Seems that a lot of people reply without considering that augmentation’s extremely overpowered kit becomes a problem at top level keys… Saying stuff like “just don’t invite them” is a fallacy when they are literally needed to push the highest levels of keys. Being mandatory means you effectively delete an open dps-spot for every other spec in the game, while the game is already almost always heavily defined by meta at the top. However, this goes beyond that usual scope. Before the patch, the highest level keys that were done were literally 5 levels lower than the current maximum, and the increase from 1 week to another is purely because augmentation solo carries.
As of right now, the highest dungeon completed without an augmentation evoker is the 525th best key on the leaderboard, and that was done in Neltharus which is literally cheesed by doing the chain-mechanic (which means classes don’t matter) and due to that it carries far less weight compared to every other dungeon (It’s not until number 772 that we find another grp without an augmentation evoker, but thats again Neltharus). The highest key that isn’t Neltharus that was done without an augmentation evoker is number 845, and that is literally an anomaly. 99.9% of keys in top 1000 has an augmentation evoker in it (i didn’t bother checking further), and it’s literally a brand new spec that people have barely learned, and yet with extremely low experience with the spec, it has shattered the ceiling of the previous limits and is mandatory for pushing high keys.
It’s not a problem at the level where most people play, but all evidence points to this level of representation being a problem because it simply excludes and diminishes class/spec diversity given it is so powerful that it dictates which classes are brought with it (shadow and fire due to best scaling + utility combo with augment). You can check this yourself, or simply go and watch The Great Push on twitch… it’s literally every team playing the exact same setup and it’s not fun.
Just to note: I like the spec, but it is beyond overpowered and the incoming nerfs most likely won’t change that even a little - the utility and defense it brings is by far the best in the game and at the same time it brings the highest dps-contribution of all specs in m+ right now (might become slightly more balanced in that department in m+ after the patch, but will probably still be near or on the top)
The thought that our evoker can be desirable outside of a healing spec in 5 man’s, gets some very excited though.
I consider the lack of a tanking spec to be a cursed thing
Yeah, i am on my 4 chars about 25 keys in this week again and did keys between +8 to +22. I had 3 keys with an Aug evoker. It is completely fine for the regular player.
(and for the record, all the +20 and higher there was no aug or bear or fire mage or shadow priest in either.)
The flawed logic is that destroying Aug spec is the answer, is one spec being a literal must-have a bad thing? Of course, but ruining the spec isn’t the answer, rather, more classes need support specs, or at least support skills added to existing specs.
Support specs are an experiment, a successful one if Aug is really such a must-have spec, so it will probably be expanded to more classes, the big question is “When?”
You are playing in one of the decent Horde PvE realms and you are in a guild, I am 110% sure that you can make a guild run or friend’s run in a Mythic+ and still push without any problem whatsoever.
Sure Augmentation is relatively getting nerfed but it won’t change much since it is a refreshing change having someone buffing your damage up whilst dealing some damage at the same time.
My bet is that everytime they nerf augmentation, it will be by increasing his personal damage and reducing his buffed damage. It’s essentially a path to make it viable on the long run, because otherwise it will always be a balance and volatile nightmare that can go from useless to mandatory from one hotfix to another.
Change happens and it can be rough, they said there will be other support specs too in the future. Just chill, it’s not even been a month since the spec was intorudce. Meta and gameplay changes in time.
The support aspect of Augmentation is not even the actual cause of the current issues. The problem is just that it brings way more to the table than even the second most useful class in the game (arguably priest right now).
The actual dmg buffs it brings shouldn’t be counted as utility, since they are just the replacement of standard dps-numbers, and with the incoming nerf to Ebon Might in 5-man content it should be relatively balanced. However they still bring:
Incredible off-healing with incentivized usage
A shield with armor increase that is basically mandatory for being able to play Brewmaster in high keys (and it greatly helps every other tank too).
