are good for the game
Its a weakness if you play with bad players but if you coordinate in a good team and you peel during the deepfreeze the mage will get the poly off and you create a win condition.
because MM still has, disengage, freedom, cheetah, knock trap, steeltrap which is still a ton of mobility.
You could think about removing stuns like shockwave or fel eruption but at this point theyre way too integrated in the game for those classes to function and since they usually have a role which is to be the âcarryâ melee it is not necessarily a bad idea to keep those stuns. micro stun cc only exists when bad comps are good, if a comp like warrior/dh is a good comp then there should be severe weaknesses for playing this comp. Since everything revolves about damage, there are no weaknesses to play a comp like this. So whatever class does the most damage and can benefit eachother for that damage they do it is a good comp in the current DF pvp.
So why not just give every spec who dont have a non-cd long CC 2 stuns then? Would be some specs who gets it if so.
Boomy: Slow removal/typhoon and clone is called mobility?
SP: With full lockout SP gets weaker.
Ele: Ghost wolf and root is what you wanted to nerf though. Thunderstorm is not a mobility. Otherwise we have quite insane amount of mobility if everything is being counted.
You are aware that if you reduce mobility for both melee and casters, the casters just needs less things to keep melees away? Or do you actively want to achieve 90%+ melee uptime? Will they deal mediocre dmg due to it or will they deal high enough dmg its threatening like today? If a spec deals not even enough dmg while sitting on a target, the only thing that will ever matter is long CCs.
Which will mean setup comps will have the highest chance of winning. Is that what you are aiming for?
Can you explain to me what kind of things you consider mobility? Feels like you add CCs/micro-ccs into the mix to count as mobility.
Is this some way of saying âI dont want it removed because I believe these specs have gotten used to itâ? Then that could be said about most things you wanted removed or hard-nerfed.
So in what way are you expecting WoW PvP to change in every expansion? Should it just be its own thing on its own platform where no expansions will ever be released? Just a forever Cata state?
Since if you want it to be in retail, it needs to be offset from PvE talent tree and just fully remade to prune alot of skills and modifiers.
I think they should stick to certain rules of thumb, maybe shake meta up by altering some things on rotations etc between seasons (set bonuses are also a good way to do this), but generally not overload trees with class power and mobility.
Like, why do DHs need to stick 8 debuffs on something when they throw glaive? Stuff like that is stupid, itâs them throwing their glaive?
Just make chaos strike stronger for example
Im not sure if you are trolling at this point. But if you can use CC which removes a player from your position or you are locking someone in place it means you can outrun just by simply pressing W. If for example a Warrior sits in a steel trap he has to use his mobility to catch up to you which gives you an opportunity or say better an advantage to kite a melee just by using utility spells. Idk why I had to explain that but since I had to I think youâre just trolling at this point and im not interested to discuss that specific topic further.
I asked you an honest question and you call me a troll. Goodluck though.
Why donât you write with your mage?
donât forget: rogue cos : delete the physical dmg imune, delete the subterfuge
Imagine having retail with the DMG we have now and now add a 8 sec silence to mages and 5sec deep freeze. Frost Mages currently with Ray + Frost Bomb can 100 - 0 someone almost solo, landing a single silence would be the end of the game vs mage + rogue. Now add to that longer saps, longer blind allowing rogues to blind into sap again. We can not just give 2x more CC to people in the current state of Dragonflight without reducing DMG by like 50%. Iâm not talking about reducing DMG in Cata, Iâm saying the idea of adding more CC and longer CC into Retail would kill PvP cause we have too much DMG and dampening already.
Current meta is more tanky than entire shadowlands and all previous seasons of df
Did you not see the AWC? Wasnât the last game won with a single smoke bomb? Didnât we have games that ended with a single CC on healer and 100-0 in 5secs? If the DPS / burst is high enough to kill someone in 5secs or less from 100% imagine what would happen if you had a 8sec silence into a 5 sec deep freeze, mage alone with instant CC can create a situation where a healer can die twice. Look at solo shuffle where you have dampening ramp up like crazy, most games donât make it even to the 2-3 min mark. You want solo shuffle to end at the 1 min mark? Imagine getting 8sec sap into 8sec stuns into silence into 8 sec blind and you can resap again. Add on top of that later a 8sec silence and another 5 sec deep freeze. Mage + Rogue with old CC could easily CC a healer for 30+secs. And repeat 1min later.
