Class Tuning for 14th December Missing the Mark

I’ve got be honest here Blizzard, I don’t really understand your logic for some of the upcoming class tuning next Wednesday (14th).

I main Demon Hunter, so will begin by agreeing that some aspects of the class were overtuned, but the changes you are making to certain talents don’t really make sense.

For example, take this portion:

‘Fixed an issue that unintentionally permitted Fodder to the Flame’s heal effect to crit.’

Combined with this section from last week’s tuning (7th December):

‘Fodder to the Flame proc rate no longer scales with Haste.’

So apparently, this talent was bugged, and therefore healing for more than was intended. Okay great, it’s good you’ve identified this issue and are rectifying it to bring the ability more in line.

My confusion, however, stems from this further addition from the December 14th class tuning:

‘Fodder to the Flame heal effect reduced by 40% in PvP combat.’

So, rather than waiting to see how the removal of Fodder to the Flame crit-healing will affect the meta, in addition to it procing less due to it no longer scaling with haste, you’re also nerfing it further in pvp…before the Season has even started?

Surely there should have been actual testing done during Season 1 before such drastic additional changes were made to the ability, which i’ll reiterate, is not an on-demand button, it’s a random proc.

This, coupled with the additional reductions to Demon Hunter’s ability to heal themselves; namely:

‘Consume Soul heal effect when consuming a Demon Soul reduced by 60% in PvP combat.’

’ * The Hunt now heals for 10%/20% (as Havoc/Vengeance) of damage dealt to the marked target for 20 sec (was 25%/50% for 30 seconds).

  • Charred Warblades now heals for 3% of Fire damage dealt (was 5%).’

Is probably a step in the wrong direction, and if anything will make it too challenging to survive in the coming Season.

I’ll remind you as well, a lot of their ‘healing’ requires constant uptime in melee range, which is likewise hindered by snares/roots and crowd control; thereby by no means guaranteed, nor constant.

Honestly, I and a lot of the Demon Hunter community, would be happier if you changed Fodder to the Flame to be an ‘on-demand’ ability that provided a heal, rather than a random proc.

Overall I do not feel that enough ‘testing’ has been conducted to warrant such drastic changes as described above, given the aforementioned fact that you identified bugs which were probably causing the large amounts of healing/sustain that Demon Hunters have demonstrated in Dragonflight thus far.

I would also question why classes which are still very obviously overtuned, with regards to damage, such as Rogues (all specs) which can kill anyone inside a single stun, along with Warlocks (who are still able to heal excessively via Drain Life), have barely received any tuning at all in this latest series of adjustments.

Subtlety will still kill any class inside a stun, vanish to heal, and then reset ad nauseum, even after the proposed changes on the 14th, Monks and Marksman Hunters are still able to one shot numerous classes with a few buttons, and Feral Druid healing was untouched (despite every other dps spec having theirs reduced).

Please adjust these classes as soon as possible and don’t let Season 1 of Dragonflight drag on with such a drastic imbalance in place still, like so many other expansions have before it.

I appreciate the effort your team has gone to since Dragonflight’s launch to churn out adjustments, and am simply respectfully asking you to reconsider some of the above Demon Hunter changes, in addition to looking more closely at several other classes which i’m sure the community as a whole would agree are still heavily overtuned.

Kind regards,

-Nija

2 Likes

There have been testing, quite a lot of it, with set bonuses on the beta, which is where I suspect they’re basing some of those changes on. The live realm data, as you’ve alluded to, probably hasn’t shown much.
So… tuning made for set bonuses, isn’t that great? The active players will be running around with them in 2 months from now.

Just play Elysian Decree and wait for people to cry about that ability hitting for 150k crits. :slight_smile:

2 Likes

The healing nerf is more than fine.

Dont forget that your demon dmg is a really high number and you get healed by your leech on that one (50k heal without meta). So killing your demon will be roughly 50% of your hp with all 3 components (ability heal, fragment and leech)

But to be fair, at some point needs to be some sort of skillcap on that class, and this should be the survival part. pre using your abilities correctly.

Pre netherwalk, darkness, blur go’s. Abusing meta cc immunity or glimpse to avoid a setup go etc.

1 Like

Randomly healing for full HP on a DPS spec is not, was not , should not, and never will be considered good design.

