Yes definitely. This is why legion was great, class fantasy or partly anyway
I sorta disagree with this. Although some bosses are way overtuned. I enjoyed the mythic+ and the dungeons in this season tbh.
Ye i miss that kind of content like visions a good source of high end gear with Fun solo element to it 
But hey people love doing daily quests and collecting pets and mounts
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I think i did play it, yes, maybe far more than you think as i was the second biggest Azerite Farmer of my server, always at the same level than the first, who notoriously farmed island expeditions only in order to get over me every week. I finished the expansion with neck level 97 and the top world is still only 101 (yes some still farm to stay on top of the ranking of Wowprogress and still disconnect with their neck in order to be qualified, even at lvl 70).
Iâm fully aware of this Island expedition meta there was, but really, you never needed to do that ever, even if you did run mythic, if you were not part of the 1-2% guilds that starts mythic first week. Most people could, only with weekly stuff, get enough Azerite in order to already have unlocked their Azerite Pieces Powers, when they drop it.
This whole ââIsland Meta Farmââ as the ââMaw of Soul Artefact farmââ were just stupid shiet made up by the community to go faster than the curve, but NEVER was needed in any way. Anyone who think itâs the case just are either the 1% more competitive or just were part of their audience at large and projected the 1% player problems on them in order to justify their own lazyness or uncompetitiveness.
Iâm not saying that system was perfect. I think it should have been capped every patch at some point, but the concept of overgrowing power was great for anyone who liked playing on a regular basis. Now, I do want to go play other games as thereâs pretty much nothing left to do. For now, itâs totally ok, theres a ton of great game launching this year, but if this situation had happend during BFA, i think i would have just quit the game as i feel like every single change these days is made to accomodate Casuals, and removed a part of the ââGently Tryhardââ side i like in Wow that i donât encounter in other MMOâs.
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See, I get home from work, see if anyone I know wants to run a dungeon or pug a raid, and if not, just do it on my own.
Think I have sunk more hours into DF season 2 already than I ever did into⌠well, Shadowlands season 2 for example. By the time I was done with Korthia and Torghast on 3 characters I didnât care any more. Now the game gets out of my way and lets me decide what I want to do.
The relative tuning is quite poor. UR and FH feel like they are 3-4 key levels down on Halls or Uldaman. I do suspect this is intentional however; the folks who only want to do an easy weekly can find one. The people who want score and challenge (and BiS gear) can step up and find those things. Iâm not sure I like this design, but I understand why it is probably by design.
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I have no idea why you would put yourself through this. It was the same piece of content hundreds and hundreds of times - all of it trivially easy and overgeared.
And now youâre telling me thereâs nothing to do? I mean seriously - you could earn more power now than you ever could doing that by just herbing or mining (because back then professions were useless).
When I look at what you did there, I would call that nothing to do - and yet simultaneously something I have to do. Itâs exhausting. Itâs just getting in the way of the fun stuff. If you can come to me with some quests that can actually challenge my well geared character and reward some interesting things Iâm all ears, but this was not it. Itâs basically a scuffed experience bar that encourages me to spam gray quests - or even worse something like the research where itâs a daily capped scuffed experience bar that compels me to spam gray quests, but not too many and not too few, and every day. I donât wanna do it.
I was, though. In fact, I led one.
In both expansions. This problem came over me twice, though thankfully by the second time Iâd settled the guild into being more chill by having kicked all the people who werenât and inviting for chill.
Sure, but even if we ignore that itâs still a bad mechanic - and Iâll explain why now:
No, that would make it even worseâŚ
Let me tell you about the egg timer problem.
This is a problem that occurs when players are optimising not for having fun, and not even for how much to play, but for when to play.
The term originated from Ultima Online where they did a server where you had a 100% chance to gain a skill the first time you hit anything with a 30 minute cooldown. So what do you do? Well, you log in, you hit a mob once, you log off, you set an egg timer for 30 minutes, and you repeat.
This can come in the daily form. You have to log in for your dailies once a day or you fall behind permanently - donât forget the egg timer! And you canât do any more than once a day - the egg timer is on.
So what happens is people start running around doing chores. And then they have to do them many times on different alts as well, and they canât ever just finish something. If theyâre late to a patch they literally canât catch up - thereâs just no way to do it.
So now youâre optimising your reward for time - using the IRL wall time - your clock, to determine when and how to play, instead of just logging in one a character and immersing yourself.
At this point most people just straight up stop having fun.
And again Iâll refer back to what I said at the top - I donât want to do chores. I donât want to deal with this cap of power where I have to fly somewhere and beat up 6 wolves with a beehive on a stick once every two days - I just donât care. I donât want to do it. I donât care what your cap is, itâs trivial content. Give me something that actually means something to me. Something to discover - something to actually play. Not do, but play.
