I love how they keep on nerfing holy paladins and buffing all other healers (priests, r druids, r shamans).
You play at a level where any class facerolls the content. Why are you depressed about how ret is performing when you top out at 2.1k score?
You’re entitled to complain, its your sub but I find it absurd, at that level its “can you do a decent rotation and not stand in bad”?
I don’t know if it’s valid say a person is unhappy because they “do faceroll content” I agree the meta is stupid for 99% of players, however if some-one feels that their character used to have buttons that were fun to press but doesn’t anymore, then they should share that.
This is one of the more atrocious balancing passes I’ve seen in a little while. “Kicking classes while they’re down” seems to have been the theme
Not only is the damage bad the healing is bad we are forced to lose word of glory if we play herald of the sun that was not the case on the beta im not happy with any of the hero talent trees.
On the beta i could talent in to all of the talents except for the eternal flame talent and i was happy with that but come release the talents wont let you confirm them unless you have chosen every single talent this needs to be changed asap you are not taking my word of glory away!
Blizzard said these trees would amplify our classes not change them
How dare people who aren’t mages have fun!
Seems once again, to be the theme of this release.
I don’t know about M+ or raiding since I only get the rewards and then leave PvE, but in PvP you don’t feel the changes at all when it comes to the dmg.
We even got more self healing, after the last 2 seasons where it was horrible to survive on my own with negative healing. 
I’ve not been pushing any content, so cant comment entirely either, but feels fine so far. That being said, current tier set might be overperforming and we’ll feel these changes next expac. But only time will tell for that
At least Holy Paladins still have unique utility. I wish retribution had some unique utility.
For example blessing of Seasons could have also fit in our spec or some kind of debuff/buff.
It’s ironic that we have nothing really after we got so much in TBC/Wrath.
from how this discussion looks like, it is you who’s only playing a ret just for m0 and some world quests content and think ret is super mega ultra strong just because it deals more damage than your mage with the same non-existent ilvl. Hypothetically speaking of course, i don’t know if you have a mage.
How about before you engage in contradiction with ret players complaining about ret nerfs, show us your 3.5k+ pally main and then contradict and argue with people complaining about it
I’m in no different position from the OP, he doesn’t play at any level worthy of making an informed opinion.
Yet you call me out but not him - because you agree with their take.
Don’t you think thats a bit disingenuous?
I think Ret is the most fun out of all classes I tried since I came back from a 3 xpac pause.
Having skills baked into other skills is just amazing. Ret plays so fluently now its a huge + from how it was years ago.
I personally think the class is to bloated with skills.
Certain skills should be prot/holy only and remove the utility that should be healer only, like BR.
Ret should be more fanatic/zealous, more aggressive.
Mechanically, Rets rotation is fantastic, especially the templar at level 80.
However nearly all our damage comes from these new talents. Our main paladin rotation hits for hardly any damage. We are in dire need of a raw damage tuning because right now, talking as a ret paladin, I wouldnt take a ret paladin to a raid or mythic +. Just not viable. I dont need to be top dps, Mid is good enough to be viable.
Prot feels like a not a dev team has touched for years.
Ret feels like a paper melee in pvp.
Well got a rework, but I’m not sure it’s what Ret wants at all.
They have made some good changes but also bad changes they are ruining I have had to play crusade for the last two expansions hoping they would eventually make might rellevant again and they just outright delete it.
We never wanted crusade in the first place avenging wrath was once a powerful cool down no crusade or sprinkles required
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