A simple question for you

I simply pointed out that people vision on Borrowed power is influenced by the horrible systems we experienced in BFA.

And before saying that borrowed power should not be in the game, people should be able to talk about a generic system not BFA ones.

If you ask me "you want bfa BP in games again? " i will tell you “No”.
But talking about borrowed power in general is a different matter, and it should not be obscured by bad systems.

But instead of replying to Telestrian pov, you had to shift the argument talking about bfa legacy servers, wich again have bad systems and we all agree on it.

SL’s issue is the lack of flex in their BP system. You can’t explore it, creating the same issue I mentioned above in a “bad” BP system. I place conduit X that buffs my immolate damage in socket Y, and then for my DPS spec that slot has the same conduit in it regardless of whether I’d prefer something else. That’s not cool. That’s the issue.

regarding the sheer amount…again I think they’re overdoing it slightly. Issue is volume, not the systems itself. SL gives us:

New class ability
new cov ability
soulbind passives
conduit passives
lego effects

that is way way way too much. Especially considering we all know the lego restriction will be lifted to above 1, like in legion.

SL should keep it simple, it’s volume that’s the issue:

You pick ONE class covenant ability which is restricted to covenant.
Remove the generic covenant abilities completely, they create too many balancing issues and pairing them with the above is poor design where they conflict.
Maintain the passive “soulbind tree” system but decouple it from the covenant choice, so you “earn” these followers as you quest with them and do covenant stuff, but they remain with you forever once you’ve renowned them up. So if you want necrolord binds, but like NF active, you farm the renown on necro and then swap back. You could do similar with the actives ie “once you hit renown X with us, you can use our active ability with any covenant”.
keep Lego at 1 per char for all expansion.
Make the conduits not shared across the trees so you’re not having to weigh up the passive effects in the trees versus the conduits to determine which you dump “less ideal” conduits into.

It’s still bloated to a degree, but given the conduits are basically “gems” and the soulbinds are “talents” I don’t think it’s majorly complex. The main complexitiy would come down to farming the setup you want, but MMORPGS should always have that. You put effort into getting the setup you want, but when you have it, you have it.

Most BP should weigh on passive augments because you feel them less when you lose them. BFA’s issue is you get essence actives and corruptions, although passive, behave like major abilities because “you have a chance to deal 30% of ur max HP in a beam” cannot be described as a minor augment. So they feel crap when you lose them.

I know heading into SL as Vengeance i’m going to be hit hard because the systems didn’t support my kit organically, they built an artifical scaffold around it. I lose my TD threat (and get no damage buff to compensate) I lose my VoP demon form uptime, plus the major healing when I parry or dodge (which is a big deal when you have 52% avoidance during spikes). I lose the “Soul Cleave casts soul barrier when at 40 stacks” effect. These are too impactful so when they’re gone, i’m left far weaker than I was before.

The issue with BFA was the BP was the principle source of our power because it reigned dominant over our kit. Out kit should always come first. if a BP system does that and that alone, then it won’t see the same issues. I should have to press the same abilities I always do, but I get more boons for doing so. Not this “you randomly have a chance to enter uberform or nuke the pack to death” rubbish.

1 Like

Never forgive them for taking my buffs. AGAIN. And then making passives into auras. Just uuuuuurgh whhhhhy :scream:

1 Like

The auras are underwhelming as well.

1 Like

No.

I miss the old days when you levelled and got new actual powers which you learnt when and where to use. Often these were new talents but sometime just new abilities. I used to wonder if we’d get a new elemental or some new mega-pewpew at max level.
These days I don’t even look at the names, I read tooltips and see what will suit me, usually just pick the passive one as it’s easiest (and usually bets anyhow).
I know these artifact or azerite powers will go next expac, so they’re meh.

2 Likes

Aye, agreed.

Mein answer is NEIN.

I want mein spec to function properly in X.0 instead of having to wait 1 or 2 patchs in order to make mein spec feeling gud.

I’d rather Blizzard spent more time on baseline specs instead of wasting time on overcomplicated systems that are an imbalancing mess.

1 Like

Conduits could have been this, but the issue is their cackhanded management across specs.

