An arcane priesthood?


#1

I love the sound of it, it’s unique… and I think it is here.

the night elf priesthood… Every time we see them, in WC3, in End times, in Suramar, in Cathedral of Eternal night, in the Night Warrior Ritual and now in Naz’jatar.

night elf priesthood order seems to be very arcane orientated. I don’t think it is an accident, or blizzard simply forget they weren’t. night elf priests cast arcane spells and it matches the lore.

Remember when they said the discovered Elune through the Well of Eternity? And they vigorously studied it to understand her more? Could it be magecraft actually comes from the Order of Elune - almost like the same hting but 2 different focuses… Magecraft is like science, focusing on the application and physical properties of magical application… while the priesthood is spiritual - focusing on why.

Night elves are made from the well… why do people think they aren’t arcane based elves? the ban on magic? - surely all that means is they didn’t use most of their magic during the long vigil, and have started again OR, their magic while arcane was slightly differnet - it didn’t draw the legion to Azeroth because its spells draw their power from the moon and the stars, surely that makes them differnet from magecrat that draws spells from magical wells and azeroth’s atmopshwere thus casuing azertoh to light up like a beacon in the twisting nether.

Anyway… i just thought it was cool, makes them very different from other priesthoods


(Leíá) #2

Night elf priests cast spells down that are blessed from Elune.
It’s the night elf version of “holy magic.”

The first Highborne Seers thought Elune slept beneath the well, but after more research and through the orders of Azshara, the Arcane took route.

At this stage, we can’t say that the Arcane is affiliated with Elune, because that throws the lore of the arcane down the toilet for High Elves, Humans, Gnomes and other races, that have well renown Arcanists that were trained by the Highborne Exiles.
It would not be seen as some sort of “magecraft” in Kaldorei society.

They might have been changed by the energies of the well, but that doesn’t mean they live and breath the arcane like their Shal’dorei and Sin’dorei cousins do.

Just like the High Elves of the Hinterlands, who are also an Arcane race, the majority of the Kaldorei populace are not Magi, nor do they seek such practices in great numbers.
The High Elves of the Hinterlands chose a similar path after the Third War. Sacrificing the use of Arcane Magic, for more natural means of fighting, as in Archery, Swordsmanship and Traps. Like their Kaldorei cousins, only these Elves had Druidism, whilst these High Elves did not.

It isn’t Arcane. It’s lunar magic - magic called upon by Elune and she is not arcane-affiliated.


#3

You saying they weren’t priests? That’s such a strange thing to say, they were PRIESTS! Highborne didn’t exist as a group till much later, Azshara did not precede the discovery of Elune, she came after, and she created the highborne caste.

Then the arcane is the night elf version of holy magic.

How does it do that? Elunen’s preistesess cast arcnae spells, and many Elune labelled spells are also arcane - The conclusion to reach is that the arcane is involved with Elune worship and their priesthood spells use that - I don’t know how or why this must mean that the Arcane entirely belongs to Elune.

I wouldn’t reach such a conclusion, and if the arcane does belong to Elune… just if, if Elune is a real goddess, then surely she ffects other races even if htey don’t nkow who she is nor worship her…

Well ofc it doens’t mean that, it is well known that highborne soceity ilives and breathes arcane, whether it is the night elf highborne community, or the entire nightborne community or blood elven community - those are all lviing and breathing arcane, the night elf druids and priests do not, their devotion is to nature nad the goddess respectively, however the arcane has invovlement in their orders, as seen clearly by their spells.

The priests casts arcaen missiles, and it isn’t just lunar spells they cast, they also cast stellar spells, Starfall is not a lunar spell, it is a stellar one.

This is miy point, the evidence is in the game itself, we should be asking ourselves what is this telling us?


(Leíá) #4

Well I wouldn’t like this.

Elune was always a Night Elf thing and possibly a Nightborne thing.
Having her associated with Humans, High Elves, Blood Elves, Forsaken etc (any race that have Arcanists and were trained by Sunstrider’s Exiles), it ruins both her mystery and these races and what they view,

Having a diverse worship in this regard is not good. This sort of diversity is diversity done wrong.

But how do you explain Tauren Druids who also cast such spells?

