New update for Stormwinds guards: Black and asian skins to the NPCs. Positive or Lore-breaking?

Lore Story
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The timing is one that has several companies virtue signalling for the sake of PR given the most recent events, when up until now, they didn’t show so openly said qualms, even if the problems that caused them were still an ongoing thing.

And no. I dislike the kind of strawman you are throwing regarding this.

I do not dislike this for pushing diversity and tolerance. I dislike the fact that it’s some blatantly lazy attempt, that if they truly wanted to tackle, should’ve been addressed in a more complete way.

If you want to push for diversification, that’s great, do so.
But if i’m to judge your perfomance regarding how you concile it with the story, then i expect you to care more about how you do so.

Want to know how this whole thing could’ve been done better?

Human intro:
The noble humans are a proud, tenacious race. Though the recent war against Nzoth has decimated their ranks, the defenders of Stormwind stand vigilant against any who would threaten the sanctity of their lands.
Ruled by King Anduin Wrynn, the people of Stormwind remain steadfast in their commitment to the Grand Alliance.
Backed by their stalwart human allies from across the lands of Kalimdor and Eastern Kingdoms, ranging form the jungles of Stranglethorn to the dessert lands of Uldum, Stormwind has proven itself willing to defend the planet by any means necessary.

This was the Classic intro. And i added a SINGLE sentence (tweaking some of it to adjust the text better).

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Warcraft children book had black girl from Stranglethorn vale(Blackwater cove human settlement overrun by Gurubashi and then taken by Steemweedle) her ancestors were from Arathi like all “Stormvindians”. Book was during Legion idk.
From lore perspective there is nothing strange about race that become what is today(humans) from Vrykuls in span of one generation by curse of flesh. In magic world that is. Funny thing is this implies that black people of WoW descended from white people, when in real world is other way around.

About Kingdom of “Stormwind” losing it’s identity has nothing to do with people of different colour. All blame lies on WC3 and WoW itself. Before WoW. It was “Kingdom of Azeroth” now we hove Green Jesus appropriating word and screeching “For Azeroth” every time he feels like, also “World of Azeroth” “Battle of Azeroth” ect. Now we have “Stormwind” which English word that contrasts with rest of nation: Lordaeron, Alterac, Dalaran, Stromgarde and Kul Tiras - this is stupid. WC3 broke colour uniqueness of nations Azerothians being blue was retconned into Lordaeronias being also so they could retcon WC2 missions that mostly were done by Nation of Azeroth(Lordaeron only dealt with Alterac treason) into being done by Nation of Lordaeron(that’s why they also blue in WC3). For note original colour of Nation of Lordaeron is white(like with Southshore and Argents).
Last but not least WoW ruined Kingdom with Light theme - originally most light oriented Kingdom was Lordaeron(some leftovers is SC and Argents). Azeroth was more of jack of all trades - master of none. They had light theme not as strong Lordaeronian, they had magic theme with Kara not as strong as Dalaran one, they had Warrior culture with knights of Brotherhood of Horse not as strong as Stromgarde’s Trollhunters theme and they were Traiding nation like Kul Tiras with access to sea again not as strong one. Now it’s all about Light and dressing different species of Alliance into Guardsmen armor. Most unique about them was especially knights as these guys were lather raised as First(and true) death knights. But Varian that was Warrior King wasn’t Knight he was Fury more akin to Troll hunter, Bolvar was a Paladin of Silver Hand(originally Lordaeronian organisation) and Anduin is priest(again theme of Lordaeron). Even Halford Wyrmbane left Knighthood to culturally appropriate Lordaeron’s theme. But then again later is mostly likely my warrior bias.

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All Alliance players here seem just fine with it. I still don’t see the issue.
You think they’re going to care how the new skin tones are introduced? Nah, I tell you how it’s going to be : “ o hey we can be black now, that’s friggin cool!”

And before you take me to the lore again, I tell you what. In game fun matters more than lore. That’s a fact.

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Most races do have the same origin. And still we had Blizzard creating several kinds of trolls, tauren, dwarves, and even throwing humans themed after particular ethic groups in places like Stranglethorn, Tanaris, or Uldum.

So, instead of having an expanded world-building, that addresses those differences in a similar way as we have with trolls for example, you rather they throw it all into the same melting pot, further discarding the differences that in other cases even allowed the creation of new playable races (with all the features and story that accompanied such)?

