So, since season 2 started this week, I thought I’d start off easy by gearing up with Champion level gear from M0 before going into M+ for score, and also to learn the TWW dungeons since I haven’t really done them at all this xpac. As of writing this, I just spent nearly 2 hours of my time doing M0’s, and all I managed to get done was one run of Priory of the Sacred Flame with many many failed runs and disbanded groups beforehand! I know that the “difficulty” of the dungeons isn’t just down to Blizzard’s tuning and also depends on things like group composition, ilvl, and knowledge of mechanics, but it certainly does feel like they’re a bit overtuned. How come an M0 like Priory is so utterly hard to complete when it’s meant to be the gateway to M+? If my experience is anything to go by, I don’t even dare to touch Priory on M+ after this, let alone any other dungeons, it’s truly disheartening; and I just find that very strange given all of Blizzard’s talk about how easy and accessible they’re making M+ this season. It’s not accessible at all if this is what it’s like. Besides, not only did I spend so long just to finish one M0 run, I didn’t even get any loot from it, which makes it all the more pointless and frustrating. I don’t mind a bit of a challenge, I’m not saying they should make M0 the easiest thing in the world; but wasting so much of the player’s time just to not even get anything out of it feels far from what I’d consider fair and challenging, it’s just frustrating and annoying. And don’t even get me started on the bugs encountered along the way. Thoughts?
This is the new dichotomy of WW. Either you’re a casual farming delves either you’re a sweat doing M+
Heroics are facerolled and M0/M2 are like a gap of 10key lvl equivalent so it’s basically impossible to learn dungeons at a slow pace like you could before.
you are doing this wrong. and yeah tunign is garbage - just like it was in s1
what you should be doing is farming world content and dvelves to gear up in like 630+ before even stepping into m0
sure you can go in there even with 610 - but you will have horrible time
remeber that hc dungeons are dropping 622 itlv and crests .
people just cannot adapt to the idiotic compelte total resets of gear each time
my advise ? do dvelves +9-11 for next 2 months - then when .5 patch lands with corruption 2.0 gear get that and only then start pushing m+ .
doing them now is just compelte waste of time with dvelves dropping both runed and gilded crests from much much much much easier diifficulty - +9 dvelve is easier then m0 and drops both runed and gilded crests + champions gear from bountiful .
Does not seem like it, they are waaay easier than last season. People already time multiple dungeons on +13. Last season +13 was super hard even at the end lol. Also getting Champion gear from M0 is huge cause it goes as high as 658 ilvl.
not “people”
mythic tryhards.
yes those thrive.
while everyone else is hard gated at +2.
source ? the nerfs blizzard just implemented.
Haven’t done many keys yet but from what i can see from guilds and other forums, S2 so far is easier than the start of S1 by far. Did a +8 and it did not feel like how 8s were in S1.
But time will tell. One season people complain about it being too easy and another season its too hard.
it is mostly easierbecause we dont start undergeared.
at the end of the season i was 637 ilvl and in a +7 642 or something drops
so right now i am doing +7 and there are some decent healing checks but nothing too difficult.
in s1 at a similar gear level it wasnt much harder
I feel like we are lower ilvl than previous season week 1 since we had a about 17 coffer keys in the week before M+ opened. So we had a lot of 603 gear that was upgradable. We definitely were higher ilvl comparable than we are now.
I am now 642 (no tier, crap trinkets, crap stats), timed up to +9 and finished +10. The season seems easier.
My hate for Floodgate is already there though (no matter the keylevel).
Nah they are not overtuned, quite the opposite. 
Blizzard even nerfed M+ Tuning per Key Level going into this Season.
I do think +2 is a bit to hard for an entry level dungeon. Had runs with 20-30 deaths, it’s not a way to introduce new players a one of the core endgame systems.
People comming into +2 are not prepared at all, they rarely interupt, etc.
A good honorable mention is Bone spikes in ToP ghosts area. Caster mobs that spam 2 or 3s cast that hit for 60% of player health on a +2 is a bit overkill.
I understand it is +10 of old system, but back then new players would rarely start playing in m+ from +10.
Nah, m+ is just full of crappy dps players these days who don’t do any damage or mechanics. You would climb very, very easily as tank or heal if dps was any good. So funny to watch them die 10 times on 1st pull Rookery from the orbs lol.
why?
thr cast takes a big chunk of your hp, it doesnt kill you, what better lets you learn : “better interrupt that”
if it tickled people would just think whatever, just heal through it
Absolutely not.
I tanked up to +6 in ilvl 609 gear. 630 is totally overkill.
Floodgate is growing on me. I haven’t talked a key yet, I checked routers on keystone guru, but I prefer to (besides that) heal a few, and see what tanks are doing. Yesterday I had a tank made a skip, which seems pretty sensitive but we managed not to pull anything with it. Will need to see that again, he basically entered that first platform area via the left side, instead of taking the stairs.
I agree that people need to learn to interrupt and learn the dungeons. But in a +2 there shouldn’t be cases, if 2 mobs target same person with spamable cast - it just insta kills. +2 is an entry level dungeon, amd a lot of them ends up with 20-30 deaths. This is really not a fun and engaging environment for newcommers.
Old system was fine, we only changed the number from +20 to +10, but the entry levels is pure agony. You almost never had people comming into “old” +10 to try out dungeon for the first time, you always had already experienced people in lower keys (2-9 range).
Now we have people running old “+10” difficulty with 0 clue about the dungeon, and a lot of them don’t really know their class very well. At least in the old system by the time person reached +10 - he did like 30-40 dungeons and learned some basics. Now we have freshman in this level.
M0 should fill this gap (old +7), but since it gives no score - no one bothers doing it. You just get almost free gear in Delve+8 and run into M+2.
the only one that fits that description would be bone spear and that is a 4sec cast, if someone cannot interupt that then they probably will never be ready for m+
besides we have a lot of entry level for people that would fit your bill.
m0 are old m10 dungeons which should be difficult enough for those people and i would guess bone spear dont kill you there? i never actually did m0
I did m0s first week, but that was on a 625 toon with 4set and trinkets, embellishments from s1, and it went smooth. Sure, some wipes, and probably 15 deaths here and there, but you learn the most when you die to respect the mechanics.
I tried help a friend who recently came, and m0 was a slog. The dps a new toon have without the trinkets, embellishment and 4set from season 1 is insanely low.
I want the mechanics to hurt, a lot, in m0, but maybe the hp should be a bit lower.
I never did m0 this season. And +2 is an old +10, m0 is old +7.
I remember how ToP+2 was done back in SL and how it feels now, it’s completely different experience. People had a chance to learn m+ dungeon in more relaxed environmental, which they don’t now.
As a tank I can do several stops (interupt → disorient → knockback → aoe tauren stun → interupt again). But usually pack live longer than 20s, and people will start dying once I am out of stops.
With current tuning everyone in dungeon Has to perform.in past you could carry 1 person easily - now its impossible unless its literaly carry group .
No wonder most people quit doing m+
“Blizz made a gamemode where 20% of the people can’t afk - no wonder most people quite m+”
This statement sounds:
a) Intelligent
b) Stupid
c) ‘management material’ 
I’ll leave it to the audience to decide.