Soo I have been looking at my spellbook and other classes and I feel like we are missing something. We have the amazing, fun utility in M+, being exceptional control and +% dmg taken when you stun something. But in raids? Like even warrior has attack power buff and hp buff cooldown. Why do you bring rogue instead of a monk or DH?
Because everyone has weaknesses and strengths. Rogues do not need more utility.
It would ruin PvP.
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Vast majority of people don’t play pvp and that’s why you have pvp talents to balance the mode. Besides, you have a lot of utility that scales or changes depending on content and amount of people. An example would be Defensive Stance, Devotion Aura or Lay on Hands. I have no idea how limited your imagination would be to use such argument. Every single class has something except rogue.
It’s actually weird comming from DK, not only battle ress but also anti magic zone comming in SL.
Vast majority of people don’t play PvP becase its terribly unbalanced with assa rogues every game, people are also forced into PvE to be viable in PvP. PvP used to be super popular until WoD>BfA ruined it. You can’t use Lay on Hands or Battle Ress in PvP (arenas). I’d like to see Subterfuge pruned.
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not in terms of buffing other people, but you are enormously tanky in a raid environment which is powerful.
oh i got knocked away and i’m about to die because of it? shadowstep, nothing happened.
i need to cross a really nasty area? shadowstep, didn’t touch it at all.
huge damage incoming? oh i’ll just feint, which is more powerful than many cooldowns.
one-shot damage or bad spell effect happening? guess i’ll just cloak, and now i’ve taken zero damage/completely avoided the mechanic.
make a mistake, don’t realise and get hit by a one-shot? cheat death procs. basically any other class is lying dead on the floor, i’m running around as if nothing even happened.
this insane survivability can also be applied more actively towards soaking nasty abilities or ignoring mechanics that would be troublesome to deal with.
on progress people make a lot of mistakes. it’s how progress works, everyone is learning the fight. it’s handy to have a player on the team that does not get punished when they inevitably make mistakes. fights also crop up where rogues make them considerably easier to deal with.
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Rogues used to have a raid defensive which was smoke bomb and i believe it did aoe damage reduction originally? Im not sure i didnt raid as a rogue, also rogue has tricks which is the closest thing we’re getting to raid utility which impacts more than just yourself.
if you want to play some overstatted class with infinite utility for all areas of content i suggest DH, Pala, druid or shaman.
Retier,
is Sub viable? Im gearing a sub rogue right now (442) just because it has an interesting playstyle/rotation. Is more demanding that assa which is face roll.
I find it hard but appealing. Is just that ppl say is not competitive? I want to raid with him as an alt but high level.
Thanks
i haven’t raided since crucible so not massively up to date atm. guessing assa is just better than sub as usual, but don’t know really. viable depends on what you want i guess. you can play suboptimal specs and get away with it, especially if you play them well.
assa for ST
outlaw for cleave
sub = meme
TLDR
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Raid utility as in raidwide buffs/debuffs - none.
A buff +Stat isn’t really that interesting, from a gameplay PoV. Having a solid toolkit, so you can deal with different mechanics and can improvise on the fly, when needed, that’s what makes playing the game fun. However, all of the Rogue tools are related to your own character getting a benefit from something, instead of the Rogue providing a benefit to others. This is kinda why Smoke Bomb should be made baseline, IMO. It would be a unique and interesting ability that can be used in many different situations, be it for LoS or even damage reduction.
bomb can be really cute in pve, even without the damage reduction, so i definitely agree that it would be a nice addition. highly situational ability that a lot of players would never use, but that’s kind of the thing they’ve been saying they regret pruning so who knows.
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