How can you even think to double the amount of CC and not lower the current DMG? On top of that the OP is asking to remove mobility and remove survivability. So not only will we have 2x more CC in the game, but also half of the survivability removed but DPS still do 200k DPS. 
I guess you didnât watch awc. Only DH, ele, boomy, outlaw, arcane completely damping everyone and each other
Now with stamina buffs and main stat nerf there is 0 chance somebody dies even in 30 sec cc chain. Every class has too much deff cds. Every this type of nerf benefits dhs, eles and any other similar no cc required to win. Mage not pressing polys and just aoe. Hunters cannot trap, because ai bots in arena randomly appears right under the healers. Sub rogues and ferals not existing.
With bad healers it even NOW ends in 1 min. With good healers game lasts till 80-90% damp in shuffle but also if dps players press deff cds properly. Healers are so overbuffed with healing, cds, cc. Good healers can carry games solo
Because i know how game works and you donât. These crazy cc chains would never happen in shuffle. And ofc never on low rating 
Dh and ret best classes in shuffle not because of cc now. But because these types of spec doesnât require to press cc to win a game even on very high rating
Also I think I know why you are talking that there is a lot dmg in arena. I played about 3-5 shuffle on my fury warrior on 1900-2100. People here havenât press any cd correctly once and healers just forgot to heal. I observe them, these healers just running around and spamming dmg when enemies dps pressing their burst. And heal only when their teammates drop low. Lmao
Die hard solo shuff peakers will keep telling you that ancient pvp is boring and bad meanwhile glad next expansion might need to drop requirements to 2k cause literally nobody enjoys retail pvp nowdays.
in general you are right its pretty dampy at the top ratings, no comparison to bfa though or some former seasons
i mean thats not really true. If somebody makes a mistake you can still 100-0 someone in a short stun with cooldowns but its not like in SL where you died in one gcd lol
Ok so letâs just ignore 99% of the playerbase playing at 2100 and under and letâs balance everything around 2700+ cause that is when finally people in general donât die in 5secs instead require 10secs. Letâs double the CC on every single class while at the same time REDUCING survivability to let people at 2700+ die in 5 secs instead of 10secs.
Do you not see that doubling CC while ALSO reducing survivability is most probably just gonna destroy PvP for the MAJORITY of players?
Yes, letâs ignore, because it doesnât matter on this rating that there 10 deff cds or 3 deff cds, 8 sec poly/trap or 6, 8 sec blind + sap or cringe 5 sec blind and 6 sec sap
Donât lie that u stuck in cc. Being in cc for 5-8 sec every 1-2 min is not a lot. 99.99% players here overlap drs do random cc without setup of their dmg. Same with overlapping drs on roots and knockbacks. Rogue/Mage by default donât exists on low rating. Survival hunters that play good around cc too. Ferals also doesnât exists because it is hard spec to play.
What exists is dh, ret, war, warlocks, eles etc. Specs where you win by only dmg and damping
No, this players wonât die in 5 or 10 seconds like players on 2100. Mostly it will be good cd rotation and kiting, and los all game
I think it would destroy pvp for you, but more than 10000x more players and even new players will enjoy pvp
as a mage, i do not want Deep Freeze, and ill tell you why
Stuns feels like a lazy game design with almost no real counterplay, mage has sheep, db, and ring, and while people claim those ccs are no brainers and take 0 effort, they still:
BREAK ON DAMAGE
have to be casted, even heal your enemies, and even dispell dots and bleeds
people claim that MoP pvp was peak, but let me tell you, pressing deepfreeze into 1 pyro 2 icelance and 3 arcane missiles didnât exactly feel like a better design to me than what i have to do today to kill smth.
most stuns should legit go. people say that without stuns its just dps race and pve, but thats exactly whaqt it is right now PLUS the stuns and healing reduction, so, its just more frustrating to not be able to move your character AND taking an insane amount of dmg while at it
if u are sheeped or ring of frost, u donât have control of your character, BUT u r not getting melted by dmg at least
stuns are a lazy way to play, anyone can press hoj, bolt, deepfreeze, and dps rotation, it takes no skill to do so
Snowdrift is a good example of how stun should exist in the game, it has a cd, u need to satisfy a few conditions, one of them you need to be near enemies, and the second it takes time to build up, its good for peeling, its good for setting up your burst, its good to buying time
a bad example of stuns is current rogue, idc and idk if im playing vs a r1 or a 1.6, because once the rogues checked on youtube a burst rotation, all of them will just, kidney, cheap, cheap, cheap and u dead.
