Eldre’Thalas as a new home for the Night Elves?

On the one hand, staying up north makes more sense. Why establish your new home far from your pre-existing settlements around Mount Hyjal and have it be behind enemy lines (Mulgore, the Barrens, etc.)? It also wouldn’t make sense to weaken their presence around Nordrassil, which is now the final World Tree and their only away to regain immortality AFAIK.

But on the other hand, it would probably make sense to have two Alliance settlements on Kalimdor, both off the coast to the west but one to the north (Exodar) and one to the south (Feralas). It would allow them to dominate the seas and give easy access to the entire continent. If we assume that Mount Hyjal will be more of a neutral holy site, inhabited more by druids than Night Elves specifically, then this could make sense.

But truth be told, I think I’d prefer the first option. I want the Night Elves to be like savages roaming the forests. They should have little hidden dwellings here and there inside the hills and atop the trees, but no major cities. Hyjal and other surrounding places could be their holy places but they don’t need to live there.

Hmmmm. You mean like this?

https://www.bernistore.it/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/lothlorien.jpg

Tolkien would approve, but I can’t help feeling that some stone temples of the moon would also have a rightful place within the night elven settlements.

What I am concerned about is them losing their ‘magical’ identity and become pure forest elves, if ALL the urban elements are scrapped.

They shouldn’t be primarily city dwellers - those are the Blood Elves and Nightborne, but I always felt there still was a duality to them, due to the fact that they were originally meant to be a mix of dark and forest elves, rather than just the latter.

I’d prefer to avenge my old home first, thanks.

Argus? I thought we did that in Legion, did we not? :face_with_hand_over_mouth:

Seriously however, I can’t recall having specified when, or said anything that might lead you to assume that one thing would necessarily have to be neglected for the other.

The suggestion is about a new capital. You may prefer Hyjal, or even feel that the Night Elves should not get any new capital city at all because it fits them better to mourn and be feral - that’s ok. But it’s not like thinking about a possible new capital for the future would necessarily make it impossible for Tyrande to get her revenge. She may not be able to think of anything else until she gets it… but we are just humans discussing a fantasy story after all. :wink:

I agree some urban reclamation would make sense, or rebuilding - primarily temples. If you look at Darnassus other than the initial Terrace the only building that is made of stone in the city is the Temple; the rest are lodges. I’d prefer this theme is continued.

I’m well aware nelf have a history of arcana, but that is history, and the fact some of SD have rejoined them does not change that, the SD are still outsiders to the culture and their inclusion is more a gesture of tolerance of them, as opposed to championing their ideals. So it seems to me it’s more a case of “you’re welcome back, but you do things our way, okay?”.

This isn’t to say they’re required to give up arcana entirely, clearly that isn’t the case, but the days of nelf building dedicated arcane libraries and stuff are clearly behind them. I don’t think their culture has that element to it anymore - it should be pushed in the direction it has moved towards (druidism and elune worship) rather than pushed backwards.

We already have two elf subspecies (three if you count velf) that have the whole arcane ubrane elves, even if nelf “half-dip” into this, it’s oversaturation of a done theme, especially considering their lore has moved them away from it (making them more distinctive) so to push them back gently in that direction a bit makes them less distinctive at the cost of their USP (there are no other nature-based elves atm).

So yeah, reclaim ruins by all means if it’s plausible, but i’m not on board with nelf building urban structures outside of temples/places of worship because at that point you just begin to tread on the toes of Nightborne, even if a little.

People need to remember the SD are very much the outsiders in nelf society, they are the minority, and although tolerated that doesn’t mean they are championed. Tyrande didn’t exactly make it unknown what she thought of what the Nightborne represented so the idea accepting SD back in means nelf are perhaps more accepting of urban settlements isn’t there for me. Arcana is still something clearly viewed with distrust in their society and in my opinion they probably accepted the SD back on a “better the devil you know” principle than anything else.

Leave the marble buildings and spellweaving to the Nightborne and Belf and have the nelf create cities borne of the land itself. A huge conclave of buildings and platforms between great trees and beneath their raised roots for example. There is too much focus in game on what the nelf were (endless ruins and ghosts of mages) perhaps it is time to focus on what they actually are.

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I don’t know if you have checked the image in the OP - but if you didn’t, you might want to.

