Ill cover latest Skillcapped video and comment 2 big points. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fhA9nZeQFxA
First big point of the video is about addons bloat in PvP.Something i think in the video they contradic themselfs by just pointing out how bigger M+ population in the game is at first place(And i can easily open a M+ player stream and see how they got either the same or even more addon bloat on their screen than PvP players).So it seems that is not the problem that stops more players entering and playing PvP.
Second point in the vid is about power creep/homogenization/micro cc of the classes.Here is when we see the problem,in the video they show pretty well how since Legion and itroduction of M+ Blizzard cater to M+ players while they make gameplay worse or neglected for PvP ones and i could even argue that аpplies for Raiders too(they got the short end too because of all Blizzard focus on M+).On top of making gameplay worse for PvP players they also put less and less content for PvP side.
From equal PvP and PvE participation numbers back from Cata/MoP (Statement from B.Holinka) up to current events and shrunken PvP community.
I know many things cant be reverted,but can we have an icentive for healers to Q up(fix MMR also) in RSS.I hope Blizzard could atleast do that and that will not only help PvP healers but dps players also,which will have to play their game with shorter Queue times.
They just gave you Plunderstorm and are making loot better for you in TWW. PvP is not as large as PvE, of course they will focus more on that.
Its been like that since 2004.
Except that lately they have the “PvP aura” to do specific PvP tuning.
So even though PvP is in serious need of some revamp… It could be worse… If it makes you feel better.
Dont agree with 2004 statement,introduction of PvP in Vanilla and ranking system,the revamp of PvP and introduction of Arenas in TBC and introduction of RBGS in Cata showed they had PvP in mind and they were making future content with PvP gameplay in mind
Plunderstom is a side semi PvP Fomo activity that caters more to people that like to collect transmogs than real PvP,it has nothing to do with Retail PvP
I mean fair, Plunderstorm had nothing to do with retail full stop
Still I think it shows they are thinking of PvPers are bit more than they used to. Perhaps you’ll have better things in TWW.
What don’t you agree? Skills and abilities were the same (same damage, same modifiers) for PvE and PvP in 2004. And that generated a host of balancing problems.
The fact that they took so long to address that issue (nearly 15 years) is what made the PvP community slowly decrease in time.
And the longer they realize that PvP and PvE are completely different modes. That require completely different skills and talents… the better. Maybe 15 years from now they will realize what needs to inevitably be done: Separate talent trees and tier sets.
DF had RSS… its a new feature from an expansion. Like the whole list you mention. And WW will have Rated Solo RBG…
But back to RSS healers and what those streamers dont get :
NOBODY CARES ABOUT MMR !!! Yish… I hate it when nobody gets this very important point… Especially streamers that live in their dumb bubble…
All that matters is Rating. Thats IT.
For me and many other healers to go back to RSS I need Rating gains to be divorced from MMR gains.
I refuse to play another RSS game if 9/10 times I tie with the other healer 3/3 and get 0 rating. Because there is ALWAYS 1 DD that is very good, or very bad.
And the 1 time I win I get 5 rating. And the 1 time I loose I loose 70 rating. Its ridiculous.
And NOTE : Im NOT talking about MMR. I dont give a flying turd what MMR does. Im talking about rating. Thats the # shown in my screen. The # which has all the rewards associated with.
If they fix that. Healers will return to RSS.
Not gold. Not “special loot boxes”, nothing. Rating. That… is… all…
That agree with,i could even go further and just Separate PvP from WoW and make it its own game.
Yes they introduce them but the gameplay as explained in the video i linked got f ed up at the expense of PvP part of the game(Since Legion and M+)
At this point you want revamped ranking system,which is fine by me.(Something like League/Dota and other PvP games with Plat/Diamond/Master an so on rankings)
But i still think there should be more incentives for healers/new healer players to join RSS and help out with Q timers for dps
Revamp? What ranking system? This is what annoys me. People in general dont understand what the problem is. Let me illuminate you:
MMR is the number in a formula responsible to mesh together: (A) matching you to similarly skilled players. And (B) based on the queued player base. And it does a reasonably good job at it.
So there is nothing to revamp there. Keep the MMR number. Thats where your “rank” or “skill” is.
Rating is some other number. Its just a “placer number” where rewards are associated with. Very simple. Its not your “rank” or “measure of skill”.
It exists because Blizzard wants to tune that number to give adequate incentives for participation, with out messing up the “matchmaking algorithm” that MMR is.
The part you probably know is that there is a conversion factor somewhere between MMR —> Rating. And THAT is what generates so many problems for healers.
