the clowns defending a broken class are trolls, they should be permabanned on the forums without a second thought.
shaman is broken and it is simply a FACT that people are denying. needs heavy nerfs NOW and ASAP.
2 shamans + priest beat anything that exists, people denying this are delusional maggots.
LMAO
JUST LIKE LAST PHASE
oh wait
The worst part about this situation is that the Shaman apologetics are constantly spamming the forum with nonsense about the tune of âAlliance players are just badâ while Blizzard does nothing to even address the issues at hand.
How many times do we have to make a very simple point to you that, if a class needs to be played by the best player possible to shine, while itâs counterpart on the other faction requires not much skill in comparison - the balance of said classes is way off.
Paladin in P2 was fine imho, now there is no reason ever to bring any - Alliance might aswell ban Paladins from participating in PvP and yet Horde would still win since Shamans are clearly above and beyond most other classes in PvP aswell.
Oh well, thereâs still a sliver of hope that P4 will be betterâŠ
ignorant of your own ignorance.
you anti-shaman brigadiers are not a hack better.
just look at Wavé for example.
literally no matter what the topic is he has to call for nerfs to shaman.
donât be surprised when people who doesnât agree with that notion go out of their way to counteract you, but then again, i guess its just in a paladin playersâ nature to be ignorant to the concept of countering.
the word is probably not even in their vocabulary, which is why the vast majority of people complaining about shaman are paladins, by a very large margin at that.
as many times as we have to tell you guys to use your toolkit properly.
but then we get more baddie excuses as to why thatâs not genuine advice.
âlava burst too strong!â
did you use cleanse to remove flame shock?
ân-no! i shouldnât have to! NERF SHAMAN!â
thatâs where the serious debate ends, and trolling commences, because you are outright REFUSING to use your toolkit.
you are gung-ho on pre-popping your bubble and then spamming exorcism and nothing else, so of course you cannot be helped.
you got all the tools to destroy elemental shamans, but you forego them because you want to DEE PEE ESSS, so ultimately the problem lies with you - not the shamans.
iâm not going to go through the list of hard counters paladin has against shamans for the gazillionth time, because iâm pretty sure iâve already told you before, somewhere else, and even if i did, youâd just ignore it and keep crying.
when you refuse to do your job as a paladin, of course other alliance players donât want to group with you. its like bringing a disc priest who refuses to use power infusion, like why are you surprised people get mad?
playermade issue.
Baddie is as baddie does.
someone didnât read.
someone should go read what i said before they spread bs.
i said paladins can STALL flags using their bubble, as in; PREVENT HORDE FROM TAGGING ALLIANCE FLAGS⊠not TAKE horde flags.
see, this is why i make fun of you people. you canât even be bothered to read, let alone correctly recite the things you supposedly read.
not once in all my almost 700 posts worth of history did i EVER say paladins can take flags while under the immunity effect of their bubble.
and on a sidenote, how the hell does my name in any way indicate self loathing?
you got a problem with potatoes and milk?
see a medical professional you lunatic.
Just nerf both shamans and paladins, boom problem solved.
i dont even like your opinions but il back you up in saying to never said paladins could take flags while bubbled, but every situation you describe is the start of the fights with all cooldowns up and full health
5 months?
even donkey would have realised by now that shamans are the best class in the game, so what does that make you shaman mains that are still defending it?
lizards?
Was kinda inevitable when blizz imports retail abilities into classic without people having access to a homogenized toolkit that also comes with retail⊠Only 2 classes having access to cleanse and a flame shock that spreads to 5 targets is kinda insane in terms of trying to stop your team getting blasted, I played 3 AB games yesterday, first game 6 sham 2nd game 5 sham 3rd game 4 sham, you physically CANNOT remove flame shocks from people fast enough for it to be a legit strat when there is that much class stacking going on. I can target the shaman casting lava burst and cleanse his target but what about the 5 others⊠You even have enhance shamans running lava burst and doming people with insta casts from maelstrom stacks.
You cannot team fight that unless you match the numbers with equal hunters/boomkins/spriest and have enough healers and priests/pala to actually triage heal and dispel. Or you have an amazing rogue/mage that go all out on landing counterspell into deepfreeze stun or sheep, rogue hitting one person with cheapshot, next person with gouge, blind on 3rd. Just to stagger out that incoming barrage of damage so you can push melee into the backline without getting 3sec deleted.
Compared to run at BS cast flame shock use mouse over lava burst on one of the other targets that got flamed shocked so enemy healer canât target of target dispel⊠profit?