I’m not talking of a properly urban scenario (as we both agree, that belongs to the horde) but elegant temples and gardens, as in some sort of Forest city where the columns and the trees all seem to make part of the same structure.

IMHO Dire Maul works nicely a location because it can be used as a source of stone for the temples, it is close to a military stronghold, and it offers development possibilities in terms of updated dungeons in case there was something to be recovered/hidden/destroyed to prevent it from falling into the wrong hands.

As for the SD, I think Leíá expressed this quite nicely:

So yes, I totally agree about them having integrated with the main Darnassian culture and not seeking a new proper urban environment.

At the same time however I would not want the Night Elves to lose their beautiful stone temples, and I am altogether concerned for Nordrassil as I feel that it is not an appropriate place to settle despite (and because) of it being connected to the Well. I don’t want a new Zin-Azshari to be built in what I see there is a sacred place, which should be kept free of settlements regardless of their type. There already are a few shrines there… Those are enough to me, and that’s how I would rather have it stay.

When Nordrassil doesn’t become a city (and IMHO it really should not. Not even like Darnassus) then either the Night Elves should not get a new capital, or they could use the Thick Forest of Feralas stripping Eldre’Thalas of stone how it happens in real life (plenty of churches built stripping the ancient Roman ruins).

P.S. I am saying this because I know there are fans who would have the Darnassians to make their capital in Nordrassil AND the Highborne to have their own in Eldre’Thalas. To each their own, I suppose, but to me it just doesn’t make any sense. Since the SD are now members of the Night Elven society, it would feel absurd for me to see them self-isolate again, and it also makes no sense to me that they would want to restore their ancient city as it was. Heck, shouldn’t they have learned something in 10k years of suffering? IMHO they should either reclaim the area together with the rest of the Night Elves and for all of the Night Elves to shape it together as appropriate to their new culture, or not at all.

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Indeed. I could almost see a temple-city type complex being eventually built, with plentiful gardens and such throughout, growing between the stone walkways and acloves. All I wish for nelf is that, as said in previous post, they focus more on their present than their past, because as far as wow races go, there is a big preoccupation with everything they have done, or has happened to them, but not so much on what they’re doing now.

This becomes more of an issue going forwards from BFA because with the introduction of the Nightborne, their present is in many way the nelf’s past so by simply continuing their story you get that in a manner of speaking - although of course it will differ based upon their own choices, particularly as the arcan’dor itself is a harmony of arcane and nature magic. This may well influence the direction of Shal’dorei under Thalyssra’s stewardship. Not the point of druids or whatnot, but perhaps a less domineering relationship with nature and more of using magic to remain in good standing with it/not crap all over it in favour of unbridled pursuit of the arcane.
And seeing as Thalyssra is one of few AR leaders who gets continued screentime and is one of the heads within the War Council (as well as associated with Lor) it is probable that NB will continue to get storylines thrown their way which is more than we can say for some ARs. This creates more of a need to have nelf travel in a unique trajectory because it doesn’t seem like NB are at risk to be “forgotten”.

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Why live in ruins when you could grab a perfect fixer-upper over in Duskwood?
In the centre is a cosy mountain ringed area with a large tree, a portal to (I think?) The emerald dream? It already has night elf ambiance and a moonwell.
Its small, secure from ground troops and the tree might be large enough for work to be done on its root zone for underground areas. There is a reasonable amount for room around the base of the tree.
Druids could coax trees to grow around the mountain sides to help provide structures to grow for buildings, and platforms for air support to stop flyby attacks.
Its also dusk all the time there, suitable for night elf ascetic.
I thought of it the first time I went by again to map it on a new character actually.
And, its a good place to start at right now, so you can have a place to rebuild morale, numbers and plan for later. It does not have to be permanent, but its got to be better than ruins (which would be a constant reminder, cold to sleep in and harsh on the eye) or camping out in the streets and gardens of stormwind.
Safety and regrowth first, revenge when stronger.

I could argue that using the ruins as a quarry for resources to build a new settlement is not quite the same as living in the bare ruins. And I don’t think the images in the OP look hard to the eye? :thinking:

But indeed, Duskwood could work for a safe starter as it’s close to Stormwind. I just wonder for how long, considering how proud and stubborn they are. Tyrande doesn’t come across as willing to let Anduin and the Alliance take her people under their protective wing now after all that has happened.

