Forced to play Venthyr and it feels awful to play around a dot and your only goal is to extend it
Have even less buttons with the above points because using Blade dance is a dps loss
Have no control over your dps, if people focus the 1 add with Sinful brand, your dps is complete trash
The AOE is so bad that 275ilvl DH 3300 rated cannot beat 255ilvl Survival Hunter or Destro Lock on cleave
No one invites DH for 22,23 m+ keys on fortified week through LFG and I get it, why would they when mostly every class is doing better cleave dmg?
As summary, my favourite spec in the game feels so bad that I want to quit WoW after playing consistantly for 14 years because Iâm forced to reroll something broken in order to push keys with LFG tool and thatâs beyond disappointing. Have a good one, blizz
They buffed monk single target damage, which i assess was already the 3rd aoe spec, godcomp is now locked at monk destrolock survival, and DH doesnât provide utility that you canât have with another class thatâs performing better when you have to swap the monk. In my opinion weâre behind mage and rogue in terms of utility.
So pugging is pretty much dead in that key range, we either do have to get contacts who willingly will play with us and that means dedicated hours to push as a group, or accept the fact we wonât be pushing further this season when only pugging alone.
I donât expect devs to adjust DH at this point.
Edit : unless, play your own key, but not sure this is guaranteed success because of covenant restrictions and peopleâs mindsets on comps at the moment. Good luck to those who will try.
Sure, that could be correct, if the groups above 22+ werenât filled with Hunt/Lock + Rogue/WW/Mage. For random +15 keys, it doesnât matter what spec youâre playing and no one is going to join your own group as DH, if you donât have a tank and a healer friend. Iâm talking about pure LFG experience and obviously, youâre playing lock or hunter or you donât try to push keys alone to see the difference.
I had a similar thing happen when I picked up my barely played demo lock (and thatâs demo, not the destro meta).
The whole problem with havoc at the moment is being forced into the âextend sinful brandâ playstyle. Itâs made the spec into a one trick pony, without even being that good at the one trick.
Youâre hiding on a 48 worgen priest, I dare say you canât even do +15 keys
Okay, but Iâm literally top DPS of my group
Iâm not going to say Iâm the best DH, but my parses are okay and I know how to play the class. You can check my M+ history and see Iâm not boosted, takes maybe 2 minutes to figure that one out. My survival hunter is undergeared and I donât know how to play it properly, yet Iâm playing it better spamming a few buttons than a spec Iâve played for several years. Last season I finished in the top 1% M+ with this same DH, so at this point your arguments are moot.
At this point Iâm just going to report you for trolling.
A survival hunter and most classes will by default outdps a havoc on any small cleave without meta being up. Havoc does lower or about tank level damage without meta in multi target. Single target is still strong obviously.
OP is right to say havoc plays like dog poo because it really does.
Also you donât invite a havoc to a 22+ that you want to casually time unless youâre very confident on the other two dps spots.
You are talking common nonsense. You donât know the game.
Your opinion is just that - a wrong opinion that is not supported by data in any way. Look at the data and then start trolling the people.
And YES, you donât play high keys. I doubt you barely make it to 15. A person with a hero or at least a masterâs achievement wonât talk trash like that. Havoc is literally there if 23 key for utility or 5% buff to mage and warlock. It does less AOE than tanks by far. Even with meta and dot on all ads cant beat guardian in incarnate and BL for example.
I am not the main DH but I know the spec and can say that it is really bad. Already did 20s with it but it feels really bad. On the trash, you are behind tanks as well very often and the only reason why you beat them overall are the bosses.
linaori is doing 22 keys on Havoc, reason and explains the situation and some random r@ and amateur come here to troll him.
Iâm gonna bite you little clueless sh1tposter.
Lets take The Other Side for example, we have a dh on almost 16k overall in +20 as the best in the season.
There is a hunter called [Verfolger] that did 20k in 268 ilvl, compared to the 277 dh.
To find a survival hunter that did havoc damage i had to reach top 5-600, hunter called [Abhubeast] did our dmg in 262 ilvl.
So yes kind friend, youâre an ignorant cun7 by choice.