The smaller skirmishes we had at mines etc when it was usually at most 2 shamans had some form of counter play, you can dispel flame shocks, you can also get melee in the backline to enable pushback on them aswell as be able to survive long enough to actually kick a spell before getting sent to the GY after 3 seconds.
With how much dmg certain ranged are doing in general it makes it really hard to actually push into a backline where the ele is freecasting, boomie stun, blackout proc, mage fire stun/deep freeze, if any of those land and shaman is mid cast, prepare your cheeks cause its about to get blasted.
Remember p1 WSG Meta where it was only hunters and priests being stacked with 1 druid for FC? And then the full boomkin stack when starsurge got buffed? It looks a lot like that again but through random BGâs and Shamans. If you have 3x teams queueing 5man (not together just randoms queueing separate) and all of them have 1-2 shaman in them because why wouldnât you stack good classes in your 5 stack trade chat grp? That quickly escalates out of hand with unintentional class stacking. (Not a player problem is something that blizz shouldâve addressed awhile ago is solo q horde sitting infinite queues) Shamans basically became the new ârogueâ in terms of over saturated for pvp.
SoD having increased xp gains for the levelling process just encourages people to roll FoTM, throughout any iteration of WoW the easiest class to perform well on always becomes âsuddenlyâ popular, We saw that with boomies, hunters, Spriests and now Shamans. So what in a normal context wouldâve been weeks of progress for someone, its now become days. If this was just you OG shaman boys reliving your best life in SoD it wouldnât be such a big deal. But we are reaching class stack territory again which is usually a clear sign of some imbalanced issue rearing its ugly head.
The current influx of shamans are the same as the âStarsurge go brrrrrâ re roll crowd, The only difference is its a 8second CD instead of 6 this time lol. When you can get basically full geared from emerald wardens rep gear, WSG/AB vendor some STV event/mara, there is nothing stopping people from fast reroll anymore. If p4 takes any longer to release even Iâm considering making a sham on diff server just to play for fun cause current pvp as feral is the polar opposite of fun at this bracket.
This same thing has happened every Arena season in retail for this whole expansion. Levelling is no time and gearing is even less when cap on conquest gets lifted, so everytime one class is heavily skewed in favour, everyone flocks to it for the easy rating/title/achieves.
I want the dev who made shaman runes work almost seamlessly between multiple specs and builds to be the dev that works on every rune in the game I think more people would be having fun 
in the words of all shamans⊠lol suck on this. yoing pew pew brrrrrrrrrr 
of course i do, what else would i base a hypothetical scenario off of?
everyone does that, because its the best way to get an idea of how a hypothetical pvp scenario would look like.
what am i supposed to do otherwise?
assume bubble is always on its full 5 minute cd?
why would i do that?
like yeah, sure thatâs the case every now and then, but how are we supposed to discuss pvp when we pick and choose which abilities are available in said scenario?
like of course a certain ability being on cooldown will outright spell doom for certain classes in certain scenarios, that is why we always assume everything is off cooldown when we discuss pvp, no matter what class is in question.
its not the same as assuming someone is fully worldbuffed, or assuming their full stack/proc is active when a fight begins.
we base it off the hypothetical âduel scenarioâ where both parties have all their CDâs ready, with no buffs from other classes, with no engineering items and with no consumables popped, whether its 1v1 or group pvp that is in question.
are there exceptions to this? yes of course, but again, we canât discuss pvp if we pick and choose our hypotheticals like that, we must adhere to a standard.
6 months now btw.
not picking and choosing scenarios. on paper you can probably write a strategy to defeat the other class, but for example you say paladin is better than shaman because he can cleanse and he can bubble and he can do this but that litterally comes down to playing every class absolutely perfect with no room for error, but you can play shaman and just throw totems down and have plenty of room for error against every class.
Elem Shamans have always been dangerous in PVP, and always useless in PVE. so you could very rarely see their strength. Runes gave an almost equal improvement to all classes, but now Elem Shaman can raid and receive items. thatâs all
you could even bring up the fact that serious PvP players always picked horde until WOTLK. people would still deny the fact that horde racials + broken class in form of shaman isnât as good as paladin and meme alliance racials.
l o l, im suprised anyone takes you seriously. anyone with half a brain and knowledge knows that horde racials + shaman up till WOTLK were PvP meta.
too bad it is just the truth you and many horde clown trolls cannot accept.
fair point. i think it is a mix of a lot of things. as one of the people that have always played shaman from day one, i am very familiar with this class. i know all my cute lil totems and spells and i can counter sooo much. on top of that, jesus we got some dmg boost. and to the last part, shamans were never really much of a great threat. if you played it really well, u could stand your ground and win, but it (rarely ever) never was such a party as it is now. so u have bit of overtuned class, combined with lack of countering xp and sometimes played by very experience players. there was brief time like that in the OG Wotlk where as a meele shaman u could man handle up to 2-3 others and walk out a winner. that was nerfed hard
would they have nerfed shaman in retail? I am sure they would. but sod is just a fun quirk bar fight. just go along with it. this version is just for laughs. dont take it too serious. and if so, reroll shaman. it is not all easy mutlikilling as it seems. it is though if it is a BG and you stand there as an Ele and noooo one focuses u or bothers to interupt or cc. than it is rofl time. even in 1v1. if you are a biiit lucky with the old proccs⊠jesus.