9 Likes

I am a DH and I am afraid the nerf’s will place me in the A-B Tier section instead the SS-Tier.

2 Likes

we should make a forum post on the US forum to ask for another nerf

I’ll remind you as well, a lot of their ‘healing’ requires constant uptime in melee range, which is likewise hindered by snares/roots and crowd control; thereby by no means guaranteed, nor constant.

ah yes kiting the DH or WWMonk is so great if ur not a MWMonk urself

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That’s an interesting perspective, but even if it were true, making Demon Hunters too weak (via reducing their survivability too far) for the first 2 months of a Season is not a good solution.

I would also draw your attention to the fact the Tier set will not effect Fodder to the Flame, because ‘it can no longer crit’, as per the recent bug fixes Blizzard have identified.

For context, the Demon Hunter set bonus is:

2 Set: Increases the critical strike chance of Chaos Strike/Blade Dance and their Metamorphosis forms by 5%, and their damage by 10%

4 Set: Has a 20% chance per damage dealt by Chaos Strike/Blade Dance/Annihilation/Death Sweep to give 8% increased damage for 6 seconds.

At best, one could argue Throw Glaive (the ability designed to kill the demon from Fodder to the Flame), would be receiving an 8% damage buff, so would heal for 8% more - this does not warrant or explain the 40% Healing Reduction in pvp that is going live on Wednesday the 14th.

To address some of the other replies thus far - I agree there needs to be a skillcap on Demon Hunter, and would welcome a little more complexity being added to the class (I also play Shadow Priest for example, which is far more intricate due to synergies required).

My concern is, when some abilities that are clear outliers (Rogue and Warlock damage overall, Monk and MM one shots), have yet to be tuned properly, such drastic reductions to a Demon Hunter’s survivability are not warranted, simply because they were overtuned in Prepatch, and possessed a talent with two bugs in the first few weeks of Dragonflight.

As someone has mentioned, Blizzard had all of Beta to test Demon Hunters, so such extreme adjustments are over the top i’d argue, before Tier Pieces are out/right before the start of a season.

I also play Deathknight, and they have similarly had a massive reduction to their ability to heal/survive, well beyond what other classes are receiving. I would hope going forward Blizzard make smaller incremental changes, rather than 40 and 50% reductions in abilities, which are either random or require being in melee to benefit from. (Contrast this against the healing of Rogues or several of the Warrior abilities, which are just ‘press a button and heal’ and you’ll see the contradiction.)

It’s all according to the financial plans guys. Reroll revenue was peaking in prepatch on DH. It slowed down so they bank on alot of those demon hunter players now rerolling to the next best thing.

2 Likes

Now they gotta buff warlocks.
And mid season-1 gotta buff Evokers/Mage.

#FreeMoney

what healing? even warriors outheal us now.

6 Likes

Warriors outheal everything though so like… yeah

true but every class outheals ferals right now.

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Dh is the second easiest spec in the game after fury monkey and most of its stuff comes from stupid passives.
Very well deserved nerf for dh.

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Even rogues outheal us. Should get better after next reset. And yes feral/ret/spriest (only hybrid that seems to heal smth) / enchance should for sure heal more than the leech classes that dont use a single cast/gcd for healing like fury/DH/lock etc.

So feral damage feels rly good atm :slight_smile:

5 Likes

They should be happy Blizz didn’t delete them, judging from what the majority wishes. Now more damage nerfs please - so my soul could be fed a bit more with Demon Hunter cries.

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give it a few weeks

dh life cycle: overpowered at start > nerfs every patch > forum full with delicious tears from dh fotm players

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Oh yummy. My soul is hungry for it.

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Honestly, fodder shouldn’t exist on account of it’s terrible design, it’s a bloated ability, and I’m genuinely surprised it survived past Shadowlands.

Your survival will be fine with a healer. The problem with DH self healing was that you just wouldn’t die when healer was CCed or even dead, doing the damage of 1.5x people, and you couldn’t be counterpressured, didn’t need to worry about your teams positioning on a go, and didn’t have weaknesses offset by teammates. Now you will, and you’ll need more awareness of what other people are doing and this is a good thing.

DHs currently are monks that don’t have to peel off.

no need to read further lol