[Demonology] Critical spec/talent tree review

[Dâedra-argent-dawn]

[Demonology] Critical talent spec/talent tree review.

This is the fourth iteration of Summoner spec fantasy and third time when developers can’t objectively look at the spec they have created and see the obvious mistakes they made.

Let’s start with the obvious - the “new” talent tree doesn’t even try to solve issues that demonology had in Legion, BFA and Shadowlands.

Talent tree is not very well structured, if you look at the entry talent it is “Summon DreadStalkers” and its upgrade talent is spreaded all across the talent tree.

And we have talent like “from the shadows” in the felguard branch on the right side, while most shadowflame centered talents/spells are located on the left side “Demonbolt” and the Tyrant in the middle at the bottom of the talent tree.

And for some unknown reason Doom is located at the actual center of the talent tree and pretends to be a “key” talent while its functionality and usability has been greatly outdated and it only serves as being “relic of the past”.

The felguard branch deserves a special mention, because it works against the core ideas of demonology - Summon the demon you like and empower it.

And this branch is exclusively focused around Felguard leaving no options for demonology warlock to use non-felguard demons in PvE. If talents like

Annihilan Training, Antoran Armaments and Infernal Command would have worked with all prime demons and not just Felguard Demonology would have only thrived using flexibility of tools provided by the demons that serve us. But with such limited design of talents we are limited to use a felguard toolkit that may not be the preferable by a demonologist for different kinds of reasons.

The only way to play without Felguard is to use “Pleasure through pain” PvP talent for Sayaad.

Such design is one of the reasons why demo feel so stiff and outdated.

Demonology is the only spec in game that not only gives you something but in the way takes away something from you, Talents like this renders ⅘ of your summoning spells useless in the most scenarios.

And let’s take a look at the several demon related talents.

Reign of Tyranny, Nether Portal and Kazaak’s Final Curse increase its efficiency the more demons you have right now in combat. But Demons from Nether Portal are not counted towards any of the talents that I have listed above.

Additional Pit lord from Gul’dan’s Ambition cannot be extended by Tyrant. Pitlord has a 10 second lifespan and he wastes 1-2 seconds to reach his target, not to mention that he can be CCed by anything or LoSed. Which makes him less useful with his 3 min CD and very tedious ramp up mechanics

The Demonology talent tree is nowhere near to be ready for shipping in Dragonflight. The obvious lack of good burst damage from Nether portal, Tyranny or Guillotine makes the demo not a desired pick for the content.
Additionally the lack of Decimating bolt in talent tree makes doing damage with our direct damage nearly impossible, because the talents that has been provided to empower demonbolt is lackluster, and that if you put it lightly.

[Allotropìa-ravencrest]

I believe this is a very good analysis what s really happening in demo tree. Thank you. I hope they see it, and change some things, at least give back Decimating Bolt. Especially in PVP the lack of this ability hurts a lot.

But i doubt they do anything. All that (so unprofessional choice of) scattering the relevant talents all over the tree, the Guillotine poor design with aoe damage and no control (at least it could root the target) and many others you mentioned demonstrates their intention to keep demo spec aside. Pvp wise we are now obliged to pick only Tyrant and its subsequent talents, while he unfortunately hits very lightly. With 21 stacks his damage is about 4-5 k per hit. This is not exactly burst.

Anyway , they manage to gut half of my desire to play DF.

[Nestrea-silvermoon]

I agree with what you have said to a point.

@Dâedra-argent-dawn

This is the fourth iteration of Summoner spec fantasy and third time when developers can’t objectively look at the spec they have created and see the obvious mistakes they made.

Let’s start with the obvious - the “new” talent tree doesn’t even try to solve issues that demonology had in Legion, BFA and Shadowlands.

Now I admit i hadn’t played a lot of demo before the “changes” But I do like it now, I feel like a summoner of demons to a point, the lack of variety outside of Nether Portal is where I feel let down.

@Dâedra-argent-dawn

The felguard branch deserves a special mention, because it works against the core ideas of demonology - Summon the demon you like and empower it.

This is where I disagree, the lack of summons really isnt a issue for me at least. The Fel Guard feels like what he is your guard, he is the jack of all trades master of none demon. His skills do the job, he as a stun and taunt and some very good dps. What more do you want to be truthfull?

The rest i totaly agree, demo needs more synergy and thought gone into it. But at the same time needs to be balanced, this is where I think there having issues…

If you look at Demo pre patch, its been a roller coaster of buffs and debuffs then more buffs, most of shadowlands demo was strong, now its looking middling destro beats us and afflick as been changed alot but it seems poor.

To summ up I don’t think we can read to much into anything untill a few weeks into DF warlock balance is all over the place and times running out to fix it, so it will be awile before we get off this roller coaster