The mystery of 8.2.5

(Zarao) #21

Rokhan seems to have a pretty good basis with Talanji and the Zandalari, but I can’t help but feel like Zekhan is being pushed to play a more pivotal role as another piece that defines what kind of Horde we’ll have going forth.
And the fact that he is going to get his own unique model reinforces said idea.

I’ll be honest, I hate characters born out of blatant fanservice for the memes. And having Zekhan coming out of the blue and being propped that way to such relevant position in the story is something I dislike profoundly.
I want characters with meaningful stories or feats. Not shallow nods and references to some internal joke that has outlived its initial response.
It’s like having Gamon, as new Tauren leader.

I want trolls like Zentabra, with a relevant background and story foundations beyond meaningless fanservice.
Rather have few of the above, rather than a whole lot of the other.

As of lately, the narrative is relying excessively on those sort of Meme Characters. To the point they are neglecting the ones with a more established and “serious” background story.
Like Voss having the spotlight instead of Helcular (the freaking apprentice of Kelthuzad!), or Belmont (the leader of the Deathstalkers).
Or like Keeshan (the Rambo Meme), instead of Tyrathan Khort, Thassarian, Danath,…

But this is all my option of course. I understand and respect if others feel differently.


I mostly agree with your post. But I do think that lumping Zekhan in with Gamon and Keeshan is not very fair. While Zekhan was already becoming a meme after the BfA opening cinematic, Old Soldier must long since have been at work. I really don’t think he was put in there as an reaction to his popularity. And in Old Soldier he most definitely wasn’t in any meme-baiting role, but a serious new character.

In this case the community made someone who was planned as a character anyway a meme. Embracing that popularity, and using him in further content is really not that bad of a reaction. And he wasn’t put in any leading role, he was kept in the role he had from the start: A representative of the lost Horde youth looking for guidance from people with strong convictions, like Saurfang.

I’ll certainly agree that Rokhan is the more important character and should have gotten a model first, but I don’t need to declare Zekhan no more than a meme to say that.

(Zarao) #23

May have stretched it a bit and may be a bit unfair with him, not gonna lie.
But still, his whole character reeks of “Zappyboy” all over. To me at least.

And it irks me how they would feel like upping these sort of characters in lieu of the serious ones that are being sorely neglected.


I’ll add that I still think it possible that Vol’jin will in some way be revived. And if that happens… I fear poor Rokhan will go back into the shadows again. Not saying that him not getting a model is a sign of Vol’jin coming back… but I will say that I wouldn’t expect a new model for Rokhan, if that was planned.


Oh, I do understand you. Zekhan becoming the new Darkspear leader just because of his considerable fanbase would indeed be ridiculous, but really, I don’t see this happening.
Unlike Rokhan, who certainly does his lion’s share in helping Talanji and the Zandalari, I’d say Zekhan is not really that relevant for the story as a whole, and only because he stands by Saurfang ( a man he thoroughly admires and who reminds him of his father ) against Sylvanas doesn’t mean he has to become one more puppet for the alliance.

I do, however, see the trend to replace established characters with new ones, characters with “less baggage” so to say, and while I’m not always happy about this either ( like Rastakhan, who had to die to make way for his more progressively thinking daughter ) I wouldn’t rule out the possibility that this could be the only way for the horde to survive as a faction after bfa.

That being said, I think Zekhan, although being a new character, has the potential to become more than just a meme, and I would like to witness his character development- provided, of course, it won’t be done at the expense of more established Troll characters like Rokhan or Zentabra.

Like I said, a new player doesn’t have to weaken the established team but can instead provide meaningful input.

But this is only my opinion as well, and of course I, too, respect if others think differently.

(Призраклеса) #26

This what will happens:

  1. Horde and Alliance forces attack on Orgrimmar.
  2. Sylvanas surrender.
  3. Saurfang order to execute Sylvanas, but in last second Wrathion will appear with the words, that we need Sylvanas to defeat NZot. Anduin tells that its OK, and we leave Sylvanas alive, and focus effort on him.
  4. Night Elves fans start asking what about them, and Blizzard answer that they already had their revenge. After that Nelf fans cancel subscription.
  5. The End.

Night elves did not get their revenge, this is unacceptable!

Is this fatalistic mindset a general Nelf trait by any chance? I mean, you don’t even know what will happen, but it’s almost like you hope for the worst just so you can feel even more sad and betrayed.


Wait, where is Blizzard coming from? I thought it was just Sylvanas, Saurfang, Wrathion and Anduin in this scenario?


That’s a plot twist, obviously!


Oh, nice! We love them, don’t we?


It’s lovely to, erm… “have your expectations subverted”.

(Mälfurion) #32

I have doubts that Sylvanas will surrender, I’ll give it to them they are doing damn good job keeping everything a secret and making us anticipate.

Tyrande and Malfurion will be causing an incident after the so called cease fire/peace occurs, you can bet on it,they want the Alliance to be the aggressors and this is a good way to do it . It is impossible for the blood war to end unless Sylvanas dies (And Blizz confirmed she won’t) or some new existential crisis forces us to work together/belays Kaldorei vengeance.
As for Calia she will most likely be pushed into the role of Forsaken Leader if Sylvanas is forced to flee or go on her ‘‘Mission’’ to save Azeroth.