The reason the original game only had lockouts on raids (which had the best items available, notably) is that Blizzard at the time understood this problem and they didnât want their players to ever fail to be rewarded when they didnât raid, so they put in a bunch of expensive items to farm and consumables to use while not raiding and then the raiding itself was expected to be a weekly agreement with friends anyway and it wasnât a chore since it was the hardest content anyway, so there it was okay. There were no dailies. Not a single one. And when they finally did add them in tBC, it was cosmetics only. Itâs amazing to me that it took Blizzard 15 years to rediscover this after WotLK.
Of course they messed up by doing world buffs anyway, but this was nevertheless their reasoning. They didnât want the exact thing youâre going on about here because it just ruins the fun for alts or just players who like playing multiple characters or even just players who like to not play trivial content with a cap on it. Thatâs all it is. I just donât wanna do it - and if you reward it equally from literally everywhere and put a cap on it that grows then youâre not doing anything - we already have mechanics that cap on a weekly basis plus tons of things to farm, why do we need an extra one?
In simpler terms: The game should never tell you either of these things:
- You must log in now, and not later, to keep up
- You have kept up, you can do no more for now, you should log out
I want the game to be fun when I launch it, and go away when Iâm done.
I always this since the beginning it is a 5/10 expansion. If WoW servers were to shut down tomorrow you wouldnât cry and say âOH NO! NO MORE DRAGONFLIGHT HOW I CAN LIVE WITHOUT IT!â.
I have 15 days left, Iâll take a break 2 weeks later and then come back for last month of PvP season.
There are less complaints compared to Shadowlands about it, yea there are some complaints it is mostly related to not enough casual content and terriblly uninteresting story. Other than that not many.
If all expansions they release have this same quality as Dragonflight in the future World of Warcraft can never grow it can only go downhill. I see Dragonflight as an expansion worth playing 1 year out of its 2 year lifespan I see it as a good filler between my other activitiesâŚ
Shuffle que popped, brb.
Just tried to come back by subbing with gold.
There are so many systems that I have no clue what I am supposed to do, literally no clue what any of the stuff in my bags are and it just keeps pummeling me with random shtuff.
I made it a point to level up a new character cause I figured Iâd get to figure it out along the way, but nah. Just drops in with a million different things to do and I have no idea which things are worth doing (I did the mistake in SL and spent a long af time doing content that wasnât current and basically wasted my time).
Gotta say, the leveling was the worst Iâve ever tried. Scaling and leveling too fast made it so boring. Took me less than 6 hours to go from 0-60 doing like 3 dungeons and questing the rest. I think I managed to do like 3 zones? Elwyn, Westfall and Redridge and I was forced to endure DF leveling which is just so, so boring.
Nothing is difficult, nothing requires any resemblance of thought and I did do 5 heroics for that quest or whatever but even that was literally just some guy pulling the entire dungeon and killing everything and the only challenge I had was hitting something before it died.
This is what new players experience, like tf are you thinking? lol
Before you ask, yes I have done m+ in season 1, but obviously quit, mostly because they ruined the fun of my spec and everyone I played with quit shortly after too
Getting loot again. 30 min dungeons for gold is not fun.
But I must admit they fixed the +20 vault situation with the next patch.
I agree i did few islands when season 3 azshara raid came out and i unlocked my 3rd or 4th slot i do not remember precisely but i was first in my guild
I didnât need to do it at all because i was just doing HC raiding but like it was nice to have dmg boost over peopleâŚand people that didnât do it easily cleared HC raid like week 2 or 3 with us
I never had problem with BFA i did play whole 2 years and it was a LOT of fun let me tell you
people make it like it was worst expansion
but the m+ was AWESOME and raids were more then decent especially dazarâalor
The overall theme of the expansion with goblins and gnomes and war plus zandalari and kul tirans there was island referencing MoP
we did go back to MoP and even ULDUM i donât remember expansion like that it was as i said before Awesome and gear was everywhere
you had even SOLO content to gear yourself UP if you didnât raid you had high end gear in 5 mask vision once a week and that was again awesome
I do agree the game feels a bit stale.
Outside of raiding or m+ / pvp there isnt much solo content to do.
The areaâs that were great in the past to spend some time to play outside of afore mentioned activities.
Like Zereth Mortis / Mechagon with rares and events. Zaralek and Forbidden reach dont. Due to their limitations on rares and also their timespan.
The Forbidden reach was just too low on content (rares + treasures) but âonlyâ relevant for people gearing alts and for a very short time. Released at 21st of march.
The vault was an outright fail, outside of the stones for the ring, i didnt feel or had any urge to go there.
âJustâ 7 weeks or so later, 10.1 got launched at may 2nd with zaralek and all the new and shiny upgrade system.
Instantly making Forbidden reach useless because even the bind on account tokens are lower ilvl than what most dungeons can provide.