u trinket ? they reset
u block? they reset
you prealter ? well, if they donât leave a 0.2 sec gap to press alt chances are u gonna die without being able to alter back.
im okay with rogues dmg, and im even okay with their dmg, im not okay with both at the same time.
Iâm talking about the changes you wanna make⌠For the love of god⌠And the changes you want will not be 5-8secs every 2mins, it will be 30sec CC per minute. 8sec would be a SINGLE silence. Deep Freeze after you got 13sec. Poly after that you got 21sec from a single player with one actually cast. Now add a rogue that would say sap off that, or blind, or continue the stuns. You get easily 30+ sec of CC without even optimizing for DRs, if they optimized for DRs they could go longer.
Yeah because thatâs the current meta where dmg, burst and mobility is so high that you can land kills with just micro ccs and we have dampening so if you survive long enough burst in late dampening is the win condition.
Now imagine leaving this DMG and doubling the CC, DH + Rogue kills your team before the healer gets a chance to even play the game. Almost every single class / spec can easily hit 200k+ DPS during burst. That means you can die in 4secs with 2 ppl on you. Half of the specs hit 300k+ DPS and even close to 400k DPS. 2x 300k DPS = you can die in less than 3secs.
Watch some Cata arenas, you have games with Supa / Venruki / Snupy where their healer is like 20sec in CC and they can easily survive the enemy DMG, because Cata ainât as bursty. When you look at their games they have like 5k, 6k, 7k DPS depending on game, sometimes under 5k DPS and players have like what 120k HP? That means it would take 2 players 10sec to kill you. Even if we take that they can do 10k DPS in Cata itâs still 6secs to kill someone. Current retail has triple the DMG of Cata, how do you imagine tripling the DMG, and leaving 30sec CC chains would ever work? Cata would be a fiesta and retail also.
Yeah for sure removing half of the survivability, leaving DMG, doubling the CC wouldnât make people randomly die during AWC. Weâve already seen this AWC that random swaps during low dampening would sometimes end games in a single smoke bomb or CC on healer. For sure cutting survivability in half and doubling CC wouldnât make that happen more often. FOR SURE.
Yes new players for sure will love getting CCed for 20 secs by a single mage the first time they meet one in solo shuffle. For sure existing players would love doubling the CC, we only have like 10 topics per week saying micro CC sucks and burst is too high. For sure more healers would play solo shuffle if only CC chains doubled. The reason I donât play healer much is Iâm not getting CCed enough, if only I would get CCed more often for longer Iâd FOR SURE play more RDruid. FOR SURE.
What? No, itâs never been a thing in arena. Counter spell/warlock pet used to give 2-3 sec silence if you are talking about them
No, healers have now too much to avoid cc. Druid even cannot be cced by hunters and mages
Always used for deep + poly combo
Also mages with deepfreeze feel like independent class. Not rogueâs pet
Good druids back in the days pre reshift deep freezes so mages could only cast longer casting ring of frost and couldnât repoly
You are a bit right. There is a lot of dmg, but there is a lot of healing as well. Every single spec in the game is dh with high mobility. Awful mythic+ design and dh lost it so called uniqueness with aoe abilities in st
Current cata is more burst than shadowlands season 1. And no retail isnât triple dmg of Cata. You are looking at dps which means you donât understand how arena works. I can remind you, looking at dps meter in arena back in the days considered âlow skillâ, to put it mildly.
If blizzard truly made âclassicâ and didnât mess up with dmg modifiers, in full resil gear it will be infinite games. Because Iâve played cata a lot, on pr serv but still, if there was no pve abuse in last season, game would feel unplayable. Dampening is must have in cata and blizzard doesnât care and not adding it
As I said, you can drop game if you donât like skillbased mathcmaking. But thousands of more players will come and play game with no overbloating buttons and where skill is not pressing pve rotation all game