Bugs and misdesign

Classes Hunter
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I tested hunter seriosly for a month or so, and here is the list of bugs and misdesign in spells, that I found:

  • Animal Companion I found a post as of last year, and basically all the bugs listed there are yet not fixed and still occur: https://us.battle.net/forums/en/wow/topic/20765986872
    These are: Pet sometimes does not attack, Pet sometimes does not go invisible when you apply Camouflage, Pet doesn’t always obey Play Dead, it doesn’t appear instantly.

  • Spider Sting Does not work on Demon hunter’s Rain from Above. It does trigger when DH casts Fel lance and apply Silence, but DH can still continue casting Fel Lances. So I see no protection from it, except for Aspect of the Turtle, which a trade of 3 min cd over 1 min cd.

  • Feigh death Is a nightmare, casino, slot machine. In PVP the chance that it will remove from combat is random. I used it many times under Aspect of the Turtle, with pet, without pet, vs 1 target, vs many targets - does not matter, sometimes it just doesn’t remove you from combat.

  • Survival Tactics The part where it says: reduces damage taken by 99% for 1.5 sec. I find this very important and interesting misdesign issue. The issue is in target’s spell casts vs whom you use this ability. I think one day in WoW Blizzard has changed the way how spell damage is applied on the target, like when the actual damage should be calculated.
    Before the change it was about a skill cap - the damage was calculated upon the spell actual visual landing. So if you were fast enough you could time when to avoid the damage, for example mages used to have 100% spell immune after blink, so you could avoid warlock death coil.
    Now the damage is calculated when you finish casting the spell. So it doesn’t matter if you are far or close enough, the spell will hit the same amount whatever the target does.
    So it is impossible to reduce the damage of the Greater pyroblast, or Chaos bolt casting Feigh death when the cast has already finished - it will hit you the same amount.
    The clear evidence of that - I was standing in mage’s Orb of frost and mage’s pet continued attacking me - 3 ticks of Orb were reduces, but pet’s bolt that was between these ticks - not.

I think Survival Tactics need to be changed (longer damage reduction duration or just another effect, since it will protect you only from AOE damage), and previous bugs - fixed.

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Yep, it still holds a lot of mechanical issues. I very much doubt that either will be fixed during BfA.

Have said this in other replies but I really hope that they scrap this talent, going forward. Instead, they should just turn it into a baseline passive effect, like a ‘‘reverse Lone Wolf’’ for BM.

You can manually call out a pet of your choice like normal. It deals full damage like it’s supposed to.
You can also choose to manually call out a second permanent pet. The damage they both deal is the same as when only using 1 pet. It would just be split between them both.

If you have chosen to call out that second pet, then the game will continue to summon both pets every time you either use Call Pet or if you dismount, or come off a flight path etc.

To go back to using only one pet again, it’s enough to just manually dismiss the pet you no longer want to use.

Mechanically, when you use two pets, they should both benefit from the same things. Like Feign Death, Mend Pet, Exhilaration and more.

The only things that should be restricted to one ‘‘main’’ pet, is Growl as well as the Command Pet-ability. Also the spec specific passive bonus effect(leech/stamina/movement speed).

In short, Lone Wolf talents or Double Pet(AC) talents the way they’ve been designed in WoW. They don’t work that well. I would love the baseline option of having two active pets. The current AC talent is so broken and unreliable that it’s just not worth it.

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Don’t know why but this expansions talents are honestly abandoned, i swea i haven’t moved a single talent after the 8.1 re-rework :confused: they just seem to refuse to even try to balance them…

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There are many things regarding the BM talents that I would like for to be changed/improved. Both in terms of numbers and performance as well as the mechanical/thematical design and fantasy.

Mostly in regards to that second part.

Posted this on the US forums a little while back. I cannot speak for numbers but IMO, it would at least for me, make the different talents and effects more interesting.

Tell us what would be a solution to some of BM’s problems

This ofc depends on what we as individuals consider as potential problems.