Its obvious they don’t.
I mean, Danuser himself clarified that the customisation options weren’t to be considered canon.

But i can still express my opinion regarding how it’s all a waste of potential story and setting enrichment.
Honestly, i would’ve preferred they had kept Stormwind to be its own “thing”, even if people saw it as the standard “White Knight” theme, and have this customisation options be but the tip of some future introduction for some new playable human tribe in some island, or the development that would accompany having for example this guy:

Introducing a new questline that has the Wastewanders pledging themselves to Stormwind after Nzoth’s defeat.

And i dislike how it seems they felt like throwing this bone around now, given recent events. It makes it seem less like some honest declaration, and more about filling some PR checkbox. But that’s the least important issue i have with it.

PS:

Well, this forum section is to debate lore and the impact any change may have to it.

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I understand that, but sometimes it’s just not important. In this case it isn’t. It’s a fun thing they added that people received with open arms and it may be one of the best features they implemented in the game lately. Why make a big deal out if it?

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I’m not making a big deal out of it.
I’m simply judging the impact it has in the story, as this is the angle i mentioned i’d take regarding this whole thing. And i asked people what they thought about it from SAID angle.

If i wanted to debate “fun”, i’d take it to GD section and wonder why is it that i can’t play any class with any race, or why is Blizzard wasting resources in visual effects with some many broken mechanics hanging around, why is PVP so broken, etc.

I’m not taking this as a big deal just as i’m not doing so with any of the above. But i felt like judging it from this particular angle.

And personally, i think it came rather lacking when seen through that lens.

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George Floyd was murdered seven weeks ago, these options were shown off at Blizzcon eight months ago.

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I don’t want to derail to that particular bit, because i already clarified that its the least of my concerns, and may be some unfounded “paranoia” on my part.

But i’ll just point out that so far humans are the only ones that have had an announcement about throwing said sort of customisation options amongst their own NPCs. And this did came after all the BLM surge.
I didn’t read Blizzard making Darkspear trolls take on their new troll skins, nor Ironforge guards having the new Wildhammer tattoos.

And as i said, i rather not take it down said venues.

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You sound like you’re making a big deal out of it.

It doesn’t have an impact.

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Yeah, making black folk police is really gonna appeal to the BLM crowd. You cracked the code.

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To each their own i guess.
But as an authority of how i personally feel, i’ll repeat that i gave it about the same relevance as it was given by those that considered it a noteworthy piece of news.

Disliking the implications it has from a particular angle, doesn’t mean i’m making a big deal out of it.

It doesn’t if you don’t want it to. The entire reason i dislike it is because i feel it should’ve.

I really do not understand what you tried to say here.
But it isn’t a secret that many companies often throw about token shows of support for one cause or another in order to show their approval over a particular message. Often regardless of how badly it mashes with their product, in the case of those that deal in storytelling (there is some heated debate regarding this with Star Wars, and many other narratives).

I mean, i do think that having an NPC that constitutes a tribute to Robbin Williams or Reckful is quite endearing and positive. Much like i applaud any honest attempt Blizzard makes to promote cultural acceptance, like in this case.
But (a) that doesn’t mean that i can’t examine the impact it has in the story, calling out negative aspects of it, or (b) even doubt how genuine said attempts are, given their timing and circumstances.

And really, i don’t want to debate down this route. If you want to tackle any argument regarding your stance about the impact this feature has in the STORY, i’ll be glad to engage. But i won’t derail it into some extended discussion about whether Blizzard is virtue signalling.

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Ok little more about ethnicities in WoW. We have Trolls from what I remember(maybe retconned already) all trolls hail from Zandalari who live in particularly “prehistoric”(like Un’Goro) region of Azeroth then we have Dark Trolls(don’t know their Troll name) who lived in Ashenvale like zones(Fairy magic zone), then we have Amani who lived in European forest hills eqv. of EK, Drakkari who lived in Tundra eqv. and Gurubashi who lived in African Jungle eqv. All "evolved from Zandalari in different climatic zones. Then Gurubashi evolved even further in zones around Uldum, when they were turned into Sahara desert like and turned into Farraki.