Lunar Spells have the “Arcane” tag on them because Blizzard are lazy. Lunar Spells are spells from Elune/An’she in these two highly respectable societies.
I mean, if we follow this line of thinking, the enchantment that the Highborne placed on Quel’Thalas, timelocking nature into an eternal spring, was also Elune - but that just isn’t right.

No it isn’t.

Elune is their version of holy magic and she, as far as we know, is not associated at all, with the Arcane.

They were the first considered “Highborne” who took up interest in the Well. Many were referred to as “Priests and Seers” but they were almost, Priests of the Well - not exactly Priests of the Goddess. Remember, at this time, they’d only just discovered Elune. It was her who took interest in them, they wanted to study her and the well.
It wasn’t until the time of Haidene, until worship of Elune became a thing.

No, Azshara made the term official in law.

The first of the Elves who studied the well already considered themselves better than the rest. They were the first to begin studying the arcane secrets of the well - this was after their interest in Elune started to fade and they took up being Magi and Arcanists.

Because it isn’t a true “arcane” thing.
It’s a lunar thing. Her spells are of Lunar, “of the moon” energy that she blesses her followers with. Sometimes this is seen, as we saw with Tyrande and other times it isn’t, as we know with Astarii Starseeker, before she died in Darnassus.

The “arcane” tab is laziness from Blizzard, because we could easily argue that Tauren are associated with the arcane through “An’she” which is still Elune, but referred to differently. We know the Tauren aren’t, just like we know that the Kaldorei Druids and Priests aren’t.
The arcane, within the Elven society, is a Highborne thing - not an Elune thing.


#5

What I meant, is that they don’t have to worship her in the incarnation the night elves know her as. I woudln’t like that either, the lunar/stellar aspect of the night elves/nightborne is very unique, and i’d like it to stay that way. I like that their arcane users, priests and druids all have this unique lunar and stellar spells - it makes their mage/priest/durid orders unique.

id din’t liek it when other races coudl use druid spells, i really felt htat they shoudl have substitutes, but if the night elves tuaght them, then it made sense… however i felll kul’tiran and Zandalari druidsm should be modified… either that or specific reference that connects them to Cenarius/Malfurion taught druidsm… like Gonk being a student of Cenarius or something.

Easy, Tauren druids are taught by night elves. The lore specifically shows you and tells you Malfurion recruiting Hamuul Runetotem and training him. It turns out that ancient generatrions of tuaren had learned a measure of duridsm from Cenarius, so their race is a bit more familiar with it. The highmountain have lived next tot he Val’sharah druids since they moved in after the sundering, it also makes sense that , the race who was imbued by cenrius as a gift for their heroism during the wotA would have some membersbe trained by the night elves over the years once Malfurion produced druidsm from advancing Cenarius’ teachings.

I mean blizzard could be lazy , I am not sure, but I think they gave themselves a way out by letting us know Taurens and every other race until BFA learned duridsm directly from the night elves, hence why they access these elune spells and arcane spells.

Ofc it isn’t, I was just completing your logic there, if you are going to say the arcane spells the priests cast are the night elven version of holy magic, then you are basically saying arcane magic is the holy magic for night elves.

At first it seems outlandish but it may actually not be far from the truth. The night elves do consider hte arcane very sacred, it is the reason why they hate abusers so much and have trouble trusting the highbroen tillt he shen’dralar proved themselves - because hteir people have abused this precious magic which I can only summirse they feel is a gift from the Goddess (remember they feel the Goddess dwelt in the body of the lake, where hte magic comes from, it’s not hard to think they theorised that the arcane is from her and her magic. And the more superstituous amongst them get angry at the highborne abusing the Well like they did, which ends in claamity, … the way the preistesses treat the waters of the second well of eternity, is like they are holy, blessing htem ritualistic in the process of setting up Moonwells, it is very religious and sacred… but it’s arcane waters, … but then maybe to them it’s Elune waters.

blizzard really haven’t delved into the preisthood … we know far more about the arcane and druidic orders than we really know details about the priest order. Despite a lot of stuff shown, there is very little explanation.