Making ânew contentâ so irrelevant that fast makes it hard to go back.
I want to farm some achievements / cosmetics from forbidden reach, went there the other day and it is empty.
Meanwhile, zaralek gets the same treatment because rares have this 4 day lockout.
So if you miss out on wednesday you wont really be able to kill any.
Mechagon / Zereth Mortis saw big groups farming rares every day, for currencies / chances at mounts etc.
Because of their 1 day âlockoutsâ
Zaralek and Forbidden reach just got butchered and are empty because of above reasons.
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For you.
Imagine forcing people to do for example pet battles for being able to craft legendaries. I canât imagine possible reaction.
Torghast was good, unique and interesting. What wasnât good is that people were FORCED to do it, so it got mostly negative response from players.
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Well that and the fact that, as a result people just wanted to get it over with quickly, so a system that was fundamentally supposed to be a giant randomized maze where things get completely ridiculous with player power we instead got 2 10 minute timed runs a week, thus causing the whole thing to fail because of the feedback because of its reward system. Oops?
For many. There were a huge number of complaints about a major feature of the game being so dull for most.
I never denied that some enjoyed it but they were rare to find.
I wonât argue with this. You are right about that, maybe WQ wasnât the best way to reward players with Azerite. Yes, it did create this Eggtimer concept you talked about. But in the end, it did not mattered to me at all. Doing rerolls made me have this realization that they were able to do content, get into group and perform reasonably well even tho they were like 20 neck level under my main and pretty much behind the curve in terms of Azerite Farm. I still had done MM raiding with them, without being a weight.
Iâm sorry for you if you were affected by it, but really it was not as a common problem, past the first patch, as the vocal top player did say it was. Most players could do all their goals without caring much about this farm being optimized, but when a top player say something is bad, the whole community follows the whining trend, even tho this problem is not reflected in their day to day gameplay.
I did that the whole 10.0 patch. I maxed Forge, Mining, Leatherworking and Skinning. And you know what? I have so much components i did not farmed once in 10.1 aside from farming dusts for Dracothyst and Enchant component to get an enchanter up and running for Enchanted Aspect crests.
I really hope weâll see component rank 4 and 5 and other original things like the Elementl essences (engeneering siphon), coming in the next major patch, else professions will not stay the pillar they intended it to be when they announced DF. 10.1 underdelivered on this and we then could sit on all the stock we ammassed during 10.0, which made it being pretty much a done content from the start, aside getting lucky and drop a new plan from the raid or having a friend droping his legendary on his Dracthyr (which did not happenned around me). Sad
I suppose it was like those mount farmers that logs characters after characters in order to kill the Lich King 25 times per week to drop Invincible. It was something chill i would do while drinking my coffee in the morning, while my group is still sleeping (I have the worse mates for that), before we go do some dungeons/raids. I did compete on this Neck level ranking thing but really it was just a silly excuse to have something meaningful to do in those downtimes.
But you are. Implicitly. I know you donât mean to.
This was quite a lot of missing health and damage. Over 20%. Thatâs not trivial. Maybe you switched a class that was better suited to your abilities or it was OP?
True, but this was because Blizzard massively nerfed the reward. It still wasnât trivial, exactly, but it was a lot better. And the catch-up rate became very high, especially in Legion.
So now we ask ourselves again: Is it worth it adding a reward system that just exists and does nothing if tuned one way, or gives insane power and becomes mandatory if tuned another way?
This is called meta-slavery. Basically people do what the top does because the top does it and the top knows what theyâre doing so you should do it.
This is definitely NOT a good way to play. It means you FotM reroll, fail to learn, play things that are too difficult for you, play things that rely on other players doing other things that, at your level, they do not do.
So avoid this at all costs - everybody reading this.
Oh yes, I agree with this. They really failed here for sure. But this is a fine thing to add, I wouldnât mind this at all. You can get what you want here and I can get what I want but the thing is I donât need to farm both so we can all just do what we wanna do. Coolio.
Thatâs fine. But do you want to put everybody else through that, too? Do you want to compel it?
If you do, fine - these ideas achieve that.
If you do not, find another way. The one above this quote is a good way.
Didnât have this much fun since Legion in World of Warcraft to be honest. Its miles better than BfA and lightyears better than Shadowlands, in all gameplay aspects, whether itâll be gameplay of the classes, raids or dungeons.
Wdym?
Surely you can just pull 4-5 packs together in a pug if you play a meta tank and expect everything to get stopped.
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Iâm just sitting here imagining a burning battlefield with 5 bloodied player corpses. RIP
It had potential.
They ruined it with timers, scoring systems and box of many grinds. They canât seem to add fun content that doesnât have an upgrade system and / or currency grind.
As well as not mixing up the layouts very much. Also it had little or no rewards (outside of the almost mandatory Legendary system).
Shame really.
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