Time Wasters and the Roping Mechanic

General Discussion
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I’m gonna use this as a platform to reach out to Blizzard in the hopes they pay some kind of attention to the issues their customers have. If you agree, then I guess help this get noticed. If not, whatever, have fun being a dick.

Anyway.

It’s my understanding that the team at Blizzard aim to make their games as user friendly as possible, so I’m lead to asking this question: What does Blizzard intend to do about players that waste other people’s time by roping every turn?
Tonight alone, I have faced approximately 10 people that spend their turn doing nothing until the last moment, where they press ‘end turn’ just before the timer runs out, so they can waste yet another full turn the next time round. I understand that it’s hard to distinguish between genuine issues on the players end, and intentionally stupid behaviour, but it seems to me that a simple code can be put in place to ensure others like me, who take their turns properly, aren’t left waiting forever for their opponent to do something: disconnect players that hit the rope 3 turns in a row before turn 5. In the casual game mode, it is understandable that players might rope frequently as that mode tends to be used by newer players that are still figuring out the game. But on ladder, ranked games, particularly rank gold and above, players typically know what they’re doing, and a player that ropes 3 turns in a row before turn 5 is more often than not, simply wasting time for their own amusement. It is clear to me that the Blizzard staff know how the game works, and have a team that tests the game modes, cards, etc, so they are very aware that it doesn’t take until the rope nearly burns out to make a decision. This is not an issue only I have either, noted players that stream Hearthstone, and friends of mine all agree that there is an issue with players abusing the time limit for reasons beyond decision making. This ruins the experience for everyone, and needs to be addressed. Please make it known that this game is played by people that want to enjoy it for the game play, and not by people that want their time wasted by other players abusing the turn timer system. If I could have a response regarding what Blizzard might intend to do about this issue, I would be very grateful. Sincerely, Benzy.

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It depends on the game. I rope sometimes because I need to make sure I make the most optimal play. Often micro decisions make or break you. If you rope for no reason then sure, but taking your allotted time is necessary often. If the board is complex and I need to clear it a certain way then it’ll take some time.

There are clear asses that abuse this however and it pisses me off I get it, but it’s not everyone.

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That’s where my distinction between early game and late game, and the frequency of the opponent roping comes in. It’s neigh on impossible to have built a board so complex that requires the opponent to rope before turn 5. And again, the frequency of the roping is a factor. A player shouldn’t be punished for 1 or 2 turns of roping. I myself have loaded a game and gotten distracted during my turn. No one is perfect. But, and I’m sure you would agree, there is a spate of players that intentionally waste other people’s time for their own amusement. I’ve resorted to spamming the wow emote and roping them back as a message to them that being an a**hole can work both ways, and that I’m just here to play a game, which sometimes has the desired effect. But more often than not, the opponent continues to rope each turn for no reason beyond their own gratification. This doesn’t seem like an issue with no resolution, even if my solution isn’t the correct one.
As you state, you have experienced it too, but it’s not everyone. This is why I made clear I would support the decision to enforce a 3 consecutive turns before turn 5 system. This way, the game has either ended before someone’s time and enjoyment have been flushed down the drain, or the game has progressed enough to warrant a player using the rope. Side note, also. The game should be able to track how much time of a player’s turn was used, and how many actions they made in that time. So if a player spends 99% of their turn just to press end turn, that should trigger some kind of response from the game to suggest their may be time wasting, and repeated instances, then, are punished, to preserve player’s enjoyment and to keep the game from being ruined by selfish players. I understand I may sound like a baby to the people that either do this themselves, or haven’t experienced it, but tonight alone has proven to me that this issue is more prevalent than it should be, and that something needs to be done about it.

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If you rope and don’t end the turn the rope just burns faster.
If you rope and end the turn a second before, unfortunately there’s no real way for them to punish this as annoying as it is.

To play devil’s advocate. There are millions of games played a day around the world. You having this happen 10 times sucks for you, but overall I haven’t faced it as a problem. At least a horrible one.

