Ha, yeah, they did nerf the Honor gain from shuffle because I remember the first win of the day 4+ rounds would cap one chest(1250), now its 850 honor so not even one.
And yes I did LFR for the 3 chest for sockets too after getting most of my gear, I tought I was the only weirdo doing that.
If queue time stays at 20-25min MAX I would actually be happy, I kinda like a bit of breathing room between games, maybe to tweak some addons/macros/binds or take a smoke break. If it’s 30min+ it becomes annoying.
Ill do shuffle intill im full or close to full conquest, from there its LFR all the way n i dont even enjoy PvE, then again i dont think vault should exist for PvP in the first place.
I want fast ques myself, when i do PvP i want to do it while im focused n in the mood for it, with these que times every game feels like the first game of the day.
If i have to stick with slow ques thats where it feels like a chore. I dont want to have to dedicate an entire day just to capping vault every week, at that point its a mandatory activity. I generally dont do much 2s or 3s anymore either, after seeing the shuffle format 2s n 3s became terribly stale for me with an endless stream of copy pasted matchups. Thats my favorite part of shuffle, it breaks up those S++++ teamcomps everyone abuses in regular 3s n gives it more variation.
I still think shuffle should have 2 casters, 2 melees and 2 healers per lobby to get rid of alot of the extremely onesided matchups, i believe this would also make healer enjoy the game more since there wont be two melees globalling some caster etc. Beyond that i enjoy the gamemode when i actually get to play it.
I don’t think this is really true. MAYBE for 2v2. But not 3v3. If you actually queued a few 3s you would see that it actually has a lot more variety than Shuffle does. And in 3v3 you will see specs which are team comp reliant and otherwise are bad in Shuffle. Such as Feral druids, Sub rogues etc.
It’s also infinitely faster and easier to cap vault in 3s. A full vault took me about 1.5 to 2 hours of quing. And you get to win a lot more consistently because you’re playing some good comp for your spec, so there aren’t things like " i’m tired of this guy breaking my CC " or “im tired of this guy DR-ing for no reason” etc
Thats only if you have stable parteners and voice comm. But the same applies to the enemy team, they are also better coord.
So it all comes down to:
Do I have ppl to play on voice with? If yes play 3s.
Have all my friends turned casual/quit and I CBA to do the LFG Carousel? Play Shuffle/ Maybe try to enter some RBGs for cap.
I would never touch LFG ever again in this game, you couldnt pay me to do it. I find a huge majority of the people in LFG to be degenerates that i simply wont interact with in my sparetime.
I do 3s occasionally but i exclusively play it with freinds n currently my freinds dont play classes that allows for a half decent teamcomp, still perfectly fine to cap with of course but the things you described as a strenght is what i refer to as a weakness, i dont like how teamcomp reliant 3s is. Im playing fury atm, my healer freind plays rshaman n my other freind who is generally fine playing some arena plays warrior aswell atm. Double warrior-rshaman isnt a thing. Im not going to reroll something im not in the mood of playing just to play a gamemode i dont particularly enjoy for more than a few matches, being able to play the class n spec i enjoy is far more important to me.
With the playercount distribution its easy to see that about 90% of the PvP playerbase dont enjoy 2s or 3s. 2s is a slog feast that is the most one dimentional n tedious gamemode there is, i´d rather play LFR since the gameplay is about as involving and while i generally enjoy 3s the importance of playing a viable teamcomp is far too steep. Playing with freinds is a core requirement for me to even touch that gamemode afterall.
You don’t need voice for 3v3 unless you’re trying to push very high ratings. I was talking about capping vaults. If people understand how their team comp functions voice is irrelevant in a lot of the times, because people don’t know how to talk on voice anyway. They usually either stay super quiet, or keep saying things which don’t matter.
And that’s your own problem. But you can’t really add new friends without trying to look for them. Sure, you’re going to run into a bunch of toxic / low skill players in a row, but eventually you get people who are good.
Last reset I was trying to cap my Destro lock in 2s and had nobody to play with, found some Rdruid in LFG who enjoyed stunning people and convoking them, guy wasn’t high experience but he was a very fast learner.
So I added the guy and there we go. Was very fun bolting zug melees 30 games in a row.
Remember, there are people in LFG who feel the same way for LFG like you do. But everybody has lost their patience in PvP, everybody has developed a high ego and blames others. But there are still people who don’t do that and just want to improve and push. And those people are golden to find. Added about 20+ new people last season, all really good players with nice to decent personality.