For me personally…

BM has a lot of issues with it’s talent design.
Note that any talents not mentioned, I’m mostly okay with. For now…

Killer Instinct(15) , adds a needed damage boost to KC. Though the talent in itself does so little so I wouldn’t say that it warrants being a talent option.

Animal Companion(15) , much like Lone Wolf for MM(when it was a talent) is just a big mess. It should be a baseline effect for BM, not a talent. You should be able to choose yourself if you want one or two pets out. They should both use the same offensive abilities, just split the total dmg between them.

Dire Beast(15) , you should once again be able to choose between this and Barbed Shot(Frenzy stacking). Instead of now where it’s just a bland use-on-CD ability.

Scent of Blood(30) as it is now, isn’t particularly good, nor is it interesting to use.
At the very least, they should add in a secondary effect to this talent. Something like making Barbed Shot bleed damage have a chance to make your next Kill Command be a guaranteed critical strike dealing increased critical damage to the target.
Or if you use Dire Beast instead of Barbed Shot, this talent would cause your Kill Command to deal more damage the more Dire Beasts that are active(or something similar to this). Sort of a, Leader of the Pack-situation.

Venomous Bite(60) should have the BW CD-reduction increased to 1.5-2.0 seconds, up from 1. And each Cobra Shot fired when you’re not under the effect of BW, should increase the duration of your next BW by 0.5-1.0 seconds(consumed when BW is used). Or you could go with each Cobra Shot fired during BW, extends BWs remaining duration by 1 second.

Thrill of the Hunt(60) , the bonus to crit should affect your pet and not just yourself.
Simple as that.

A Murder of Crows(60) should be made a baseline ability. Each Kill Command used on a target affected by AMoC should extend AMoC’s duration by a few seconds.

Stomp(90) , is mostly okay on this tier, I just want them to fix the bugs where your pet tends to cast it before actually reaching it’s target. Make Stomp casts from Barbed Shot(or Dire Beast) into a ‘‘buff’’ similar to Intimidation. Your pet(beasts) uses it once they are in range of the target.

Barrage(90) shouldn’t be a BM option at all if you ask me. It doesn’t fit in WoW as a game and it most certainly does not fit the BM spec.

Stampede(90) is a neat idea, though a giant pain to use. Make it into a bonus effect added to your Bestial Wraths. As in, every time you use BW, you summon X of your stabled pets to attack enemies until BW fades. They auto attack enemies and they benefit from Beast Cleave if activated. There we have the AoE-component as well.

Spitting Cobra(100) should be reworked. Increase the attack range to 40-50 yards, instead of 25. The attacks made by the Cobra should apply a debuff to any targets hit that causes every Cobra Shot used on a affected enemy to summon a snake(similar to the Cobra Commander-trait from the BM artifact in Legion).

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yeah saw it in the us forums, usually lurk there but don’t want to pay more money just to post there lol, honestly i really miss dire beast, it was really fun to just chuck animals at my enemies, and with the talents you also had a choice between the two which i dearly miss. I really hope they’ll go back on their words and rework classes now or at the very least balance talents, can’t stand another year of playing my class like this, gimme something new T.T

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I agree.

I liked the old Dire Frenzy in itself. Especially how it interacted with Beast Cleave, giving you more on-demand AoE-capability through your pet(s).

But the constant maintaining of that Frenzy-buff was/is just annoying. I mean sure, technically it adds a slight increase in difficulty when in combat. But you will with a guarantee end up in situations where you have no choice but to drop it due to running out of charges. It’s at those times where it becomes…less fun.

Not to mention now in BfA when Bestial Wrath is on the GCD, so by the time you reach 3 stacks of Frenzy on your pet, most of BW has already run out…

Some players did not like the repeated calls of those wild beasts. But what was good about it in Legion is that we were allowed to choose between the both. Us who liked the beasts and the increased ‘‘freedom’’ of Dire Beast-usage over Dire Frenzy could do just that. Choose…

Who knows what will happen going forward.

