Feedback: Holy Power shouldn't be a thing anymore

In Classic combat is slow, casters didnt have infinite mana either. We hardly had attacks to begin with and our choises were “do i heal, use a seal or throw in a trash buff to protect said seal”. It was a trash system from the ground up. One i would love to avoid replicate at all costs.

And mindfull about what? A priest prancing around mana burning you or a hunter draining it away? If you ran out in combat back then there was no return and you just died. The regen was slow and several AA hardly replaced the cost of a seal buff up, not that it mattered as the priest/shaman would dispell it either way.

With classic I mean from Vanilla to Wotlk, specifically wotlk in this instance, that’s why I talked about stuff like divine plea and other stuff.

Aint that a holy spell? Thought we were talking about ret here.

Anyway the question is what happens when one has screwed up the rotation or was outplayed here in your system. One would no longer regain mana and would be a sitting duck?

Why would this differ ones options from the current system?

“do I attack with my Mana or do I heal”

In wotlk it was a baseline paladin spell, 25% mana back in a bunch of seconds (you could dispel it)

No, since there where many ways to get mana back and the game was slower you had many chances to get back on track (divine plea is one of them) then you had seal of wisdom, judgment of wisdom and blessing of wisdom.
Ret had Judgement of the wise: damaging judgments would give you mana back and mana per second. So denying damage on a judgment was a way to counter it, using judgment in the rotation blindly was counter productive, you had to destroy the shields before.
But yeah, get outplayed too much and you are screwed, as it should be.

This is a fairly big issue with the simplistic playstile that the paladin already has. Its already vissually telling when we are bursting, using freedom, using deff CDs that are dispellable, using our “gap closer”.

It makes it way to easy to be outplayed so that our own rotation backfires aswell, its just another drawback with no bennefit.

With the amount of sheilds/absorbs (us included) ppl have now on short CD i rather not have to take them down to use an attack that does mid dmg.

This is not good design in any way imo but you are more then welcome to stick with wotlk classic! Doesnt it have your dream system?

Rotation and HP system is not my issue with Ret currently, its everything else thats the problem. Its stagnant and never changing. We dont get new things, we are the young sibling that get the old clothes others have outgrown.

The pony is the perfect example for this. Its a rouges sprint that we got in 7th expansion, a vanilla skill. But we are paladins!!! We need sparkle, so therefore a PONY!!! BUT we no longer have emancipate… for reasons.

Meanwhile rogues still have sprint and can teleport more often then a mage can blink.

I love the fact that this is part of what a paladin has to use. Feels like it gives the class something that no one else can use. I’m team Blizzard, all the way on this one.

hard agree screw holy power give me back my charges on my paladin shieldslams
if I wanted to play a rogue I wouldn’t have rolled a paladin all those years back in BC
The builder/spenderification way of doing things since pandaria have been too widespread, several classes and specs could do without it


I agree please remove holy power for holy and prot atleast.

For Ret i cant see why cant it be a mana class? Make the consumption of mana similar to a healer so when a healer needs to drink so will the mana dps class?
It quite bad today where everyone needs to wait for the healer and only the healer…

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What bennefit would this bring? Currently if you do the rotation wrong you lose some dps, with a mana based rotation and you do it wrong you do 0 dps while you wait to regen it.

This would make sense if everyone else had a mana based rotation and this has never been the case. Most casters have even moved away from this concept because it doesnt work while having classes like Rogues, Warriors, DKs, Hunters, Monks, DHs, Evokers etc that dont use mana.

Unless you are willing to force everyone else use the mana concept and probably destroy other classes/ the game itself to force this concept of downtime for no reason what so ever other then you thinking its weird that one has to wait for healers. Btw how often do you even need to wait for healers?

If you tell me that it works for Arcane mages, no it doesnt! They have another system that corresponds with mana consumption and for Rets it would probably still be named Holy power!

Instead of being called a lazy copy paste of a rogue combo point it would be arcane mage, witch makes far less sense.

Ppal is currently really smooth and button mashy with holy power, keep it that way it is fun. But holy i agree holy power makes no sense on, their spenders do way too little healing.

I hate how holy power works especially on a healer whats the point, give us a better mana pool and make it full mana based, kinda like in legion just remove the HP and make WoG cost mana.

Ret idk kinda clunky with HP but thats a bit more acceptable in my eyes

Imo its never been smoother then it currently is. Only 3 (out of 10) ret iterations didnt have Holy power and 2 of those didnt even have a propper DPS rotation.

Idc much about ret, i think HP is fine for ret but hpal makes 0 sense

getting rid of hp would 1 ruin class fantasy 2 ruin most paladin specs, Paladin already has a smooth rotation you just need to learn not to over cap and waste hp otherwise you will stall it .

With the current state of holy paladin where spenders have been weaker then builders for an entire tier, you might aswell remove holy power.


yeah that’s the most boring thing with hp, u don’t feel satisfied when build and use it because it does nothing more than other spells, it’s just worse for your mana or your healing. In some case it’s just better to not use it and that’s sad.


having played a paladin since TBC yeah I never liked holy power
I much more prefered when we had haste affected charges on for example shield of the righteous (speaking as protection)

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how would it ruin the spec? you have a free flowing rotation without holy power…

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