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I’m more than aware of how the rope mechanic functions. I’ve been playing since the game’s release over multiple accounts. If a player doesn’t end their turn, then correctly, the rope burns faster the next turn. That is a great system and discourages players from doing nothing. To an extent… The real issue is when they are actively watching the rope burn and their (and their opponent’s) times slipping away into forever, then press that little end turn button so they can start the whole process again the next time around. Once, twice, maybe even three times I might understand, but there comes a point where the enjoyability of the game is being ruined by people. Call it impatience if you want, but I value my time. I don’t wish to spend 5 minutes of a 10 minute game that should have only lasted 5 minutes to begin with, waiting for nothing to happen.

You could argue it’s akin to players using aggro decks. Some people just play a certain way and that’s their fun, so be it. But this is beyond a ‘taste’ or ‘style’. It’s a function exploit at the expense of the opponent for no reason beyond self gratification. It takes no skill. It takes no intelligence. It requires no thought. It’s not interactive. It’s not something you can counter. It’s a problem that has spread across games, across ranks and across servers, that Blizzard have yet to even mention, let alone address with a solution.

As the seasoned player I’m sure you are, can you tell me any instance before turn 5, where you’ve had to rope multiple times just to hit end turn? I would be shocked if you could. And the specificity of the issue being as it is, is certainly something that can be tracked with code. So this ‘exploit’ (for lack of a better word) is not uncontrollable, and not something we should just accept as a mainstay in our Hearthstone experience.

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Turn 5 is rather arbitrary as there are instances, albeit rare, where there is a full board I have to deal with, with limited resources prior to this. Lackeys, evolved minions, etc.

Listen I’m not telling you you’re wrong for feeling the way you do, I’m just telling you it’s not a widespread problem as a singular sample size, you, is not remotely big enough for blizzard to come in here and say ‘damn you’re right let’s talk’.

It’s trivially easy to write the code you mention, that’s not why it’s difficult to implement. Its difficult lies in its efficacy. If you queue into a game and sit there and actively waste someone’s time how should you be punished? You did nothing wrong according to the TOS. You could argue that you wanted to think about all potential plays and future plays in your allotted time.

I added someone a few days ago who roped all game and I asked them why they did it and they said they were AFK for most of the game. I told them not to waste my time or anyone else’s and to not queue. Again, I understand the frustration but due to the fact that this is a rather complex card game the amount of hatred Blizzard would get from even remotely suggesting something like this would be similar to the award hate they got.

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That’s the most useful thing you’ve said all night. And I agree, many people, myself included, take time to assess the match up and the correct plays based on the cards they’ve seen from the opponent. But you miss the point of the issue. There is a clear distinction between a player thinking, and a player wasting time. The consistency of their turns ending right at the buzzer, and the choices they make. Perhaps the solution isn’t to ‘punish’ players that do this, but perhaps expand the game mode options, like in many chess apps, to have variable times. For instance, classic time (as it is now), extended time (with 20+ seconds per turn) and speed play (-10 seconds per turn) or to that effect. So those prepared to play at a pace can do so with less hinderance from time wasters, and those that wish to waste time can do so against players prepared to take longer themselves. I grant you that this issue isn’t a clear cut, all encompassing issue that every deals with all the time in the same way for the same reasons. But the issue is still real, still widespread, and can still be resolved. Like I said before, I don’t have the answers, only ideas and frustration with the lack of support this issue seems to get, but to open the discussion and crowd source ideas is what this forum is for. I don’t wish to see people that are genuinely taking their time, for legitimate reasons, punished. But I do want to see action taken against those that purposefully waste people’s time. That’s not what any of us signed up for. We came here for a fun, challenging card game. To get selfish players intentionally time wasting to make other’s concede out of impatience is not part of the deal. I’m not sure how else I can articulate this so if others that are reading have any input, please speak up. And to speak on your comment regarding this issue effecting a sample size of ‘me’, I encourage you to watch Thjis, Trump, Regis, and just about any other constructed/arena/duels streamer to see that this isn’t just a personal issue, but one that reaches across all servers, in all ranks, in all game modes (except battlegrounds and solo adventures of course).

A cry baby I might be, but a cry baby with a point, and a concern that deserves to be listened to and taken seriously.