To me WoW PvP isnt fun enough to justify interacting with some underdevoloped incarnation of antisocial disorders n inferiority complexes. its fun with freinds but im getting too old to use my precious sparetime interacting with people i dont like in hopes of finding that 1/10 person i might like.
At that point im just going to do the activities i know ill enjoy instead n play the occasional troll comp 3s with freinds im having fun with. This isnt in any way a unique approach to the game mind you. As shuffle has shown a huge majority of the playerbase enjoying PvP dont want to interact with the PvP playerbase and for good reason.
I think continuing to nerf shuffle in an attempt to put 2s n 3s on lifesupport is a terrible approach overall. A gamemode that requires artificial lifesupport isnt worth saving.
2s and 3s are very much alive. Just because you don’t like the gamemodes and don’t play them and don’t have many friends to play them with, doesn’t mean everybody else feels the same way as you.
And you wanna know why those brackets are alive? Because it’s where the true healer players go to for pushing rating and having fun.
Because healer mains generally have a lot more friends than DPS players. Healer mains are the golden core of PvP. So if you had a choice between getting spam trolled by low IQ dpses quing Shuffle as a healer, or quing a premade bracket with people who YOU KNOW will press their buttons and secure kills, which one would you choose? I think the answer is pretty easy.
This has been the core problem with Solo Shuffle since the beginning. It’s not just healer MMR and rewards. It’s the painful experience of being responsible for 2 random people who likely aren’t playing good enough for you win, especially if your spec isn’t a S+ healer spec.
In premade brackets you don’t have the " play good lose anyway " factor nearly as much as in Shuffle, especially as healer. You also know why you lost much more easily. Oh you failed a setup in premade multiple times? Guess that’s why you lose. In Shuffle, why does your team lose as Mage Hunter? Cause it sucks as a combination lol
If I queue my Mistweaver in Shuffle, I get kicked once nobody notices, people wonder why no healing is happening then die. If I queue my Mistweaver with some friend in premade, they will see I got kicked even if we aren’t on voice, cause I know the person I’m quing with has map and game awareness.
Yeah the gamemodes are “alive” in the sense that they still have players, but its less than 10% of the PvP playerbase that partake in 2s or 3s which i think is perfectly fine.
I enjoy 3s whenever the classes me n my freinds play line up so we can make a playable teamcomp, i dont even dislike the gamemodes at all i simply dislike LFG to the point where i refuse to use it.
To me its not a problem with how the game is overall i merely find it problematic how they keep nerfing shuffle at the expense of the majority to please the loud minority.
Overall if i have a comp to play, i do enjoy 3s more than shuffle by quite a significant margin although i enjoy the spec diversity in shuffle far more than 3s so i get bored of 3s faster. If they allowed me to cap vault in bgs i likely wouldnt touch either brackets unless i had a 3s comp to play with freinds.
In season 2 they substantially nerfed conquest gains n artificially hardcapped the MMR to make the 3s playerbase happy, in season 3 they nerfed honor gains to make vault capping much slower, its now the worst way to farm both conquest n vault if you take the que times into consideration which you kinda have to in this case.
For S2 they kind of had to nerf MMR in the start, it was just out of control in S1. Seeing people randomly getting 2400 Elite after being Challenger / Rival for 5 years was kind of funny to see. Was the biggest welfare rank ever.
Didn’t know about the honor vault nerf this season, but I think that’s a good change. Promotes some bracket variety. I don’t mind people who only queue Shuffle, but their view of PvP is very warped and usually sociopathy is on a whole other level.
Shuffle for DPS was never really good for capping vault anyway, in any season. Queue times are just way too long. And if you go 2-4 or lower, gg homie you just wasted approx 1 hour of your life for that juicy 200ish honor in the vault.
To be honest it’s just a waiting room for rated solo RBG’s, cause that will be insane for vault cap
WoW rating has never had any integrity to begin with so i dont see why people care so damn much about it. SL S2 was welfare glad, then we have a crap ton of boosted accounts, we have had cheat macros, scripts n bots, fotm classes being 60% stronger than any other spec etc.
On classic people report addons that tells you when its safe to que because competition is at its lowest n then the people instantly log out the moment a team that can beat them starts queing. WoW PvP is a minigame, people care way too much about rating. There is no consistancy with rating either. One season 2400 is top 0,01% of the players, the next its like top 5%.
By all means make titles n glad mounts % based again, i couldnt care less. The irony of the situation is that the 3s playerbase wants shuffle removed so people are forced to pug into their premades again n inflate their bracket, thats the sole reason behind it so they can push rating easier.
Nah, people who play 3s and care about improving usually just push their rating. The general reason for wanting Shuffle removed is just to be able to play more consistently and with more people.
