All right, Enough strawmans for one day. I am out of this now. Wait up for my own new topic, comparing the event and the characters who participated. I warned you 
bye.
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Ah yes the hordes favorite thing to pass time. I remember seeing this in darkshore and brennadam as well
But the point is that the leafletâs werenât dropped to minimise causalities, but as a form of psychological warfare.
If we compare warfare methods, then sure there are better ways to go than having your body fall by radiation, but firebombings also carried experimental napalm and white phosphorous, which wasnât a better way to die either
Oh, I actually found a source in your favour. In War Crimes. From Jaina.
Seems like that one ship made it out, if Jaina isnât misinformed. Which kind of begs the question where Garrosh got prisoners from Theramore, and their children to blackmail them with, but⌠continuity doesnât exist to bind creatorsâ hands, I guessâŚ
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Iâm not really doing any kind of strawman. In fact Iâm addressing them as politely as I can when I couldâve left this be after my 20 word post.
No offence, but I dearly hope you are giving it a fresh approach rather than beating this dead horse any further with stuff that has been already debated for almost 10 years alreadyâŚ
Iâll quote more. Got the complete WoW bibliography on ebook (thanks to the best girl out there 
), and Iâll probably get some extra quotes regarding bits Iâve read a few already pointing out.
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Like Killing children is the Allianceâs? Yeah I went there.
Theramore was a legitimate military target. I mean it is a Fortress, it has its own -army- with its own colours, its own -Generals!- I mean it is a military location! I mean not even -one- General, but Several! I meanâŚthat implies a Military! Its Military might is large enough to stage the invasion of an entire -CONTINENT!- on its own, without the help of the Alliance.
I meanâŚI donât know how much more we can detail that Theramore was a military target. Did Civilians live there? Yes? Does that make it a Civilian Target as opposed to a Legitimate one? Umm, Only if you take the morality of Saddam Hussein as a good moral benchmark? I think I am fairly safe in saying that the presence of civilians, whilst a factor, does not rule out a military target. I mean the entire history of Warfare, and our understanding of War Crimes, would be ratherâŚmassively different, if it did.
Theramore is emphatically -Not- a War Crime. Even the duration of effect factor is not a Warcrime in Azeroth. It simply is -not- a War Crime. It was horrific in its scale, it was terrifying in the scope of what was done, but it simply was not a War Crime. Unless we are then turning around and saying that Jaina is guilty of War Crimes because she did some of the things that Garrosh was accused of?
Of course weâre not! But Equally. Theramore was an act of massive devestation, as controversial as the bombing of Dresden, or the Blitz, Hiroshima or Nagasaki. But still, an act of -War-, not a War Crime.
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No it really wasnât, one people said it was doesnât mean it won does entirely for that reason. And considering he only thought it would clearly means it was just a theory and I doubt that they would just fund/make so many leaflets for a theory. Especially when you consider the Japanese mentality at the time with death before surrender.
The concept of war crimes itself evolved after WW2, so saying they were not war crimes is kinda incorrect. You have to look a the historical context in which which actions were declared as war crimes. If done today, the bombings of Dresden, Tokyo and Hiroshima would be considered as war crimes.
Edit: based on my understanding of /u/Spot_Pilgrimâs post.
Are you using the
Wikipedia definition
A war crime is an act that constitutes a serious violation of the laws of war that gives rise to individual criminal responsibility.[1]Examples of war crimes include intentionally killing civilians or prisoners, torturing, destroying civilian property, taking hostages, performing a perfidy, raping, using child soldiers, pillaging, declaring that no quarter will be given, and seriously violating the principles of distinction and proportionality, such as strategic bombing of civilian populations.[2]
Among other issues, modern laws of war address declarations of war, acceptance of surrender and the treatment of prisoners of war; military necessity, along with distinction and proportionality ; and the prohibition of certain weapons that may cause unnecessary suffering.[1]
, which, as fas as I can tell, is the only one that was mentioned to this point?
Really, why not just clearly define what you see as a war crime, show that it doesnât fit your definition and be done with it, no matter if someone else defines it differently?
Itâs quite obvious that about everyone here has different standards for the term, so it isnât like everyone is talking about the same thing.
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It was a war crime stated by the Pandaren which near enough every leader/the jury agreed with. We have a book going over various War Crimes and one of them was Theramore. You cannot get any clear cut than this yet you still argue against it.
Please get over yourself. You are arguing against objectivity and it is sad how you cannot accept you are wrong.
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Donât get me wrong i agree that its a valid militairy target like places as Hiroshima. But lets face it, in a world in wich most people still fight with melee weapons, iâm pretty sure using a nuke or poisonous gasses can be concidered honorless.
But really we shouldnt be using terms like warcrimes when its literally about a different âworldâ with different moral standards
Perhaps, but do you have a source regarding that they were dropped to minimize casualities?
It wasnât just the bombs but also the Soviets entering Manchuria which may have played a key role in the surrender of Japan.
Edit: www dot dannen dot com/decision/targets.html
- Psychological Factors in Target Selection
A. It was agreed that psychological factors in the target selection were of great importance. Two aspects of this are (1) obtaining the greatest psychological effect against Japan and (2) making the initial use sufficiently spectacular for the importance of the weapon to be internationally recognized when publicity on it is released.
B. In this respect Kyoto has the advantage of the people being more highly intelligent and hence better able to appreciate the significance of the weapon. Hiroshima has the advantage of being such a size and with possible focussing from nearby mountains that a large fraction of the city may be destroyed. The Emperorâs palace in Tokyo has a greater fame than any other target but is of least strategic value.
Edit 2: sorry the posted link was regarding the selection of targets, not the dropping of leaflets.
Edit 3: The terms stated in the Potsdam declaration were intended to be ambiguous and this was intentional. Reference: Wikipedia
Cool. Alliance Did War Crimes too, given by Azeroths definition. Groovy. Jaina on Trial when?
Its nice to see that you finally got enlightened and realized what some of the biggest horde war crimes are.
Sings âIts beginning to look a lot like Horde Bashing Friday! Everywhere you go, The Post was made on Friday, they had a blue Avatar, I guess weâre all Evil Now!â
Yes. And there is no need for you to take the p. out of it. Thank you.
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Well I was stating this facts for a long time now but some of your horde brethren are so very delusional and cant still accept the simple truth. The sooner the horde starts to condemn its own atrocities and realizes how some of its leaders are war criminals the sooner we can get a peace between the factions in the future. Maybe the Anduin is the one which can lead as an example to the brighter future of the both factions, since he is a good diplomat and not warmonger.
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Completely irrelevant to what we are discussing. We are talking about Theramore being a War Crime, not Janiaâs controversial history.
You bring this up just shows you have no comeback to your invalid argument .
This isnât Horde bashing, this has nothing to do with that. We are discussing facts so please just drop that point as well because it just makes you look desperate.
Edit : I hate how phone it doesnât default to your most used avatar.
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Laughs out loud in Horde I rather eat poo(Yes, really), than accepting him as my new leader. And then I sell my account on ebay.
Pro tip. Thatâs what I was discussing! I mean I made many references as to why It was not a War Crime!
Standard Alliance comeback. Can you not actually -explain- your thought process instead of essentially going âNo Uâ as an argument?
You have just said âNo Uâ as an argument, after a worded explanation of mine. You -LITERALLY- just used a meme answer to a considered response. What the actualâŚI mean, I donât know how to respond to that. I used words⌠There may have been many words, but they were words, and they have meaningsâŚwhy is this somehow destructible by a Meme Bomb? Weâre beyond that! Surely!