So… remove the conversion factor. There is no shame to giving a totally independent number for rewards. We got MMR inflation already as is, which means that 2100 MMR 2 weeks into the season is a LOT. 2100 MMR 2 weeks before the season ends is peanuts. So its not really a problem to do it.
No need to “revamp” anything.
I watched the video.
And its the same exact problem that always has happened in every expansion. The only difference between DF and the other expansions are the Talent Trees and massive power creep of ALL specs in ALL content (including PvE).
But realistically speaking, they have always done this in every expansion. Designed classes and gear (tier sets) with PvE in mind (ALWAYS) and it wrecks the PvP scene. ALWAYS. Nothing special about DF.
Thats a bit too much. I dont think there is a need. But I dont see anything wrong with adding an extra talent tree that only works in PvP environments (dissabling the PvE one).
Just an extra tab in our talent trees.
Not sure how they can fix this,thats why i was thinking more about new rankings system.
Thats because of lower participation in the bracket and with that comes lower inflation overall.
Exclusive PvP sets hello ?
I would like that,but they will never put that much work just for PvP,lets be real here.Just imagine all the class/specs we got and how many new talent trees they got to do.
So what, X/6 wins is always worth Y points?
That seems like it’d cause a bunch more problems.
Isnt that gonna make it just pure grind and no skill ?
Easy :
6/6, 5/6, 4/6 win == +10, +5, +2 rating.
6/6, 5/6, 4/6 loose == -10, -5, -2 rating.
Tie ? +5 rating for both healers. And tweak that number based on how much you want to incentivize healers. If there are a lot of them, then make it 0 again.
Which means : Your rating gains are independent of your MMR vs. the MMR of the opponent. So you wont get stupid situations where for XYZ reason the other healer has 100 less MMR than you and even if you win 6/6 you can gain 0 rating. But if you loose 4/6… you loose 120 rating.
And leave MMR as it is. It works relatively fine.
OK. Corruptions from BFA come in mind. And many other instances…
And in DF although you got your “exclusive PvP set” you still have tier sets designed by, and for PvE. Ahh… and a legendary for 2-handers… Legos were NEVER acquired through PvP alone.
But why? How about this : Warlocks get 1 PvP talent tree. Not 3.
DONE.
Also, I can see how much effort they can put in Plunderstorm… so I dont see a reason not to.
What problems?
Like today. The more you play, the more you gain. You don’t get to glad level with just 10 games. You need thousands to get that good at it.
So playing a lot is NOT the same as “grinding”. Grinding is doing the same mindless task over and over again. “Playing a lot” is just that.
Same as in PvE by the way. Mythic raiders have wipes (repetition) and M+ have depletes (repetition). You do 8 dungeons/raid bosses you get more vault reward compared to just doing 1. The more you do, the better you get, the more rewards you get.
And in my suggestion you also loose the same rating as you win. So asymptotically you will still sit on some value. Except that its independent of :
(A) How many games you have played in the past. Currently its this way: to get gains you need a “win streak”.
(B) And independent of the MMR of your opponent. Today, if you happen to pair up with a lower MMR player, if you loose you loose a TON.
But if you just play and play, you will win as many as you loose. And asymptotically tend to some number. Except without the wild -100 if you loose 1 match. Or having to win 10 in a row to get 30 rating.
So its exactly what we have now. Except the rating gains would be more consistent and reliable. As would the losses. They would be predicable and surmountable.
Im sorry but thats really bad math,you get +5 for 5 wins and +5 for 3 wins/tie …that wont just work out
Its just a placer number.
The idea is to not get zero with a 3/3 tie. Because it sucks to be ALL afternoon playing and gain ZERO rating. Its very frustrating.
And that only applies to healers. An incentive if you will.
Its mathematically impossible for DDs to tie in RSS.
Isnt that gonna make healers just grind 3/3s without trying out to win more ?Just going for the safest way to gain raitings ?
And how would you do that with a guarantee that you will win / loose the follow-up matches such that you end up 3/3 with 100% guarantee?
In order to tie every single match you need to collude with the other players. You might be able to get lucky and pull it off once or twice.
But not reliably. Not enough to “grind”.
And even if you did have healers grinding the tie. The point is to have more healers isent it? If you achieve that, who cares if you have to give glad mounts to some of them that would normally not deserve them.
Wait what?Arent we talking about RSS ? What glad mounts xD
Sorry, it has been a while since I have PvPd.
Never mind.
Change “glad mount” with “inflated rating”. There.
PvE playerbase is much larger than the PvP. Ofcourse PvP content will be with less.