Kalimdor is their home: if Nordrassil is declared off limits under the druid’s protection, then Feralas might be a good option as it holds one of their main military strongholds, a thriving forest, and plenty of ancient ruins unrelated to sacred temples which could be stripped without remorse. I am not setting a time line here: it could very well be multiple expansions. As long as it takes for them to shape a forest city with flower carpets and elegant columns mixed with trees which I feel would perfectly match their racial flavor.

And in any case, vines very often grow on crumbling walls, and they really seem to like vines? :wink:

Pff… The Night Elves, Worgen and the Forsaken will remain forever homeless…
No chance in hell is Blizz going to bother making a new city for any of them.

The best they can hope for is some short story or other tidbit in the lore.
Something that will never be reflected in-game.

So much negativity. ^^

Is that because the Void Elves do not have a city, either?

I would not mind the Night Elves getting another capital if it looked as in the OP. The color palette is fitting and totally unlike the Blood Elves’.

There may be some slight overlap with the NB but then again, the NB ARE a reskin of the NE. Just, the NB have been city dwellers and the NE are nature fighters?

As long as there’s a LOT of vines they can have stone walls for their temples…

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Hey, we don’t need a city…

We have our cool, floating space rock in the Telogrus Rift :cry:

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Eldre’thalas seems the perfect option. I said this in another forum. That place is ancient, big, has a lot of arcane secrets, the Highborne there joined the Night Elves, both Feathermoon Stronghold and a portal to the Emerald Dream are in Feralas which also makes it even more perfect. Hyjal is a neutral territory and the Cenarion Circle/Guardians of Hyjal are also a neutral faction which has Tauren and Trolls in and I doubt Tyrande and the Army of the Black Moon wants to see them anywhere in their lands anymore.

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They’ve already made Hyjal their base of operation which tells me that the Circle either doesn’t mind their presence or that Malfurion asked them to leave/expelled them.

Do remember that the World Tree and the surrounding lands were in their charge for ten thousand years. It doesn’t make any sense for them to relinquish their claim to those lands for some decrepit ruins far down south in Feralas that the vast majority of the Night Elven people have no connection to.

Yes but THEY let the Cenarion Circle there. They knew Hyjal wouldn’t be their home anymore and would become a neutral zone. Expelling the Cenarion Circle would not only make things worse between them and the night elves who are with Tyrande but also would spark some hatred.

And who would object? Hamuul isn’t exactly the most patriotic Horde leader out there.

The tree was in their care up until just a few years ago so it makes all the sense in the world for them to regain control of the mountain. The Circle operates from Nighthaven anyway so it really shouldn’t be much of an issue either way.

But if Blizzard adopted a more “lighter blue” colour scheme and keep the buildings heavily tied to nature, as per the art, then we’re on a clear distinction between what the Night Elves look for and what the Nightborne look for and the clear changes between the two of them.

Having a lighter blue palette can also be symbolic to their continued faith in Elune.

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I love the idea, Feralas was already my favorite night elf zone, and this is going to sound a bit cheesy, but they just don’t make them like this anymore. It’s atmospheric, mystical and you really get the feeling you’re deep in the forest for some reason. It’s probably the height of the treees, the gentle sounds of rain and birds… I just f-ing love it.

I also love the idea of rebuilding Eldre’thalas, a bit more lore to the Highborne which were added just like that without in-game story. There also needs to be some kind of stable night elf presence in Kalimdor, it’s either corruption (Darkshore, Felwood), burning (Hyal, Teldrassil) or Horde shenaningans (Ashenvale, Felwood). Give us our trees and stones back, a bit of peace and quiet. Taurens can stay.

I hate Eastern Kingdoms while playing on my night elves, it just doesn’t feel like home.

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I agree the night elves belong in Kalimdor.

Said that, Hiyal could be a good home for them if they are few and if the Circle druids allow it, but I would sooooo much more love to see a new temple/garden/forest city for them anywhere, and I cannot imagine Hiyal becoming urbanized at all. Not even if it is wooden homes within the trees themselves. So Feralas om the coast or near the ruins of Eldre’Thalas would work for me. They could basically grow the military stronghold and make it a part of the city.

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