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I actually can’t remember the last time I faced someone intentionally roping.

The players that used to aggravate me, were the ones that would rope until they were obviously winning and then magically speed up.

But as of late, I have faced little to no time wasting.

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That’s total guesswork on your part. You can’t really know the opponents motivations or reasons. If they are emote spamming you, sure, but if they are simply roping and playing regularly then you are the one projecting intentions and malice on the opponent.

If they are simply roping (without emote spamming or anything of such), then you are the one being BM in this scenario. Reason being you are demanding the game is being played according to your own set of expections and lash out if those expectations aren’t met.

That’s ridiculous. If a player ropes all five first turns, that’s all well within their right. There’s a lot to do in the first five turns. You can feel out the opponent, establish a connection, analyze your cards, develop a game plan and infinitely more. If 75 seconds is perceived as being too much for the playerbase, then Blizzard could implement a 40-60 second turn time for the first five turns.

Again, guesswork and projection! How do you know they do it for self gratification? That might be true for some cases, but it could just as well be for thinking, relieving oneself of time pressure, relieving onself of opponents expectations, admiring the artwork, reflection, observation, meditation, inspection+++.

That’s not an easy distinction to make. Most of the time you will have no idea. Also, thinking is not a requirement of valid use of turn time. If someone were to meditate on each of his turns with little to no thinking, that would count use valid turn time, yes? It would clear his head and improve his game. Yet, no thinking were required.

You are calling people who rope selfish, but ironically, you are the one being selfish. Why? Because you are turning what could be an enjoyable game for everyone into a game of frustration and demonizing. You are making the entire thing about you, your expectations and your worldview.

I can grant you that Blizzard could implement functionality to detect bots and players who are doing no actions except pressing the end turn button for the entire game, but for people who are simply roping and playing regularly, there is no wrongdoing.

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You do know longer the game goes on the more exp you get, this has been mentioned on a few occasions since the Pass came out. Please can you read passed posts and stop repeating the same silly Rope issue its pointless.

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damn busted. I rope all the time hope blizz don’t ban me cuz. srs.

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I love how, right at the end of your misunderstanding, you ‘grant me’ that a bot could recognise when a player does nothing but hit end turn in the last few seconds of their turn, multiple times. That’s the issue I am raising. I don’t expect every player to make a decision before the rope all the time every time. That’s ridiculous. But you can identify someone’s intentions by how they respond to your mimicry. If a player ropes me multiple times without making a decision beyond ‘okay button time’, I do the same back. Then, either they also get annoyed and start to play, or the continue roping. Usually if a player starts to play normally, they were thinking, and now feel bad for taking so long. If they continue to rope, they’re more often than not just being a dick. And as for this being a projection or my own interpretation, I have to disagree. Numerous times after games that go like this, either I get added by the opponent so they can trash talk me, or I add them to ask them why they roped. In the latter, I either get no response, or trash talk. Which are both pretty clear indication of their intent. Someone who genuinely takes their time to ensure they make the right plays is likely the same person to move on straight away without the need to add someone for some trash talk, or would be sure to clarify, because they’re here to make the most of the game, and would expect the same from their opponents, granting them enough respect in that manner to take 10 seconds to say ‘yeah man, i think about strats n shizz’… you see where I’m coming from? There are tell tale signs in players’ actions (or lack thereof) that indicate intent. And not to claim I know all about the inner workings of the mind, but I’m experienced enough to have picked up on these subtle differences. Hence the frustration in its prevalence. But sure Pure, ‘grant me’ the very thing I was talking about to begin with. Cheers buddy.

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Wait, are you only talking about no-action/only-end-turn ropers here for the entire game duration? Seemed to me that you were talking about regular play ropers as well (i.e people who rope the first 5 turns, but actually plays cards).
To make it even more clear, does your posts say anything against players who ropes every single turn for the entirety of the game, does not emote and plays regularly?

(Forgot to use reply functionality. Does not seem possible to edit in afterwards. A reply to Benzy’s message above.)

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True…but if you play more games in that time you also earn the same XP with the added potential of winning more, thus earning more rewards and not being a ****.