Same thing with Elves Night elves evolved from BT in ashenvale like zones then some of them moved to EK europian green forest zone(took part from Amani) and made it bit more fairy like with Sunwell(still don’t get it tho why it so different from rest of Moonwells) - since zone was different and source of magic too they changed both colours and appearances, then they used Fel crystalls and slightly changed(duration was short tbh), then they got original magic source with a twist of light and slightly changed again(still short time). NB is kinda mess but still their originally NE zone was changed with Eye of Aman’thul(titan relic) radiation similar to Moonwell so they instead of changing colours changed their appearance to of NB partially like HE/BE did since well is different. VE changed by single person via cast.

Same climatic zone skin tone differences can be traced with Orcs in WoD although to a lesser degree.

Or Dwarves.

All gnomes lived in one place still there lepper gnomes from exposure to “Radiation”

Can’t say about Draenei since we don’t know how Argus looked like besides Mac’Aree. In Draenor they lived in one place mostly in one place besides outposts.

Lightforged were drastically changed by light way more than BE.

Grimtotem also different from what was their clan name again - default Tauren?

Highmoutain are base Tauren changed by Demigod.

Undead are not species(they cursed human corpses) so there is no point to even argue about dead Lordaeronians on different states of dicomposure.

Goblins is kinda of funny whenever they live they make place a trash dump so it does not matter which zone they live.

Pandaren hail from same zone.

Worgen are just cursed humans.

So what about humans from lore point they are not irl humans we are apes not magical elemental living beings. All human kingdoms exist in same time of zone European green forests with slight variation so majority them being white kind is given. But there another factor here technical one - when WoW was made it was made by Blizzard from modified WC3 engine and assets and it was Blizzard not ActiBlizz mega corporation with billions to make a game. So humans were one model with different skin tones and few faces wrapped on them. It’s easier to make Blue and Green trolls and call them different than do same with Human as they have direct real world reference. Now we have what always been in lore - some Azerithians lived in Strangle - african jungle that’s why there black people some lived in black moras(swamp of sorrows and blasted lands) asian wet jungles like vietnam - that’s why there asian people. Likely most of them have been fled to their Kingdom of Azeroth(one from Gurubash others from horde) and that’s why they presented there. Some people traveled Uldum and settled there(for whatever reason) and now there “Arabiiiaaaan Niiiight…” in Uldum(God I loved disney Alladin as kid). So I think magical humans of WoW change same way as other magical species kinda most prevalent element in climatic zone affects them over long period of exposure.

Lastly from game that is MMO and some kinds of Humans presented in setting reasonable majority of players should be able to create characters that resembles themselves for sake of escapism alone. That is unless there some lore that sets Human races differentiated(like Humans in ESO - Nords, Emperials ect.) which is not the case of WoW.

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RaCiSt ahahahahahahahahaaaaaaaaaaaa this is not twitter

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https://wow.gamepedia.com/Makasa_Flintwill

Black humans are canon. Get over it.

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Who are you addressing with this bit?

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Nah, I’m mostly on Zarao’s side on that one (funny as that is). But no use crying over spilled milk. I would prefer if there was some in-universe meaning to the different optics at all. But there isn’t. And wasted opportunities are hardly the biggest problem of WoW’s writing.

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Black humans aren’t a different race. They’re still humans. This racist nonsense needs to stop

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Cool, but you would still be :man_shrugging:

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???

I mean…I get that this is a fantasy setting that has many species that are considered races even if they are not humanoid, and this might blur several aspects of how to address the human one.

But black skinned humans (as well as the rest of notably differentiated humans) are still, by the virtue of its most basic sociological definition, their own kind of human race.
Do not mistake “human race” with “human species”. The term race is often defined by anthropometric traits (such as skin tone).

And thing is, that having a kingdom with several human races, is something that under normal circumstances requires of an explanation, as this occurrences can only be explained through the convergence of different ethnic groups which REQUIRE of their own defined backgrounds.

Ps: Not even “Lol, Magic” can explain it logically in this case.

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Ok as this conversation is now about who’s just right so what about a easy solution. On the new starting area have one small conversation stating something like…

Soliders of the Alliance, Stormwind is now the last great human kingdom on our continent. After the events of the 4th war our troops have been depleted to a point where we are now calling on all humans from across the eastern kingdoms to rally behind the banner of stormwind as we try and rebuild our once great nation.

Etc etc yadda yadda or something along those lines.

Anduin and Genn had the conversation in the lost honor cinematic stating that they were sending the last of the soldiers and they’d be calling up farmers next. So they lost most of their troops and need more, perfect time to call all humans to help and we get new people from across the eastern kingdoms coming to Stormwind. Problem solved.

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