Feral ST concerns as feral main

Classes Druid
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So i’ll also post this here as I already did in the pvp section:

I would love to see some single target buffs. The go-to build right now revolves around cleaving with primal wrath, which feels very M+ like.

The bleed dmg looked promising again in the first 2 weeks of pre-patch, but seems to have been significantly detuned as of lately.

Rake used to tick for about 4-4.5k, which was about 4% of someone’s 100k healthpool last ssn. Rip ticked for about 3k.

Rake with full honor gear + every gold mastery enchant ticks for 6.5k, which is about 2% of someone’s 320k health pool. Rip goes for 5k/tick which is 1.5% of the total hp.

Sure, there is the talent circle of life and death which makes bleeds tick 25% faster, but that stil doesn’t weigh up.

These tunes probably were done to reduce the massive cleave bleed dmg, but with the result of taking a big chunk out of single target dmg.

I personally enjoy playing 2s, and I fear we’ll be far outclassed due to not having enough dmg single target.

Perhaps primal wrath could be a stand alone feature that applies a bleed that’s seperate from rip, so this bleed can do reduced dmg per character it’s on, and rip can maintain some decent value for single target pressure.

Or make draught of deep focus a talent, like so many legendary talents got transferred over to DF, so that those who want to do single target dmg can still do significant dmg, and those that prefer aoe get to use primal wrath.

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We do no ST damage anymore cause we lost the 40% Draught legendary. Bleeds felt nice with it but now ST is horrible without 2min Convoke or Berserk.

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Draught was only useful when there was only one target, and no risk of bleeds being applied to a second. As soon as bleeds were on more than one target, draught was like wearing no legendary, hence we never used it in mythic plus and yet feral was still topping the meters on ST bosses.

The difference is not that our ST has been nerfed. There have been no nerfs to Rip or Rake, only to the new AOE talents that increase their effectiveness on more than one target.

I did suggest separating PW from Rip in the past, but not for that reason. Feral was actually held back in AOE because buffing Rip to the point where PW did competitive damage would have made it massively overpowered in ST. The devs found another solution that works. Rip has never been weak in ST.

Feral slipping down the rankings in ST performance is down to 2 things, I think:

  1. A lot of other classes have had their ST buffed, which has brought them more in line with what feral has always done.
  2. We’ve lost Niya’s Grove Invigoration, which gave us a big chunk of mastery every time we cast Convoke (as well as a smaller amount of mastery at other times). Since our bleed damage is directly increased by our mastery, that means Rip and Rake are both doing less damage.

That said, according to your armoury, you’re not level 70 yet, you haven’t unlocked the full talent tree, and you’re not DF geared. It seems to be a little early for you to be making judgements about how feral will perform when everything is maxed out.

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If you checked further, you’d see I have 2 lvl 70 ferals and did quite some testing in pvp with different builds. If I wasn’t lvl 70 yet, I would also not know how much the bleeds were ticking for, would I?

In any case, ferocious bite did between 15-25k last (pvp) ssn, depending on crit/armor etc. That was 15-25% of someone’s hp (hp in pvp was around 100k). Bite now with full honor gear hitting another character with full honor gear hits for about 35-50k, again depending on a few things, armor, trinket procs etc. That is 10-15% max of someone’s hp. Quite a significant difference compared to last ssn.

If single target bleeds were ramped up, this wouldn’t matter so much. But now since they also do reduced % wise dmg, it feels the ST dmg us very slow, and I feel a bit of the typical feral pvp vibe will disappear.

I’d like to see rake and rip carry ST value as well.

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I like the feeling that in an arena I could manage to get good ST bleeds up on a dps for example, stun him, try to land a clone on a healer, and cause pressure when I did succeed to land the cc.

Now, it feels that even if I land a clone, my healer lands another 5-6s cc, I can take down 40% of someone’s hp with frenzy/bite. If the consitent ST dmg was high enough, that 40% could create pressure. But as of now, the weak ST bleeds don’t measure up to the healing so therefore it doesn’t feel like I’m creating pressure vs equally geared ppl.

Long story short, ST bleeds need uptuning

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If you’d bothered to mention in your OP that you’re not posting on your main…

What you’re asking for would make feral massively OP in ST pve, so it isn’t going to happen.

If you want tuning that applies only against enemy players, you need to specifically ask for that or your requests are certain to be overlooked.