I’ve been fairly vocal about my desire to bring back the old ranged SV playstyle as a 4th spec option. And have given detailed suggestions for how it could work.

#[Suggestions updated] Pre-Legion Survival [4th spec]

If people like the design or not, is up to them. Changed some things based on feedback which I agree, have been for the better.

I hope we can get better balance and design than we have now yes. Though, perfect balance is not achievable. There will always be that one choice which performs better.

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let’s not talk about GCD please, i hate it soooo much haha

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My biggest curiosity is how will Blizzard handle Legion leveling for new specs/classes. What will they do for artifacts?

Even switching Survival back to being ranged would mean adding new assets.

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The leveling aspect of the game as an MMO is always a tricky one, when it comes to how it’s developed over time.

On one hand, you want to keep past content and stories in the game somehow, so that those who come in later can get some sense of it’s history.

On the other hand, it’s supposed to be an ever living and ever evolving world that we’re a part of. And IMO, that has to include all aspects of the world. Especially when it’s something as major as the main story lines(or characters) connected to entire expansions.

As an example, Legion(the expansion) was about just that, the Legion invading Azeroth. We have since supposedly defeated them.
If that’s not reflected in the world as a whole and on the continents that served as key areas in the story’s development stages, then if you ask me, it would very much break the immersion.

As an example, we still have questchains in Stonetalon Mountains for the Horde that involves Garrosh from MoP. As in, he is still the warchief according to those quests. From a Lore and Story development perspective, things like this has to be updated to fit the overarching narrative.

If we go back to Legion and for example Artifacts. If you ask me, the overarching story of those zones has to be updated to reflect how we defeated the Legion. If we want to keep the immersion at level that is.

You can ofc do a lot of things with the phasing techniques to allow for players to see how the story develops as if it was still current. However, most players who level up these days, will go through everything so quickly. They don’t even spend enough time in Legion-specific content to get enough background tied to the past story to feel like what has happened since is within a reasonable grasp. To feel like it connects/makes sense when compared to what they are doing while leveling up.

For me personally, I would want the quest chains involving Artifact Weapons along with the weapons themselves to be made optional. You can choose to complete the quest chains tied to each weapon and you can choose to make use of said weapons. But they should no longer remain a prerequisite for the entire main story of Legion. We set out to find/acquire those weapons as means to help us defeat the Legion. We have since done that.

As far as I know, now, Artifact Weapons aren’t much different from Heirlooms. Mechanically that is.

It doesn’t take much to design new assets that would work the same way.
If wanted, they could also create short quest chains that explain how and why you would want to go after any new Artifacts as well(in order for any potential new specs or even classes to fit in better). This would require a bit more time/work though.

They could also just put in regular weapon models/assets like those we’ve had in all other expansions. That way, you wouldn’t have to go after the artifacts in order to get through Legion content while leveling up.

It would yes. Although I want to highlight that what I talked about earlier here, is not about removing current Survival in favor of bringing back the old version that included Explosive Shot, Black Arrow and Serpent Sting, etc.

I know of many players who like the new SV spec.

Hence why I’m suggesting to go for the 4th spec-route.

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So … i guess MM with Lone Wolf is the only solution atm, if you don’t wanna play a buggy game?

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Very much depends on what you’re after.

Lone Wolf MM does not have the issues with pet related bugs/quirks but on the other hand, MM in itself has a very distinct playstyle that might not speak to everyone else(pet or no pet).

Despite the bugs related to pets(and talents involving them in various ways), you can very much play specs that involve using them. I’ve stuck with BM since we went into Legion and have managed to do well in every piece of content that I’ve been involved in.

Mostly, the bugs are just kind of annoying when you encounter them. Is this an excuse to not fix the reported bugs and other quirks brought up in feedback? No, not at all. It/they should be fixed.

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