For example I have maybe 3-4 conduits that apply to both specs that are throughput focused (potency and endurance) the rest are Finesse and arguably have little effects on my performance. These are:
The Covenant ability buff ones
Reduce Blur/Fiery Brand cooldown
Increase Soul healing
Decrease magical damage taken
Movement speed boost after using Fel rush/Infernal strike
Immolation damage buff
Enemies are snared when imprison fades
Spectral sight persists after taking damage
Consume magic has a chance to remove 2 effects.

Now even with these, their application to both specs is kinda awry, for example the cooldown reduction to blur isn’t nearly as good for havoc as the cd reduction on brand for vengeance.

However with the other conduits, they have no effect on my other spec at all. If I pick the “Using Demon’s Bite buffs your damage” one, that slot is dead for my tanking spec.

You could argue I “don’t need to be optimal” in every situation, but there is a marked difference between performing less than stellar and having zero performance buffs at all.

It would be better if conduits which were spec specific had alternative functions for other specs. For example a conduit with “Demon Bite Buff” becomes “Soul Cleave deals X more damage” when i swap specs.

Skillful choosing of which are paired with which can still resolve the optimisation issue. You pair the really strong havoc traits with the less strong vengeance ones and vice versa. But at least you get something, rather than having your off spec get nothing if you choose certain conduits.

Specs are a part of our identity, and classes that can respec should be allowed to do so without feeling like it’s unattractive. I don’t want my havoc spec to be as good as my vengeance spec, but it would be nice to feel like I can progress my Vengeance spec fully and my havoc spec lightly rather than this “if you progress this spec, that one suffers” mentality. It completely flies in the face of being able to multispec at all.

I would like for my class, abilities and talents to form the absolute bulk of my gameplay.

All these buffs and procs that we’ve had with azerite traits, corruptions, essences and in a lesser degree with artifact weapons: they suck.

They aren’t fun and the worst thing is for some cruel reason: it’ll feel like our characters are somehow worse once those borrowed powers are taken away again.

BUT to give Blizzard some credit, it is necessary to invent new systems and other stuff to keep players occupied and interested. Not saying they’re doing it perfectly, but it is necessary for longevity.

A big massive NO. I guess they will put it in the game now.

NO !

Account wide prostige levels ? 1 prostige level increase a secodery stath 0.1% to all ur chacthers :stuck_out_tongue: so 100 protige levels is 10% then afther u pick a other statsh again :stuck_out_tongue: so 400 gives 10% to 4 diff statsh :stuck_out_tongue:

if it is designed well then its not that big of a problem, which is why people dont really like BFA, but the legion artifact weapons were generally all designed pretty well and actually worked out well.

the problem moving forward is that blizz are trying to hard to try and get people to play the way that blizz wants them to play rather than the way the players want to, hence why they havnt pulled the ripcord,

based on most recent balancing it looks like warlocks could be playing all 3 specs depending on different situations and the only way to do this effectively is to level 3 warlocks, because they want different covenant abilities and such, so there is no way to efficiently play a warlock if you only level 1 warlock.

NO NO NO NO. It was a horrible idea that never shouldve been a thing at all.
classes should eb complete with hit max level. like was EVRY EXPAC FROM CLASSIC TILL WOD.

1 Like

No it wouldnt,IF BLIZZ THINKS ABOUT AND ITS NOT RUSHING IT.

ITS realy simple,dont go overboard with powercrepp!
thats tireaking simple.

What?! :confused:

We wouldnt get prunign evry few expansion IF blizz was actulyl smart abotu their designign of the game at all.
ANd nowadays due borrowered power we get bigger prunes EVRY SINGLE EXPANSION

SO instead of maybe evry few expansion, now due borrowered power we get it wors end more often.
And ti onyl causes issues for blizzard aswell. makes it harder to design and balance ANYTHING

IT has 0 Actual upsides if they put actual thought in designign the game and its classes each expac

Did they as a power source though? I liked the artifacts mostly due to the lore / story that went with them.
I can’t remember any of the abilities apart from the Stormkeeper one which we still have, it was borrowed but because it was so necessary to the class it had to be stolen and not given back. It should just have been a new power all along, which is how powers should be acquired.
Can’t remember any of them from my alts.

Nope, hate it. i also hate the missions tables and followers but they are here to stay since draenor.

Yes I want borrowed power as long as the classes are fun to play. Borrowed power brings something new and fresh to each expansion.

1 Like