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Hey

do legion playstyle if u dont play against a dh in 2v2, feral double bleed dmg is unhealable (19k sustain dps)

against dh, focus heal and do sl setup/ maim feral frenzy go with disc

idk if u tested this stuff, while u useing convoke, and without necrolord + Bloodtalons spell, but i crit against 320k hp people with 19k rake each tick and 100k feral frenzy

with the bite thing u are right against 200k hp peoples i crit for 110k,mostly, but against 320k hp people i krit only for 60k, its kinda weird, but dont forgot, many classes do low dmg now except dh (lol)

so i think they nerfed the overall core dmg from all classes, to make the meta slower, and not like shadowlands, so it seems kinda close to Legion, but not as lame as legion was

i never had the problem to get out dps, in my opinion feral looks waaaay better than in bfa/sl, and u also have more energy reg, so its possible to double bleed now

but dont try convoke build its more as…s than bfa ssn2 feral

and Clone is atm not worth, (with heal + dps) outside of 3v3, it cost to many points, and u lose to much stuff, alone the 6% crit buff is kinda huge, in a 2-4 min Fight

the Lunar Inspiration nerfe was Kinda to hard, but it´s still okay if u play Bloodtalons, the rota felt less clunky. and a extra 2.3k tick is “nice to have”

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Can you screenshot those 19k rake dots from details, over a bit longer game (1min or longer)? Because with TF (w/o BT) mine tick for 6-6.5 atm. Even with BT+TF+badge you wouldnt get 6k up to 19, so i’m wondering if that is a reality

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Hey, sadly Today i havent so much Time, so i Tried to find some Peoples with gear, finally after 10 Skirmish Arena game i found some, i wasnt Lucky with those Rakes, while inca was up, so i missed the Stealth crit dmg.

https://imgur.com/a/hfmOeSM

but in My Opinion it is completly fine, i do 45k Burst Dps with Inca, and Frenzy Band is Pretty Op with Inca, u can stack it up to 20k dmg each Bleed tick, Depends on your Uptime

I really getting barely out Dps, in my Opinion, the only Class which can Out dps me in a 5-7 Min Fight, is an Affli lock

I mean i can understand what u mean, but they Tuned the Dps in general a little bit Down, so every class doing less Dmg, except for Guardien Druid and Dh lol

BcGAYhlYdy9RJ6ROrphOEi69vCAAAAAAQkUUkIJJhUS7AiSSEJJAAAAAAkCAAgkkIJJRSyBSLBkAAAAAAAAA

idk, this is my Favorite Spec so far, and Dont forgot, if u get more haste, Your Bleed tick even faster, 8% haste = 0.1 a Faster bleed Duration

And yeah, many Peoples dont like Bloodtalons, but i do, Shince u get a Bloodtalons Stack from Feral Frenzy, so u Rake opener, Feral frenzy and u already have a Bloodtalons stack

I don’t want to be like a Copium Guy because Rated Arena isnt out yet, and Skirmish says Nothing, but overall with my pressure, even against good Peoples,

This feels way Better Than Shadowlands, i quit cuz it was to Aids for me
it was Like, outside of your Berserk Set Piece Dmg, u do Zero Dmg.

https://www.twitch.tv/videos/1671099517?t=0h9m1s

i mean its a Random Skirmish, with random Peoples, but if we only “count” the Dmg, it Looks better than Shadowlands “on the Feral Side” and i havent played Inca in this game.

So i wouldnt be Worried, about 2s u outsustain most of the Peoples by Bleeding Both Target, and do ZZzzzz boring Legion Gameplay, without Clone

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Thx for taking the time to SS and reply.

But those rakes you were talking about were crits I realise now after your SS.

That means nothing, crit rarely is a stat that feral will stack for pvp, and we usually float around 12-15%. Which in rare occassions, with a lucky insignia proc at the same time as our rake crits can lead to 18k crits.

But those are very rare occassions. 85% of the times, rake will just tick for 6-6.5k, as you can also see in your ss. That is just too low imo for a spec that only has 1 ‘OK’ burst spell being frenzy that does around 80k-90k at best.

So for any consitent dmg to cause any pressure, the bleed ticks need to be ramped up. As I said, I feel it would be good if they implemented draught of deep focus as a talent, just as they did circle. So those who want a stronger single target dps could choose that, and those who’d like to play 3s/solo Q can choose the primal wrath build.

I don’t see the disadvantage/unfairness that this could create so i’d say it would be a good decision.

On a side note, yes you’re right about sustained dps, but that’s 3s/solo Q, and it does feel way too pve M+ like for my liking.

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With the Solo que thing, i Agree, the Normal Druid Three is also Scuffed, u have to dump way to many Points, to get Cyclone.

so ur only Toolkit is Dmg, some Trash off healing, and i totally Agree, Feral doesnt Look good for Solo q 3s, because every other class have a better toolkit with the same Amount of Dmg

and the Aoe Rip Snupy dmg is mostly Fake dmg in Solo Shuffle Situations, on Details it shows a High number, but it´s mostly Fake dmg, because Pets doesn’t count at the End.

But With 2s and 3s i don’t worry, Feral + Disc is always in a good Spot, and had way worse Days/Seasons

And Jungle is anyway a Viable Comp

I know what u mean, but i hate this Legendary so much, u cant do switches, if u do it, u lose Dmg, so mby a Normal Buff to Feral Bleeds would be a Better choice, or Bite Dmg buff

or mby draught of deep focus in a nerfed way, like for Example, your Bleeds doing 40% More Dmg, but if u Put Bleeds on Both Targets, it does only 20% More dmg, instead 0%

So you keep half of the value and don’t get penalized as badly when you switch targets.

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