Crusader Strike auto-refreshes all judgements on the current target, wisdom allows attacks made to the target to regenerate mana for the raid.
Edit : Also, spell batching has been reduced to 10ms while continuing to allow seal twisting as a change being applied to Classic this reset, so this conversation is over.
What i dont understand, is why there is people going on this crusade to not have seal twisting implemented. You gain absolutly nothing by having it gutted. There is a MASSIVE paladin community that would do anything for two way twisting as it stands, just because it gives the class a rotation, and a higher skill ceiling.
The best part is, its 100% optional if you want to play do it or not!
I say let it be. It gives the paladins who wants it something to perfect, and the people who dont want it, just dont do it.
if the batch period is going to be big enough with enough haste you might be able to twist 3 seals into the batch period.
What?? I don’t think you have any idea how seal twisting actually works, you need to have both seals active the moment your weapon actually hits the target. The only way you could have 3 seals at once would be if you had a GCD shorter than 0.5 seconds.
Thats how it -Currently- Works, there reworking the mechanic to allow it still when they remove spellbatching. There is no known thing how easy or difficult it will be from tomorrow onwards.
Because its a deviation of the original intake to what classic was, its a change that has nothing to do with the game how it used to be, with potentially abusable mechanics, that are there only for the “elite” since there is no tooltip anywhere of how to do it except by using a (former) game bug.
And i for one don’t want developers that facilitate buggy gameplay instead of fixing it!
Also it looks more like "its to much work to fix this bug, lets just leave it and call it a feature after “feedback” of the community.
Keeping wisdom up can be done by ANY paladin
How is it too much work to “fix” the bug, it’s literally the opposite of that. They made a conscious effort to specifically keep seal twisting gameplay when they changed batching to 10ms (which goes in tomorrow morning in EU).
Without those adjustments, Seal Twisting would have died tomorrow morning.
You have 3 palas in your raid while you don’t benefit from more than 1 of each spec, the spec that can most easily keep up wisdom is the Ret (which also brings unique buffs), especially as it’s so common to see wisdom drop when there is no Ret.
And given your attitude towards not liking any sort of competitively aimed gameplay, I can be damn sure you’d be the holy pala benefitting most from having a ret in the raid carrying wisdom.
I know exactly what he is thinking. He plans to not seal twist, but he knows that will result in less dps, but if he can make a convincing case for seal twisting being removed then he won’t have to do it, therefor he won’t have to justify not doing it when his dps is low. If his dps is low but you can’t twist anyway he can say “well I’m doing everything I can”…
He’s not a competitively aimed player, he doesn’t care about maximising his dps or where Pala really sits in the overall standings, just that he has an easy ride without having to justify himself to others.
It’s beautifully pathetic in many ways, but it’s not at all uncommon… I mean in all walks of life, not just gaming.
In order to awnser that you have to know that world of warcraft is primarily based on Python, and some other languages as support. These are all object based languages, and to make something as a seal buff work you have to make an event. Applying a different seal is a different event, and events cannot happen within events without some tedious programming. Server interaction with multiple clients store a lot of event data and properly sequencing that and not have sealtwisting, would mean completely restructuring the entire eventdata flow which is ALOT of work since every action that you as a player can do is in some way an event or tied to an event.
So why is it easier to keep sealtwisting? sealtwisting is tied to the spellbatch timer, most likely they made an iEnumerator (a term of an event that happens after a certain condition) that gathered all the other events for x amount of milliseconds. So for to keep sealtwisting all they have to do is copy that iEnumerator, set all the non seal values to 10 ms, and the seals to spellbatch time. A lot less work then completely restructuring every possible action in game.
So yes they made a conscious decision to keep Seal twisting, but not for the right reasons.
The next few paragraphs are nothing more then insulting. As such i’ve flagged your post as inappropiate. You don’t know me nor my playstyle but apparently you find it more important to insult someone then keep a games integrity.
That’s all well and good mate but had they not made a conscious decision to keep Seal Twisting it would have disappeared tomorrow with the removal of spell batching.
It’s nice that you feel you know more about the game than Blizzard themselves though.
It was your choice to be insulted, and your choice to not correct me by clarifying your reasons. All you’ve done here is confirm my beliefs, and you being offended or insulted does not mean I’ve broken any rules. I have not.
It was your choice to be insulted, but I guess I shouldn’t be surprised.
but apparently you find it more important to insult someone then keep a games integrity.
If you really care about the games integrity, how come you are not up in arms about alliance getting Seal of Blood? If we really want this to be like TBC then human ret paladins are supposed to be so useless that they’re not even worth bringing.
I am a programmer, i’ve programmed in Python 2&3, Cyton, C++ and C# the languages and emulations that make up for WoW’s engine. Therefore i have a firm grasp of the technical limitations of the langague even though i obviously don’t have access to the code.
