They are fine, it’s the other stuff… that they added later.
I do not understand what this is about… Are you talking about artefact/azerite/covenant powers or are you talking about that we are item level 900-1000 in legion andd 400-500 in bfa and now we are getting nerfed to lower?
Yes.
10chars
No, But it’s either this or class pruning every couple of expansions.
So i guess, I’m ok with borrowed power as long as it’s not 5 layers of systems on top of systems.
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People argue it adds flavour, but I fail to see what it adds if I use said ability once every 2 hours.
If you make them all usable and needed, you lead to players being unable to play the class. People often go “MOP” but forget parses for most classes were terrible in that expo because juggling everything alongside having interesting boss encounters was nearly impossible.
It may have felt fun, but is it good design if with the toolkit given players are only reaching 50% of their class potential? I’d say no.
Well… ‘want’ as in: ‘I want to have it perse’, no.
But I don’t mind it being in the game either.
So, I guess I’m indifferent about it.
True, but that’s not the only thing they could do.
How about horizontal power for instance? More CHOICES of abilities, but you can only pick X number. That way, you’d have much more choice of how your character plays, and abilities to use, but it wouldn’t require more and more buttons to press.
So basically:
Imagine the talent rows. But instead of the 3 choices you have now, each expansion would add another choice to each of the talent rows.
You’d have more options to choose from, but still only 1 to pick from each row.
That sort of thing.
Do you think tier sets and trinkets (especially if they introduced m+ specific tier sets, PvP tier sets and maybe even WQ tier sets) would give people enough of “something new” to satisfy those who don’t want classes to get stale, without being as impactful as wholely new abilities (e.g. artifact, covenant etc)? I would like to think so, as that’s the sort of system I’d prefer, but then I’m not one of those people who wants new for the sake of new in general.
I asked if you want it in the game.
I am just curious what others think is all.
Tier sets in Vanilla, TBC, Wrath and Cataclysm were all borrowed boosts. Healing, damage, spell duration and stat boosts. All above and beyond normal armour, trinket, ring and neck stats.
All that were lost in the next expansion.
Sure they went nuclear with it from MoP onwards, but it’s always been here in some form, hasn’t it?
It’s here, I don’t see it leaving. It’s just another part of the game.
Yes all along in it’s traditional form… not this bloated nonsense they added later.
Well I think its good they keep these side powers changing would be boring if they where the same and we would be to Overpowered if they kept stacking them all and think of the math calculations it would take if they just kept going up and up with the “power levels” the balancing required for that would be insane 
Could be fixed with a passive talent system that you build on after reaching max level with daily xp caps… that you could actually keep.
Nope. The reason is simple. When you moved from Vanilla to TBC, you brought all that your character was into the new zones to face the new challenges. When you moved from TBC to Wrath - same. To Cataclysm.
However, now it seems at the end of WoD we became SO POWERFUL that we have to drop all of our power just so our enemies can stand a chance. It’s like “Hey, Gul’dan, I’m leaving my army behind, just to be nice, I’mma kill you by myself” The player character has not progressed since WoD. We go and kill new things, but we have to leave everything we earned behind. Might as well go to the Shadowlands naked.
Where before you actually progressed and each expansion was something new and exciting, now each expansion demands you to first delete your character and start anew, essentially.
Oh and also, since Blizz started relying on borrowed power, gear became total garbage. Mainstat/stamina based on ilvl then 2 secondary stats bam, all the gear in the game. It’s really terribly boring.
2 Likes
Lost next raid tier often, even.
Like I said it would mean you have the same passive abilities every expansion in other words boring… and we sort of already have that cause we already have talents…
I found nothing exciting about having to drop my purple raid gear for ugly TBC greens.
But anyway… it’s a double edged sword. Getting a new ability (or 2) is cool, but once you do this for a couple of years, you’re going to have an insane amount of abilities. That’s why they stopped with that sort of thing. It becomes unmanageable (not to mention the problem of creating new and interesting abilities that don’t make it so every class can do everything now).
Hence, I think something like this, could be an interesting solution:
Yeah, and then proceeded to say that for you is a huge no.
My point is that at this current time, going against borrowed power is the current mantra people say without really considering the implications.
I think the problem is how this borrowed power are implemented.
They were really unfriendly for alts and forcing people into things they did not like (essences) or punishing people for getting an higher lvl piece (early azerite).
We could argue borrowed power should be spec specific instead of being a generic spell.
Like, instead of Crucible of flame you get a “talent” that say “every time you void bolt you spawn a shadow apparition” instead of it being a generic fire damage.
But imo the hate towards borrowed power is caused by bad implementation of the system, and the inability on blizz side to see if any borrowed power can be baked into baseline because is really good for the spec feeling.
Well yes - I have my own opinion.
no, i’d rather they move back to simply adding a talent row every expac
4 Likes
No, despite the fun getting the right “borrowed power” can give. I imagine it was hilarious to proc Twilight Devastation or stack Masterful in Fire Mage’s case. But still. Borrowed power and BiS problems hems you into a specialization, which I hate.
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