Havoc has never been so badly designed in rotation/dmg output as it currently is in m+ but most classes are poop i guess.
The higher you go, the bigger the difference. on +25 top10dh average is 16.5k, hunter average is 24k.
Havoc isnât fine, most classes arenât fineâŚunless you define âfineâ by needing 2x meta classes to complete higher keys unless youâre perfect.
All planned and balanced out blizzard style i guess.
Honestly i wouldnât care about numbers as much if the rotation didnât feel terrible. I can somehow somewhat accept it in a raid (and only there) but losing blade dance because a gcd of not casting chaos strikes can mean losing a dot that does all my damage kills my will to keep playing.
I think Iâd be a fool to hope for any drastic changes before dragonflight though. But then again if we look at bfa->sl changes all we got was 2 talents, removing the fun blade dance dodge mechanic, nerfing demonic and bringing weaker versions of azerite traits baseline. Iâm kinda worried that the class is just going to stay that way in dragonflight too honestly
Pretty much the same here. The most horrible thing of all is that all the abilities literally do not do any damage. They are only to support a dot, borrowed that actually does the whole dps for us.
Welcome to WoW, thatâs how most classes play nowadays with very little, if any, flexibility on builds due to meta. How many Necrolord Rogues & Mages or Night Fae Paladins & Priests have you seen?
Attack the person when you canât beat the argument, typical single digit IQ poster
Then why do you come to the forum to QQ?
But also
So you play better a spec you never played before than one that you played for years
Good try, but it seems the point flew about 100 miles over your head. It isnât playing Venthyr thatâs the issue, any more than playing NF was the issue in previous patches. The issue is being forced into a very specific style of play that means every talent choice, every conduit choice, every rotational action revolves around extending sinful brand. Season 3 havoc has one goal, and one goal alone, and thatâs to keep sinful brand up on the primary target*. Everything else is just filler. The same cannot be said of any of the other classes you mentioned.
*You would also think that a spec that has such a narrow goal would be exceedingly good at that one thing, but that isnât the case either. Havoc is good in single target, but itâs far from exceptional. There are other specs that are better, while also being significantly better in AOE.
Ehhh yes it can be said to pretty much every class, take Surv Hunter as example, what does the gameplay revolve around? Spamming bombs over and over. It requires full commitement to that build, legendary, covenant, conduits, soulbind, etc.
Nobody forces you to play Venthyr / Eye Beam build, you can play any other covenant with any other legendary and still be viable. Now, if what you want is be top DPS with every single legendary, talent, and covenant combination, then you are asking for too much.
Even you recognized that single target is fine, AoE is also fine, not the best if you compare to literally the top 1, but itâs far from being bad or unviable.
You all are just a bunch of crybabies that canât accept that you arenât at the top of the pyramid anymore like back in BFA. I bet you werenât here on the forums asking for nerfs for DH or buffs for other classes, right?
Yet again, why do you have to be the best at anything? There are 12 classes with an average of 3 specs each class, what makes you think that YOUR specific class/spec has to be the best and the others not? Why is your commitement to a specific build better than otherâs?
If you canât handle not being always at the top then play a class with 3 DPS specs which are less likely to suffer from that issue (which still to me is stupid what you guys are requesting here because DH is fine)
Perhaps you could quote where I said that havoc is unviable or needs buffs. Iâm happy to wait as long as it takesâŚ
Survival hunter feels horrible to play as well. I tried it because I generally prefer melee over ranged specs, but I hated how it felt and very quickly stopped.
The 2 specs I play at the moment are feral druid and demo lock. They both have different builds, rotations and legendaries for ST and AOE oriented content. Demo has a choice of legendaries (and corresponding rotational changes) that can be used in mythic plus, while feral can choose between 2 covenants, multiple legendaries, and a variety of talent builds depending on dungeon and affix combination, all without damaging overall performance
Meanwhile, havoc has one option. Unless you want to deliberately nerf yourself by playing something else.
It has nothing to do with being good or bad (youâll notice I play one of the best M+ specs and one of the worst) and everything to do with being shoehorned into one specific build in order for the spec to perform at its current capability. Havoc could be the top spec in M+ right now, and I would still say it feels horrible to play.
