Frost dk currently is too dependent on Death and Decay in Obliteration build in terms of AoE. It lacks mobility, flexibility and just feels awful in general. Dear Blizzard, you already have an answer to this - Frostscythe, which you have probably forgotten already. There is noone using this ability, it just isn’t worth it, not because of its design, but because of its base damage. Could you finally review how bad it is, buff its base damage, letting people use it instead of being chained to Death and Decay and, finally, enjoy Frost’s gameplay?
3 Likes
why even bother better option unholy ever singel way
The recent Hero Spec reveal for DKs under the Rider of the Apocalypse hero spec you can find a Developer’s Note that states:
Developer’s Note: While not directly related to the Rider of the Apocalypse tree we know that both San’layn and Rider trees have talents that interact with Death and Decay and we’d like to avoid those talents drawing too much of the focus of feedback as we have some plans to alleviate the pressure of staying within your Death and Decay.
While we have nothing to reveal right at this moment we can say we have plans to change how Cleaving Strikes functions in The War Within.
I reckon Cleaving Strikes will either be decoupled from Death and Decay or be made significantly easier to maintain (i.e., casting Death and Decay gives you Cleaving Strikes buff that let’s your Obliterate cleave regardless if you stand in your DnD or not.
That said, I think Cleaving Strikes needs to be removed from Frost and Unholy, and probably even Blood. Death and Decay should be a proper AoE damaging ability, not a buff zone that happens to tick for mediocre damage. But if we cannot undo that, then there are still easy ways to fix Frost:
- Cleave should come from Howling Blast and Chill Streak, as well as from Frostscythe and Glacial Advance:
– Frost DKs have these talents designed for cleave, so Blizzard can delete Cleaving Strikes and leave Obliterate as the massive single target damage.
– Instead, buff Frostscythe and Glacial Advance so they are worthwhile talents to pick when there is Cleave/Minor AoE involved. - Full AoE should come from Howling Blast, Remorseless Winter and Death and Decay (and maybe even Frost Fever, it should be doing more than just generate RP).
– For burst, there’s also Frostwyrm’s Fury.
3 Likes
I read on another post someone suggesting to have Remorsless winter have the same effect as D&D. Which sounds so amazing since you gain your mobility back. Having to stand on a circle feels so outdated when every fight wants you to be constantly moving. not to mention pvp. The class is a joke
3 Likes
You have good points. Even I kind of like cleaving with Obliterate, it is true that there is a good amount of cleave options already which could be utilized for that. Therefore, Obliterate could be just high crit damage for single target.
If Obliterate cleave will still be a thing, it would be a good option that D&D gives a buff so that you can leave the area and still utilize cleaving. I was also thinking about changing D&D to an aura which follows the player, like the one horseman will have in the hero talents.
I do not personally like to use Clacial Advance as an AoE RP spender because how it functions and looks. This is of course subjective. I would like to see some rework for Frostscythe because that ability is cool but not used. Just making it AoE RP spender could be one option. Imo that would work nicely by side of the Frost Strike ability.
2 Likes
Remorless Winter could do more. However, I would personally like to see it debuff enemies, for example slow and stun. I really liked when you could AoE stun enemies after a few stacks. You can still do that in PvP but I would like to see something like that in PvE once again. This could be usefull especially Delves in mind.
1 Like
I would like to see Glacial Advance updates that most of all includes an update to it’s visual, and either remove it’s CD (to be able to fully replace FS with it in AoE situations), or make it passive that procs AoE from using FS. Picking a talent is already a significant investment, especially into a situational ability, so it should be rewarding to use it.
I am quite firm on Frostscythe that it should replace Obliterate in rotation when dealing with multiple enemies.
I hate how DnD works currently. I hate it acts as a buff zone and triggers cleave. Maybe with exception of Blood, DK cleave should not rely on DnD at all, whether you stand in it, or it moves with you, or even if it gave you a buff.
Let DnD be an AoE, maybe with built in slow (rather than talented), and fix/change/update/buff talents and abilities that exist for AoE/cleave purposes (Frostscythe/Glacial Advance, Epidemic/Unholy Blight, even Consumption).
2 Likes
If you are in a 5 person dungeon and the situation will be perfect, eg.: every trash will be same place, the trash pack casts and special abilities will be handled the other players.
You can easily build Razorice with Glacial Advance or Howling Blast, Decay, Pillar and Blast with Obliterates, but we know this world not perfect and something happening every time, because a 5 person dungeon pack not the dummies. So if you need to break Pillar Of Frost time windows with move or do something else, or just run out from the decay, your damage will stop instantly and Pillar’s time will runs out and you damage will decrease dramatically.
Other important thing Decay and Pillar of Frost duration not the same and you need calculate GCD, so sadly you need the break the rotation on the 7-8. sec in Pillar and cast a Decay (from rune) every AOE situation.
I hope Devs will correct this two spell durations, because this mean 2 maybe 3 more Obliterate in an AOE situation and maybe increase decay size, because if you need move but you can stay in the Decay, you can still make dmg.
1 Like
It is true that current DnD gameplay is problematic because it depends so much on situation does it work or not. It works fine if you play solo content, however, in dungeons and raids there are too often situations that enemies are moving out of the DnD area or you have to move out because of a boss mechanic for example. These situations causes always DPS loss.
I really like the slow which you can get to DnD via a talent point. This makes DnD a nice CC ability. However, this has been mainly useful in solo content and sometimes in dungeons. I presume slow can be useful also in Delves, will see.
It is a good thing that Blizz developers are aware of the DnD issues especially how it affects to the gameplay. However, I am not sure if they actually should fix the root cause rather than try to find a bandage solution… The root cause is that DK needs to rely on DnD at first place. Could it be better solution to remove that need and focus improve other AoE/cleave abilities such as Glacial Advance, Frostscythe or perhaps even considering creating something totally new?
2 Likes
As for my opinion this dnd mechanics should be fully reworked, maybe for previous expansions it worked well.
For example, if compare s3 dungeons where there were possible to standstill and spam obliterate without downtime, but in df dungeons it works really bad, where everything overfilled with different void zones for melees, adds have plenty casts which making you to run away and stop ur damage.
This topic was automatically closed 30 days after the last reply. New replies are no longer allowed.