I believe the lore shows that Azshara created the caste. remember highborne are not the only nobility of the night elves… Ravencrest was a noble, but not highborne. She created a noble caste that became the most powerful because they were picked for their talent in the arcane, not their deeds of heorism and nobility.

The highborne caste did not exist before Azshara was Queen.

I don’t know where you saw the first of the elves who studied the well already considered themesleves better than the rest? Where is that from? Chronicles? Can you link the statement? As far as I recall it’s the priests that were studying the well, and in time they developed the arcane arts to a level enough to create the mage class, similar to what Malfurion does 5,000 years later when he develops the nature arts from Cenarius’ teachings and progresses them to an advance enough level to form a class like the druid.

but myabe you’re right, I’d find it helpful if you found the precise references that phrases it that way.

I use to think that, but it doesn’t make sense. Priestesses are casting Arcane missiles, and other full arcane spells, and not all of them are lunar, some are stellar (starfall for example). What evidence do we have for thinking.

So I asked myself, why am I trying to force myself to think Night elf priests don’t cast arcane spells. What if they do? these spells all seem arcane. Then I looked back at their history, they studied the well, they were arcane orientated. They didn’t get corrupt like Azshara’s highborne clique, but then nor did the Moonguard who were mages.

Or perhpas it’s their spritual discipline and humility, combining arcane with light and faith that kept them … I mean… the night elves of the long vigil banned arcane practice of magecraft, not of priestcraft, and we learn it was specifically using hte Well of Eternities magic to do great things like build cities etc, this is what mages did. Using the Well lit up Azeroth in the twisting nether, allowing the demons to locate the planet, and only the well had sufficient power to open the portals for an invasion, therefore prevent any arcane user from using it, effectively removes the chance the legion has of comign to Azeroth = hence the ban.

But if preist acane usage uses the moon and the stars as the source, then it isn’t the sort of magecraft that is banned is it. It’s not using the Well of Etenrity, or the atmosphwere, so Azeroth isn’t lighting in the twisting nether, it’s using the stars and the moon as source, so it passes - no threat. Besides the priestly and druid orders don’t live an breathe arcane either, no chance of htem being addicted, tehier love is for the goddess (preists) and for nature (druid), while they may have lunar and stellar arcane spells, they also have a lot of nautre (druid) and light/void (priest)…

This to me makes a lot more sense. I also believe the piresthood lost some of its knowledge and didn’t use much of it’s arcane repertoire often out of the suspicion that grew for the arcane after the sundering … makes sense too (if you thought the arcane was everything and was infallible , then it becomes the architect to call in the monstorus demons, you would think twice and be a bit hesitant… i believe this is why that priestess in cata is forwned upon for pursuing the ancient arcane ways more openly … becuase the night elves at htis point still harbour some prejudices and stigmas…

However i feel that many of these go over time, as their knowledge of both the legion and and arcane addiction is restored with good examples.


(Leíá) #6

No they didn’t

The Zandalari and Kul’Tiran Humans haven’t learned their Druidism from the Night Elves. They have their own thing, with their own set of beliefs.

No I’m not because the whole thing with their spells isn’t Arcane anyway. It’s lunar.

It’s as far from the truth as your going to get.

Arcane waters, blessed by Elune - an outland source for the powers that the Priests of Elune command.
The Sunwell is the truest of version that truly display an Arcane/Light Well.

The Moonwells, are a well of worship and Elune Light treatment.

It was Alex who referenced it during a Legion Panel - take that with a grain of salt though. Perhaps it was a mis-talk.
But this does come direct from the Chronicles.

The early night elf priests and seers studied the Well with an insatiable curiosity

Their is this though, from the Highborne Wowpedia page:
" The Highborne were the upper classes of the ancient kaldorei civilization, at first a nameless caste made up of night elves who had unusual intelligence, strength, skills, or wealth and thus found favor with the ruling monarch. Their vast arrogance and greed, garish and multicolored clothing, and decadent habits did not endear them to other night elves. In fact, these powerful families became convinced that they were superior to the rest of their race, and so they began to call themselves the Highborne."

After, Azshara made the term official and in law.

Starshards. It’s a lunar spell, calling down Elune’s power. A totally-not-arcane-source-of-magic.


(system) closed #7

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