The only time it makes any sense to drag it out for XP is maybe if it’s the last game you plan to play that day and have nothing better to do.

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I don’t have any issue with people roping if they seem to have a reason for it. But the issue (and I thought I made this clear) is when people take their entire turn just to hit the button, for multiple turns. I have decktracker, so I know when someone plays a card they’ve been holding since turn x. And to no surprise of mine, frequently, people that ‘intentionally’ rope play cards that make sense to play in the early game, like the 1 mana neutral weapon, or a quest (bar the priest heal quest, where it can be tactical to play it a few turns in to bank some damage). But no, the issue I have at least been trying to outline is players that clearly aren’t just thinking about their turns, but instead, clearly, are wasting time. And some like to emote for a laugh, some don’t, but the biggest issue is that there is no penalty for it, or no system in place that can identify these kinds of plays and forfeit the match for the opponent. It comes down to ‘what are you here to do, play a game, or waste people’s time?’ and if it’s the latter, then something should be in place to stop that from ruining other people’s gaming experience. After all, it’s meant to be fun, no?

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Thank you for your reply.

Okey, so your posts are mainly referring to people who rope x amount of turns (not for the entire game) and actually plays cards at some point. The problem with trying to do anything about this is that there’s plenty of players who play regularly, politely, and legitimately who only press the ‘End Turn’ button for the first 3 turns (or turn 7-10, or wherever), no matter what cards they are holding. How would you seperate the wheat from the chaff?

Please consider this: how would you protect legitimately roping players? (as a thought exercise to view both sides of the equation). How would you protect players who enjoy using their full turn time, does not AFK and has no ill-intent? It seems to me that if you were matchmaked with such a player you would immediately assume malice, BM and that they are wasting your time, although a certain percentage of ropers you meet will have no such intentions at all.

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I have already said, in as many was as I can, exactly what I would propose. If you haven’t been able to understand that, that’s on you. If you desire to understand, go back and read it all again, there’s about 5 different ways of the same thing being stated. I won’t be doing it a 6th.

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There are many blizzard trolls here, don’t be upset, they are either payed to defend the game and be dumb to not understand a simple sentence or just make upset you to stop mention things which should be corrrected.

I am facing with many ropers, half of them are using bots and set the end timer before rope comes, exactly the same time. Other half is other species like cheaters in FPS, they are doing it just to piss u up, because they are frustrated fu.ks.
There should be a report system to report ropers, and if they get certain nr. of reports they should be put in a pool where only ropers are. (just like in fps games, where cheaters are facing against cheaters). If they played X number of games without roping they can get back to “non-ropers” game.
If somebody don’t have the time to play, then don’t queue, simple as it is.

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I’ve complied together all mentions relevant to protect roping players:

(An argument for roping being OK lategame)

(An argument for roping 1 or 2 turns of roping being OK)

(An argument for adding different modes with different turn times.)

I still feel as you are dodging my question, because what I’m simply trying to say is that how would you protect a legitimate players that would rope every single turn for the entire game and still play regularly (as in, play cards, use weapons and hero powers). How will you protect them? According to your posts you say nothing about this.
If you’re not willing to protect them, what argumentation do you have? They are simply using the means given to them by Blizzard: 75 seconds a turn. They are not breaking any rules and are doing nothing wrong according to Blizzard’s own ruleset. As we stated earlier you cannot know their intentions or motivations in the game itself from emotes alone, so there’s no way for you to know if it’s because they are using their turn time to their fullest or if they are being BM. Therefore the entire BM argument is void. So what argumentation do you have?

I’m trying to understand you here. Please value a discussion with someone with the opposing view, instead of just hoping for people to parrot your already set convictions.

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I can assure you I’m being sincere and genuine. If you can’t value an opposing view without discarding them as trolls, then you’re really the one who’s standing in the way of proper discourse.

Also, put ropers in a queue together? For what possible reason? If there’s actually a human playing the game and roping your suggestion would punish players for doing nothing wrong according to Blizzard’s own ruleset. This would serve as a punishment not because matchmaking with ropers is bad, but because most people value diversity.

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