Sadly brother you are the only class having fun in the quirky bar fights, the rest of us arenât laughing or having any type of fun. We canât take this game mode serious even if we wanted to at this point lol
Stand max range behind SPriests, Boomies, Mages, Warlock, heal Priest. Press flame shock to 1/4th of the team in one global, pick any target that got the flame shock application being targetted by someone else on your team already, lava burst, chain lightening profit?
I would love to be able to try and interrupt you as feral my brother but I canât, the moment I feral charge you I get booty-blasted by the other ranged classes and one of their 3 RNG stun effects.
I really love the whole Interrupt argument and cleanse argument when its never really as cut and dry as that. You play a melee (that isnât shaman) and try pushing into backline to land a kick in current meta (maybe rogue too, you have many stops to cover yourself if you push in to kick, gouge off target and blind another vanish cheapshot), be one of magic dispel players that understand they have cleanse and can remove flame shock, and then you realize it takes you more GCDâs to remove flame shock applied through burn from 1 person than the shamans CD of casting it in the first place, now imagine adding another sham to that ontop of all the other effects that might get munched by cleanse first. In a team fight itâs ludicrous with the amount of non intentional class stacking that is happening. This isnât even factoring getting spammed with viper sting every other global by any hunter, while one of other 4-5 shamans drop poison cleansing totem and just forget it exists for pretty much 3/4 of your team.
âBut I only have 20yd rangeâ Try having 5yd range and get back to me x). The only hard CC in combat I have is bash which I am using on CD to peel for my team, I can root you as ele from max range but if my team mates donât max range you too it doesnât change anything lol you were gonna stand still planted on the ground casting anyway.
Play evoker in retail with 25yd range on all spells while every other caster is 40yd, the 20yd range really isnât as big of deal âdownsideâ as people make it out to be. Is it slightly annoying to get used to? Sure. Is it impossible to play around? Hell no. As long as you arenât the class that is having to frontline you can safely plant yourself to turret at max range even if its 20yds. In a BG context you can get free reign on any melee that are trying to be aggressive on your healers. You arenât gonna be lava bursting hunters with ease, but you get a pretty easy time landing it in a team fight vs everyone else lol.
Give me cyclone so I can max range rotate spam it on every single one of you in the backline and then maybe there is some argument to be made about what I can do differently to help my team, as it stands currently I can open in cat and pray that no one else notices me in the backline and hope to secure a kill with berserk + catnip burst, or I push in as bear hope to land feral charge before getting rng stunned and cause everyone does magical damage anyway you get blown up regardless. When everyone on enemy team is basically a caster, Bear form turns into a cosmetic form outside of survival instincts and improved frenzied regen
If I play resto druid, I have no cleanse to even attempt to take flame shock off so its instantly going into triage healing cause you 100% know big damage as inc on someone in the next 3 sec, the amount of HPS you need to be able to do to deal with oncoming onslaught from ele sham burst you are basically wild growth spam the whole time because your team mates are bleeding HP faster than the femoral artery after a gunshot. You have no time to rely on lifebloom actually going off to heal people because the damage is so spikey, nourish/healing touch only saves one person, and the healing from efflo will only really save classes with damage reduction, it isnât enough to maintain a small stacked group without spamming wildgrowth on the same party.
I canât use rejuv or regrowth outside of to proc efflo with swiftmend cause any shaman with braincells is spamming purge the moment they see HoTs go up.
The only thing I see saving our team in that situation is we have enough healing priests that are willing to sacrifice running Prayer of mending to pick up power word: Barrier and willing to drop dispersion for Pain suppression, if you can split the shamans into different bases it becomes tolerable to deal with, but when its 4+ at one node we donât have enough of the âPerfectâ class setups to deal with it. We are lucky if we even have healing priests at all let alone to rely on them dropping their mana return + self damage reduction and most efficient heal.
Donât feed the troll
Flame has a 20(25 if you have the STV relic)range, so how do you stand behind all the other casters?