There’s just nothing in PvP which comes close to as fun as playing a good comp for your class, consistently winning and possibly also talking with eachother having fun on Discord.
Rating is just the core part of quing because people play games more and more to boost their self esteem rather than to have fun. Of course it’s great if you can get both of those, but most people actually play for the first.
It’s like that for other games too. People fill in their holes in life with pseudo-important things in video games. Having high rating makes people feel good about themselves, because oftentimes there’s nothing else that gives them that.
Never had a love life? Low paid job / unemployed? Lack of friends irl?
Don’t worry fam, you’re R1 in WoW so it’s all good.
That is accurate, but its exactly that type of person i have no interest in interacting with because they havent had a job or gone outside in the last 15 years making them behave like 15 year old piss stains while in reality they´re pushing 30´s.
To me the only accomplishment you can get out of a game is entertainment.
What is entertaining varies from person to person, a huge part of the PvP playerbase only plays n enjoys BG´s which has quite literarelly no rewards at all except for 2 hours of “content” in the start of every season.
I want the game to thrive, especially PvP since thats what i myself enjoy playing but in order for that to happen we need new players to join the game n give PvP a chance, interacting with our PvP community is going to make any regular person move on with their lives which is why soloq is the solution to this problem. Add more rating milestones with considerably more rewards, add some step between glad and R1 n let people have some tabard that says “supreme super awesome epic glad” on it to shut those people up n then make rewards below that more accessable to more people, not the other way around.
Soloq isn’t the solution, it doesn’t promote any interaction.
The 2 real problems in PvP are how badly-designed LFG is and how complicated the game itself is.
I mean sure I can get a friend to join WoW and PvP, provide him with perfectly preset profiles for addons and custom weakauras, but how are they going to not get annoyed by having to get a college degree in understanding what’s going on?
This is also why there aren’t many middle class players in the game. Most middle-class players either fight the 3k neckbeards and get demolished, or they fight the 1.5k beginners and stomp them in turn.
And due to fotm things, inflation, etc, rating starts to matter less and less until the highest ratings. I can easily see a Shuffle lobby where 4 DPS of the same rating each play absurdly differently in terms of skill level.
Its a new day n age, promoting interaction has to be sacrificed in favor of accessability. Giving player agency to gatekeep other players from even participating in a gamemode is fundamentally a terrible design, one that has been exploited to its fullest since its release which is how we ended up in this situation to begin with.
People who shouldnt even legally be allowed internet access were somehow given power over others due to this system design. Never give the discord mod neckbeards power in an MMO.
I think solo shuffle just has to be toned n fiddled with for abit to make it a better gamemode. Enforcing 2 melees, 2 casters n 2 healers per lobby would be a great start to cut down on the extremely one sided matchups that generally resaults in 0-6´s n healers going 3-3 making both parties upset. It would also substantially reduce the melee trend of popping all cd´s n globalling someone n hopefully make damage more healable as a whole.
I think its important to note that people would rather sit 45 minutes in que than using the LFG tool. That in itself shows where the priority should be.
This only sounds good on paper, but can backfire massively because some specs are awful with eachother while other specs can be good with anything.
Let’s say you put a Ret, an Arms, a Destro lock and a Shadow priest in one lobby.
Warrior can technically get a 6-0 in this lobby
Destro has a 4-2 chance, because it sucks terribly with a Ret
SP has a 4-2 chance, because it sucks with Ret
And the Ret will likely go 2-4 because his only good teammate spec is the Warrior
Another example:
Ret,Destro,BM hunter, UHDK lobby
This is a very good example lobby where all the DPS except the Warlock can go 4-2 and the Warlock can go 0-6.
See my point? Adding fixed matchmaking class RNG could easily make things worse. There’s specs in the game who are just a good combination with almost anything like Arms and Rogue and Ele shaman and there’s specs like Affliction, Enh Shaman and Ret who are absolutely awful in combination with a lot of specs. Some specs need a chance to get their dream lobby.
I do see your point n fully agree with them, however its worth noting that statistically the destro lock or affli lock in this situation are more likely to get good lobbies where they dont go 0-6 by default due to the fact that melees are very overrepresented in shuffle. This would leave the warlock feeling terrible n the 3-3 healers equally upset.
Same way a warrior isnt going to have a good time in a fmage-boomy-spriest lobby.
I dont even feel like casters are weak atm just more teamcomp reliant in that casters almost always wants to play with other casters n struggles against double melees. Even mage tends to have a bad time in a tripple melee lobby. I believe changing the format will both bring more diversity specs into the game but also make healers less miserable due to reducing the amont of onesided matchups.