8 sec poison dispel
1min bleed, poison and curse dispel
An enormous shield-buster spell
20% avoidance cooldown for the group
Rescue (move allied player)
mana + 3% bonus heal/dmg buff to the healer
Low value raid buff
Movement cooldown-reset on 2min cd for whole grp/raid
2x knocks from racial + 40 sec cd spender that incorporates a knock-up as baseline (can talent to add aoe stun to it, but ppl don’t play it)
Can give healer a 2min cd version of shamans’ Sprit Walker’s Grace
Gives a hp buff that stacks with priests’ fortitude buff
The spec’s existence gives other players increased versatility by just pressing Fire Breath or Upheval, and versatility is the best stat you can give other players as a flat % amount due to it giving raw dmg and raw dmg taken reduction
Your personal defensive also gives the entire group 16% hp
Cheat death with the saving grace being a heal (so not as incredible as the rogue version, but still insanely op)
Teleport-stones at 1.5 sec baseline cast that you can give to another player
Your capstone talent spawns orbs - when they are soaked the player gets 10 sec cd reduction on their major cd (this is literally insane if you play around it).
Compare this utility to hunter:
Worst kick in the game (meaning the spell-lockout duration of a successful kick is the shortest)
1 min cd single target stun if you have a pet (so no stun for marksman)
All pet utility (for pve) is either a decent defensive cd + a good chunk of extra max hp or leech + bloodlust. That is honestly pretty good, but you don’t get access to any of it except the defensive cd when you play marksman since using a pet is a gigantic loss (you can summon and dismiss for bl, but you do 1-10% less dps for the first 15 sec of the bl duration then…)
Misdirect (barely functional for bm though, but for MM it’s great if used properly)
10 sec cd purge that takes 1 buff (so highly inferior to the shaman version with either no cd or 2x buff purge)
Tar trap if you care about the worst aoe slow in the game lol
Knock-trap (can very easily go wrong given the skill-shot nature of it and low hitbox)
Worst immunity in the game (doesn’t purge debuffs and several recent boss mechanics pierces it even if used preemptively
Augmentation is cool, but their existence further enhances the flaws of less fortunate class designs since they already struggled for getting a spot. It’s inherently flawed to have classes that always bring incredible value - regardless of how their dmg numbers are tuned - and then have classes like hunter that literally rely on being overtuned to be considered for high-end content.
Again, this isn’t an issue for the majority of the content that is done in wow. But step into a 25+ key and you’ll literally need to be carried as a bad class while augmentation can single handedly solo carry the whole group.
Imo they need to make dungeons 6 man on the future if they are going to keep the suport spec. 6 slots 1 support 1 heal 3 dps and they need to add more support specs in the game. Because the survavility that augmentation Evoker brings is 100% needed in a dungeon, besides of the damage that the Evoker gives to the party.
It’s impossible to balance a support like a dps… in 5 man the augmentation will allways be present.
Then, introduce demon hunter to void elves. “Demon hunter” as a name will still make sense without it being fully fel themed, because Void walkers are also demons
So only aug is meta? But aug is nothing without other classes considering they cant outdps anything on theyr own They do less dmg then tanks on theyr own? Cause it seems like you have no idea how aug works m8 lol
M+ does not restrict you to any particular role setup. You can go with 5 healers if you want. I don’t really follow why would you want to add 1 slot. If support will be meta, it could be played with 2 dps just fine.
What is the purpose Devastation evoker serves in any form of content when Augmentation is a thing? I mean Aug also does dmg…
You can’t change the identity to be closer to a DPS, cause you are literally making the class you just created cannibalize its own specs
In my opinion Augmentation should become a niche spec and lose its dmg abilities, and those should be given to Devastation instead. You can compensate by increasing the amount of buffs it provides, but in terms of damage, it should be very very low
But please, test these things more before you release them
I know this is a thread directed mostly at PvE and M+ keys, but as a PvP player I can also comment that Aug is also very oppresive in Rated PvP and makes many games completely one-sided