I think we might have to wait and see what the issue is with Amara or most likely patch 8.3 for the Night Elves conclusion.

(Vonbumnut) #33

what’s that Mr Actiblizzion? your game is making a funny clunking noise? well there’s your problem - 10 minute cinematics in an MMO

why can’t they write the story in the fashion of an MMO? why are there cinematics everywhere? why are the commanders of the alliance referring to my naked drunken dark iron as “champion” and “hero” and promoting me to commander? is a drunken dwarf without pants just naturally the best candidate to be commander of the alliance expedition or something?

these and other mysteries may (not) be answered in 8.2.5!


To be fair, FFXIV does the same…

Not that it isn’t a stupid idea to focus so much on story instead of world-building but still.

(Zakkaru) #35

Mayla would - they were being set up as sweethearts.

(Zakkaru) #36

Weren’t you the one who made praising thread about him when Old Soldier came out?

Back then you were not annoyed with him and this is where the community was all over him. Back then he was “Darkspear champion on the rise” and now you call him just a meme?

Amazing how ONE odd character placement made you cross him out entierly. Thankfully I am not so eager to ditch him out when trolls are constantly losing iconic characters. Zekhan’s popularity was a surprise to devs themselves so I would rather for them to give him Nazgrim like development - so slowly step by step making him grow as expansions go instead ditching him because he triggered Sylvanas loyalists by simply saving Saurfang.

I can see lots of potential coming from him and I wanted Nazgrim/Taylor kind of hero for other races for a long while and I see Zekhan as one - he started off sweet with introduction of CGI render. So I sure hope he stays and kicks butt.

(Zakkaru) #37

I am personally VERY happy that Rokhan is NOT part of this “revolution” story. I don’t want for him to cooperate with Alliance and especially Jaina which he tried to kill the last moment they met. At least I don’t have to witness another character assasination and I always preffered for him to stick with Zandalari anyway rather than cesspool that Horde has became - the less Darkspears in this :poop:tty plot the better. They can appear once the story is less BS than what it is now.

(Zarao) #38

Kinda, yes.

But given the tone that’s being set and how the expansion developed, I started seeing him under a different light.

He no longer seems like some innocuous secondary to give the race some depth, but as token figurehead to cheer on what’s come to be some rehashed trip over the Hordes failing.
The fact that his new model comes before the one of the rest of serious character whose background goes beyond a cinematic and a Meme, makes it worse for me.

And I don’t fancy the tone of “triggering Sylvanas loyalists”, basically because the point of me disliking said character is precisely the shallowness of who basically grew out of a Meme and is being used as an extension of Saurfangs emotional trip and nothing more.
The fact that said sort of characters seem to be currently written to overstep the likes of Zentabra, Rokhan, or Gadrin…nope, hate it.

(Zakkaru) #39

I don’t see it -he only had one cameo so far and I don’t see a reason why not to implement him in a story when he received so much positive feedback. Sure, he is now shown as mere Saurfang sidekick but Saurfang won’t last forever and this where Zekhan has a chance to grow on his own. I see him as next Nazgrim potential.

And really Gadrin already had more spotlight than Zekhan as he was involved in Vol’Jin special questlines, and Gadrin is not a fighter, he is an elder. Throwing him to battles would be a disservice.

Zen’Tabra was already lost in Legion -becoming one of the faces of Hippie Circle and assasinating therefore Darkspear unique flavor in order to be mixed up with nelfies. Her cameo in Legion was not only incredibly underwhelming but even hurtful as I didn’t find in her any Darkspear Narrative - just regular flavorless druid that happens to be a troll.

I’d rather for Vanira to take spotlight as she was Vol’Jin’s right hand. Forgotten since Cataclysm. Ideally I wanted for her to become Zekhan’s mentor it would expand them both as characters.

And I wouldn’t say that his character is only about contributing to Saurfang emotional trip when he was also shown as representative of Hordes young blood, he stood up to him after all when he had disagreement with him so it’s not like he is just a fanboy.

(Aeula) #40

Loyalists will either ‘play along’ and depose Sylvanas or she’ll try to kill them to force their choice to side with her to be truly meaningless.

Zekhan will conveniently forget that loyalists openly opposed Saurfang in front of him.

Jaina will lead the charge in all the cinematics.

Derek will probably be completely forgotten or he’ll finally activate and stabby stab someone on the Alliance, either Jaina, Taelia or Calia. Whether it’s fatal or not I’m unsure. Probably not though, especially if Jaina or Calia are the targets.
In the unlikely event that the shadowlands leak is legit, Taelia dying might be what gets Bolvar involved in 8.3.

Also following on from the Shadowlands leak, Sylvanas could have already sent her forces on to Stormwind, leaving the loyalist behind with a small army to distract the Alliances. Maybe that’s why we’re forced to change sides?

Overall I predict our choice of who to side with will be meaningless and maybe one or two deaths, likely Saurfang being one of them, with Derek being the wildcard. Jaina’s at the right point in her arc to be offed, but Blizzard want to keep her around to sell her statue. Same reason Sylvanas will survive (Bare in mind Sylvanas is on Blizzcon’s keyart, so she’s not going anywhere in 8.2.5 at least).