When i just finished my ICT education, World of Warcraft came out, and i was a hooked player, so when the classic was announced i was ofcourse struck by nostalgia but also intrested as a programmer of how they would recreate it. I’ve both been in awe and in dismay of the developer choices and programming loopholes they made that give us classic.
However i’m also a purist that wants to keep classic as close to vanilla as possible. With the removal of spellbatching you can still sealtwist, as can you still get the double polymorps, however the server / client handling speed is so fast in present era that that will hardly ever occur.
Artificially programming the seal duration so they can overlap, will allow for a gameplay that was never in vanilla, and purely depended on your connection speed if twisting would work for you.
The change also doesn’t bring a rotation or more intresting gameplay. All you have to do is have your swingtimer in your macro and its still the same one button.
All your doing is opening the door for “community driven” changes that have nothing to do with the original game, and are tailored for entitled people that want to show off “daddies” “I’m special” medallion.
I’ve been up against that in other topics, but this one is specificly to adress seal twisting, and the special changes there making to it.
FYI at 70 seal twisting will be even more rediculous since you can then SoB + SoV twist, till 5 stacks and then go SoB + SoC, SoB + SoV rotation as well as probably double judge SoB + SoV for even more out of context TBC damage.
SoV is pretty terrible for a Ret with no spell damage whatsoever. Apparently you need to make sure that SoV is on for the entire fight (on a fight like magtheridon, this is impossible cuz of box clicking) for it to be worth the DPS loss of applying it.
Not allowing Seal twisting as it was in vanilla TBC is a nerf to the class. Even if it was an unintended mechanic. So that should not happen in my opnion.
Some people are advocating for seals to be twistable from any seal to any seal which would result in a less clunky optimal rotation but it is a buff to the class. I don’t really mind it either.
Loosing twisting however is as I said a nerf to the class which is bad. I don’t think nerfing is a good way address balance issues for the most part. Especially because nowadays people are more performance oriented so the closer you can tune classes the more likely we’ll have a diverse playerbase. It also makes for a rotation that requires skill. Whoever wants to improve their DPS will find out how to do it. I bet there will be twisting guides day 0 of TBC.
I’m not a TBC/Classic purist or Nochanges advocate. Quite the contrary, I think changes are good and Blizzard so far had a lot of good changes and I wouldn’t say many bad ones. They neglected some things that should have been addressed though. Luckily Seal twisting and seal of blood are not one of them.
In hindsight, I’m sure they would make changes to retris and many other classes that are glaring issues. Like all of our spells scaling with spell power while we don’t have spell power until Wrath when we get similar talent to enhancement shamans which converts AP to SP. They can’t really afford that because of community pressure from nochanges and I’d assume not enought developers.
I agree that changes can be good, however i don’t think the sealtwisting implementation they did is a good one. I’ve tested the twisting after the patch, and it is less clunky then i expected, but as i expected, without macro’s and / or addons there is no way you can consistently pull this off.
For those who say but there nerfing my dps, there are way better options to make up for any seal twisting dps loss, from slightly tweaking ap / sp scaling, to tweaking talents, or abilities.
I’ve long proposed that a classic+ a classic thats improved in key area’s would be beneficial. But i would also implore that you get the OPTION of doing so. I’m very gratefull for the option of chosing if a character remains classic or goes TBC or both.
Other paladin specific things that can transform classic into classic + if for instance changing the talent improved righteous fury to also have a “your judgement has a 33% chance to taunt the target” per talent, giving you the OPTION to get a taunt.
Classic is not perfect and classes / specs are not balanced, but introducing a mechanic that only the elite players understand and can make use of trough macro’s instead of fixing the underlying problem of power disparity is not the way to do it.
The way twisting was in TBC is when you actually needed to use /startattack, /stopattack macros. With the current flat 0.5 sec leeway it is actually very much possible to do it consistently, even without macros.
Classic is not perfect and classes / specs are not balanced, but introducing a mechanic that only the elite players understand and can make use of trough macro’s instead of fixing the underlying problem of power disparity is not the way to do it.
Personally I don’t really see this as an issue at all, the same thing could be said about queuing heroic strike for warriors. The fact that as long as your heroic strike is queued up all your off-and auto attacks have the same chance to hit as a “yellow attack” is not something ever explained in-game, but is still a vital part of playing a warrior. Or as a hunter using feign death in combat along with trinketswap macros to change from/to trinkets for instance.
If anything, this just adds to the charm of classic, things you can learn and do that massively increases your dps. If someone wants their playstyle to be super straightforward and easy then they can just play warlock, stand there and spam shadow bolt, how fun is that?
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